Ladies Free Skate: 2013 NHK Trophy

Sasha'sSpins said:

I'm only just catching up with PBPs (thank you everyone who posted! - much appreciated!) - this is very exciting! Talk about nerves and pressure!



Poor Mirai!



I think it's perhaps more because Mirai has always been quite popular in Japan.



I hope that's the reason - but it's probably a little too late. I think she's going to get buried at Nationals no matter how she does. IMO the US Federation has already made their decision as to which skaters will be considered for that third spot - sadly I don't think that Mirai is in that group any longer. I hope she proves me wrong.



Love Mao to bits - but it seems unfair to hit skaters like Mirai with deserved URs and then to ignore the favorites mistakes.



I think she still deserved the win overall. Maybe with not such a high score, a PB no less.



In the end I guess it won't matter - unless they do the same at the GPF. It will be very unfair to skaters who put their best out there with no mistakes if Kostner and Asada also are given a pass on obvious errors. Hopefully that won't happen - especially at the Olympics. No controversies please!

Once again, thank you Mao88 for videos!! You too Kutien! You guys are awesome!

Btw, does anyone think there should have been a second warm up for the first group due to the technical glitch? I honestly don't think it affected Mirai myself. I think her mistakes came either from not-well broken new boots - or just from Mirai. I'm hoping for the first rather than the second. I'm hoping Mirai has much better skates at Rostelecom Cup.

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On the other hand in the men you do the big tricks and even without great skating skills/pcs you do well. And it i s just a coincidence that relative newcomers can get big scores in the men ie. Yan i don't think his skating skills are all that great or he has improved that much in respect to skating skills - his jumps have improved a lot. i would knock off five points off his pcs.

But it does seem URs in ladies is aproblem with Mao and Mirai. we are guessing but I am sure she wants to do "better" but Mirai's body ahs changed and sometimes it apepars the joy is gone - maybe it is in part age - a child has an innocense and may not know what is on the line. Now she is older and she is more sensitve to her surroundings, what people say and the pressures.

James R said:

I'm typing this while I'm watching Mao's free skate. I have absolutely no fear about final results being spoiled because after Akiko's scores I know what the rankings MUST be (actually I guessed the podium before Akiko even started.)

Akiko fell all over the ice and still nudged Gracie off the podium. Mao had mistakes and still sailed past Elena R. with a seasons best. Sorry but a fair result would have been Gracie winning bronze by a couple points, and Mao much closer to Elena's score.

Well let's be fair Gracie was not exactly medal deserving either - maybe they should have just awarded gold and silver the last couple of weeks. Kostner didn't really desrve bronze. Maybe they could give it to the OBM in ice dance LOL!!!!!!Wee

Why not just have all the non-Japanese skaters strap 30 pound weights to their backs, too?

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Well let's be fair. Gracie was not exactly medal deserving either - maybe they shoulu have saved the bronze and given it to the OBM in ice dance LOL!!!!! andjust warded gold and silver this week - heck Carolina didn't really win bronze last week so they could stock pile that one for OBM in dance.

Skater Boy said:

Well let's be fair. Gracie was not exactly medal deserving either

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Why, because you don't like her?

It doesn't matter whether Gracie or anyone else skated an Olympic-level skate. It doesn't even matter who has the most ability. What matters is who, rightly, should have scored the most points. Akiko fell all over the ice yet squeaked out a bronze by a couple points because of home town / Japanese favoritism running rampant in both her and Mao's score -- and also because CoP sucks, for many reasons, but in this case because it does not adequately punish falls. -1 is a joke. That's less than 1% of a top-tier long program. Incredibly disproportionate with the amount a fall takes away from the overall performance.

CoP also fails by failing to fix the problem which it was implemented to correct: unfair judging. If you want more evidence, just look at Mirai's likely +10 free points in PCS score, awarded due to the computer problems delaying her skate. Which may be a unique and even "fair" use of unfair manipulation, but is clear evidence nonetheless.

Mao -10 nationalism points
Akiko -5 nationalism points

And then you'd see the correct results: Mao (barely), Elena R., Gracie (barely).

James R said:

Akiko fell all over the ice and still nudged Gracie off the podium. Mao had mistakes and still sailed past Elena R. with a seasons best. Sorry but a fair result would have been Gracie winning bronze by a couple points, and Mao much closer to Elena's score.

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Why should Gracie have won the bronze? She landed 3 Triples. Akiko fell once, the same as Gracie. It's not outrageous that Akiko beat her, since she has superior presentation.

I would have put Miyahara above both of them.

Watching Ladies in American TV and Johnny Weir addressed Mao's win in Skate America and explained quite nicely that while to the naked eye there may have been the case for Ashley to win, but that Mao has such a higher base of skating she has room to win with a few mistakes.

Johnny did great with commentating the Ladies today!

Watched them again. Gracie had 1 fall, 1 popped jump. Akiko had 1 fall, 2 popped jumps and a turnout on a combo jump. So in a sense you are right; nevertheless Akiko had twice the number of visible mistakes. Not that that counts for anything under CoP.

So I'll relent on the Akiko / Gracie placement being blatant favoritism. I didn't bother watching Akiko or Mao very closely because I KNEW the competition was already over before they skated; that unless they had unprecedented disasters, the podium would be Mao / Elena R. / Akiko. Regardless of this one comparison of 2 skates, what irks me is consistent nationalist favoritism under a system jammed down our throats under the pretense that it would get rid of favoritism.

Mao had over 15.5 points over Elena R. One must wonder what additional blunders/disasters Mao could have gotten away with and still walked away with gold.

Mrs. P said:

Watching Ladies in American TV and Johnny Weir addressed Mao's win in Skate America and explained quite nicely that while to the naked eye there may have been the case for Ashley to win, but that Mao has such a higher base of skating she has room to win with a few mistakes.

Johnny did great with commentating the Ladies today!

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Johnny is very insightful and aware of what the audience needs. I agree he did a great job today. P.S. Where was Tara?

AlexaD said:

Johnny is very insightful and aware of what the audience needs. I agree he did a great job today. P.S. Where was Tara?

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She's in Russia judging Miss Universe.

Mrs. P said:

She's in Russia judging Miss Universe.

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lol for real? she can stay there, johnny does a way better job! he's so much easier to listen to.

James R said:

Mao had over 15.5 points over Elena R. One must wonder what additional blunders/disasters Mao could have gotten away with and still walked away with gold.

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We don't need to wonder. We can just watch last year's NHK.

macy said:

lol for real? she can stay there, johnny does a way better job! he's so much easier to listen to.

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Yes! She'll be on at 9 p.m. on NBC. I've never watched a Miss Universe competition before...

Also, this is so adorable: http://tokitama.tumblr.com/post/66469041959#notes

Elena is so eager to hug her idol!

James R said:

Watched them again. Gracie had 1 fall, 1 popped jump. Akiko had 1 fall, 2 popped jumps and a turnout on a combo jump. So in a sense you are right; nevertheless Akiko had twice the number of visible mistakes. Not that that counts for anything under CoP.

So I'll relent on the Akiko / Gracie placement being blatant favoritism. I didn't bother watching Akiko or Mao very closely because I KNEW the competition was already over before they skated; that unless they had unprecedented disasters, the podium would be Mao / Elena R. / Akiko. Regardless of this one comparison of 2 skates, what irks me is consistent nationalist favoritism under a system jammed down our throats under the pretense that it would get rid of favoritism.

Mao had over 15.5 points over Elena R. One must wonder what additional blunders/disasters Mao could have gotten away with and still walked away with gold.

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What disasters?????

James R said:

Watched them again. Gracie had 1 fall, 1 popped jump. Akiko had 1 fall, 2 popped jumps and a turnout on a combo jump. So in a sense you are right; nevertheless Akiko had twice the number of visible mistakes. Not that that counts for anything under CoP.

So I'll relent on the Akiko / Gracie placement being blatant favoritism. I didn't bother watching Akiko or Mao very closely because I KNEW the competition was already over before they skated; that unless they had unprecedented disasters, the podium would be Mao / Elena R. / Akiko. Regardless of this one comparison of 2 skates, what irks me is consistent nationalist favoritism under a system jammed down our throats under the pretense that it would get rid of favoritism.

Mao had over 15.5 points over Elena R. One must wonder what additional blunders/disasters Mao could have gotten away with and still walked away with gold.

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So you're crying wuz robbing for Gracie Gold and "blatant favoritism" in favor of Asada and Suzuki, yet you admit to not watching the skating of Mao and Akiko very closely. Well, if you had bothered to watch their skating closely, you should have easily noticed that the basic skating, choreography, and musical interpretation of the immature Gracie Gold and Elena Radionova don't come close to holding a candle to that of Mao Asada and Akiko Suzuki, who were both rewarded in the PCS mark for their greater maturity. The scores for Mao and Akiko were fully deserved. Radionova was rewarded with the silver for keeping her head together on the technical elements. Gold once again faltered on the technical elements and as a result, she deservedly finished off the podium. Mentally, Gracie has not proven to be a consistently strong competitor. There is absolutely no conspiracy despite your weak attempts to create one.

On the topic of Elena, I've been figuring out how likely she is to get to the GP Finals. Turns out that it's quite likely, at this point...

First of all, I'll say that Lipnitskaia and Pogorilaya are pretty much guaranteed to go ahead of Radionova. They'd need to place 5th for her to pass her - This just isn't likely. This means that Radionova would be 4th, so 2 more people would be allowed to pass her. Ashley Wagner has an extremely high chance of going to GPFs, as well. As long as she places in the top 3 with around 182 points(very doable for her), she'll beat Radionova in the tiebreakers. The GP is pretty weak, so this should be no issue at all. A more interesting one would be Sotnikova, in the same GP as Wagner and Pogorilaya, and no other real contenders. Radionova would love for Sotnikova to place 3rd here, because Sotnikova has no chance of beating her in the point tiebreaker. This also is a very possible result - Pogorilaya already beat Sotnikova once and I feel that Wagner is a clear favorite against Sotnikova as well. Sotnikova placing in top 2 would pretty much be the worst possible result for Radionova, meaning that she cannot let any participant of the Rostelecom Cup pass her at that point.

Luckily for her, Rostelecom Cup doesn't have that many ladies threatening her. Lipnitskaia is looking extremely strong, and this would help Radionova out quite a bit - If Lipnitskaia wins, Kostner would require an enormous score of over 200 points to stand a chance against Radionova in the tiebreaker. This would mean that Kostner pretty much has to win, and it'll be tough against Lipnitskaia who's looking rock solid and who will also likely have some friendly homefield score inflation on her side as well. Tuktamysheva would require a win here. It's quite a long shot, and she would likely require Lipnitskaia and Kostner to fail at least somewhat, but it's still possible. If Lipnitskaia wins, Radionova is through.

In short: If Sotnikova isn't top 2(and doesn't somehow score 200++ while placing out of top 2 zzz), Radionova is in the Grand Prix finals UNLESS Tuktamysheva wins and Kostner is second with over 202.36 points(so guaranteed GPF for all intends and purposes) in Rostelecom.

If Sotnikova is top 2, Radionova is advancing to GP Finals if Tuktamysheva or Kostner don't win, and Kostner isn't second with over 202.36 points. Basically it would come down to "will Lipnitskaia win or not?", although if someone else(like Mirai Nagasu) won, Radionova would advance to the GP Finals as well. Note that at their current forms I think it's extremely unlikely for either Tuktamysheva or Kostner to defeat Lipnitskaia, especially considering that I believe that Lipnitskaia will get a slightly inflated score on her home field.

James R said:

Mao had over 15.5 points over Elena R. One must wonder what additional blunders/disasters Mao could have gotten away with and still walked away with gold.

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Radionova skated brilliantly and edged Asada in TES in the free skate.

But Asada is in a class by herself. Absent Kim, no one can come within ten points of her.

Mathman said:

Radionova skated brilliantly and edged Asada in TES in the free skate.

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Yeah, by 1 point even though she skated brilliantly and Asada had plenty of underrotated jumps she didn't get any punishment for.

museksk8r said:

So you're crying wuz robbing for Gracie Gold and "blatant favoritism" in favor of Asada and Suzuki, yet you admit to not watching the skating of Mao and Akiko very closely.

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Yep. Because I like skating competitions.

When I know the results in advance - again NOT from spoilers, since I worked very hard to avoid spoilers, but from the simple fact that I knew Mao & Akiko's skills combined with judging favoritism would ensure their placements - that just isn't interesting to watch. At all.

Mao is my 2nd favorite Japanese skater. One of us is taking stances against skaters, rather than against unfair judging. Hint - it's not me.

museksk8r said:

The scores for Mao and Akiko were fully deserved.

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The majority of people here would disagree with you, at least with regard to Mao's score. The judges clearly gave her a pass on URs. Again.

James R said:

Yep. Because I like skating competitions.

When I know the results in advance - again NOT from spoilers, since I worked very hard to avoid spoilers, but from the simple fact that I knew Mao & Akiko's skills combined with judging favoritism would ensure their placements - that just isn't interesting to watch. At all.




Mao is my 2nd favorite Japanese skater. One of us is taking stances against skaters, rather than against unfair judging. Hint - it's not me.



The majority of people here would disagree with you, at least with regard to Mao's score. The judges clearly gave her a pass on URs. Again.

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Such outrage!!! But I think since the tech specialists were there I will take theirs calls over your calls. Take it easy because getting so angry over a skating event is not healthy

David21 said:

Yeah, by 1 point even though she skated brilliantly and Asada had plenty of underrotated jumps she didn't get any punishment for.

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The outcome would not have changed if mao got called for more ur. She was 11 points ahead elena

Mao could have lost the LP if the scores were more fair. Her PCS were 6 points too high, IMO.