07-20-2014, 08:33 AM
Loving red pants & pink tutus
Very, very stupid and amateur question: do skaters get a bonus for linking harder jump combinations together?
IE; Prior to 2010, Yuna Kim had a 3F+3T, 3Z, and 2A short program. In 2010 (and beyond) she had a 3Z+3T, 3F, and 2A short program. I know the base value is the same since it's the same jumps, but are there any additional base marks for linking a more difficult jump combo?
07-20-2014, 09:27 AM
Bona Fide Member
No, they get exactly the same number of points whether in combination or not. The question comes up a lot in the men's short program. Should you do 4T+3T and 3Lz out of steps, or 4T out of steps and 3Lz+3T for the combination? Same number of points.
Originally Posted by gravy
The scoring system has been criticized on this point. Some people feel that a jump done in combination should get a bonus. Others think that you already get a "bonus" for a combination because it allows you to work more triple jumps into your program over all.
07-20-2014, 03:58 PM
Landing 3As in my dreams!
Follow-up stupid question on combinations: I always just assumed it was harder to do jumps in combination. Is that true?
If it is, what's the rationale for not giving some kind of bonus for combinations? I get that it allows the skater to work more triples into the program, but if doing the jump in combo is harder it seems like "degree of difficulty" should be rewarded.
07-20-2014, 04:09 PM
^From what I understand, it's harder to do jumps in combination because you need maintain flow on the landing of the first jump to have enough speed for the second. If someone doubles/singles the second jump in their combo, it's usually because the landing of the first wasn't steady enough/didn't have enough flow out for the second jump. Someone with more technical expertise can correct me here.
No idea why combos aren't rewarded much in COP. They were plenty rewarded under 6.0, where doing a difficult combo was basically like doing a harder jump altogether.
07-20-2014, 06:27 PM
Bona Fide Member
I think the new Zayak rule about repeated double jumps is going to change the dynamics a little in favor of triple-triple combinations.
Suppose skater A goes
That's 44.1 base value (before second half bonuses) for a program that features a hard triple-triple, a 2A+triple, and a 3F in a three-jump combination.
Last year Skater B could counter with a much easier
totaling 39.2. Skater B is less than 5 points behind and can hope to make it up in PCS (she gains 4 points if she gets 8.75s to the other girl's 8.25s), plus skater A night drop some points in execution.
However, Skater B did 4 double toe loops. Unless she can upgrade at least to two double loops, she is in trouble without a triple-triple.
But Skater A's program is also at risk. If she doubles either of the triple toes she will lose Zayak points, too.
Last edited by Mathman; 07-20-2014 at 06:28 PM.
07-20-2014, 06:34 PM
Perhaps we'll see more 3?+1Lo+3S combos (or 2A+1Lo+3S) next season. A doubled 3S won't interfere with the skater doing two other +2T combos.
07-20-2014, 10:42 PM
Size 7 Knifeboots