- Joined
- Feb 27, 2012
I don't think that's anything to laugh at, and I don't think their Finlandia scores are a fair comparison at the moment. That was an early season senior B. I think a more fair off home soil comparison score will be TEB.
Free Dance: 2013 NHK Trophy
- Thread starter Finnstep
- Start date
I don't think that's anything to laugh at, and I don't think their Finlandia scores are a fair comparison at the moment. That was an early season senior B. I think a more fair off home soil comparison score will be TEB.
Davis and white SD/FD score OFF home soil: 73.70/112.95
Virtue and Moir SD/FD score OFF home soil: 67.23/100.64
Oh boy, run for your sanity the silliness has begun. But seriously guys I need a link for the gala, anyone?
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- Jan 28, 2013
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TontoK , actually don't quote me on the Dean connection. I read it on FSU but I just tried to confirm it and could only find Dean mentioned in articles about their 2012 FD, hmm.
No worries, Caitie.
Well, whoever did assist with the choreography did an amazing job. I enjoyed that program very much, precisely because it was so different.
- Joined
- Sep 12, 2013
Me too! dying to watch the gala.
Falling behind shibutanis again really mean I/k nned to change a lot or if they or one don't care anymore to retire. The team might be finished and humiliated after falling behind the shibutanis yet agian. Disgraceful levels of steps and spins. I/k may be done and finished forever.
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- Sep 14, 2008
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Yeah, you said that already.
I actually said It first here! Lol. But it deserves a thread because here you had a team that was good but since worlds 2013 are doing awfully and embarrassing themselves..
You must be blind. Barring D/W the two performances that stood out in dancing were theirs. We have never seen them this ready at the start of the season. Anyways why the concern if you don't like them why not pay attention to the ones you like. Why the need to pulverize? There is no need to go off on this tangent. Hate doesn't look good in any form!
oops. got the time wrong and missed the free dance. but honestly, of all the disciplines, ice dance is the one that catching it after the fact is not a big deal ("whaaat? D/W won by a large margin?!?! i would never have suspected this result!")
anyways it sounds like there was some good performances today. i look forward to the videos
anyways it sounds like there was some good performances today. i look forward to the videos
- Joined
- Mar 9, 2011
FREE DANCE - VIDEOS (By Starting Order)
Warm-Up Group 1
1. Victoria SINITSINA / Ruslan ZHIGANSHIN (RUS) Free Dance, 2nd Copy
2. Cathy REED / Chris REED (JPN) Free Dance, 2nd Copy
3. Tanja KOLBE / Stefano CARUSO (GER) Free Dance, 2nd Copy
4. Piper GILLES / Paul POIRIER (CAN) Free Dance, 2nd Copy
Warm-Up Group 2
5. Elena ILINYKH / Nikita KATSALAPOV (RUS) Free Dance, 2nd Copy, 3rd Copy
6. Maia SHIBUTANI / Alex SHIBUTANI (USA) Free Dance, 2nd Copy, 3rd Copy
7. Anna CAPPELLINI / Luca LANOTTE (ITA) Free Dance, 2nd Copy, 3rd Copy
8. Meryl DAVIS / Charlie WHITE (USA) Free Dance, 2nd Copy, 3rd Copy, 4th Copy, Interview
Medal Ceremony
RESULT
Overall Result, Segment Result, Protocols
Warm-Up Group 1
1. Victoria SINITSINA / Ruslan ZHIGANSHIN (RUS) Free Dance, 2nd Copy
2. Cathy REED / Chris REED (JPN) Free Dance, 2nd Copy
3. Tanja KOLBE / Stefano CARUSO (GER) Free Dance, 2nd Copy
4. Piper GILLES / Paul POIRIER (CAN) Free Dance, 2nd Copy
Warm-Up Group 2
5. Elena ILINYKH / Nikita KATSALAPOV (RUS) Free Dance, 2nd Copy, 3rd Copy
6. Maia SHIBUTANI / Alex SHIBUTANI (USA) Free Dance, 2nd Copy, 3rd Copy
7. Anna CAPPELLINI / Luca LANOTTE (ITA) Free Dance, 2nd Copy, 3rd Copy
8. Meryl DAVIS / Charlie WHITE (USA) Free Dance, 2nd Copy, 3rd Copy, 4th Copy, Interview
Medal Ceremony
RESULT
Overall Result, Segment Result, Protocols
Well, I mean Finlandia was V/M's season debut (and they had some visible errors there to boot), so I don't really think that's fair. Their FD is def worth more than 100 on any ice.
TontoK , actually don't quote me on the Dean connection. I read it on FSU but I just tried to confirm it and could only find Dean mentioned in articles about their 2012 FD, hmm.
Actually, Christopher Dean had nothing to do with this program at all, it was choreographed by their coaches Carol Lane and Juris Razgulajevs shortly before Paul broke his leg.
- Joined
- Aug 1, 2011
This makes me laugh every time I read it. Thank you!
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2012
some thoughts, I've watched only Elena/Nikita, Gilles/Poirier and Davis/White for this moment ( after last two nights with waking up so early I overslept for ice dance fd's...
) and sorry as always for the lenght
Elena/Nikita - firts of all I think they should do programs like that - to maybe overused pieces but with some dramatic, characteristic storyline, because their last two season's free dances made me shivers and no in a good way unfortunately...They are exquisite on ice - have great presence, character, good ice coverage imo, but their potential was (and for me still is) not used and shown in 100%. Music is suprisingly well-connected with choreo, which is quite good itself (I'm suprised in a good way, because Morozov's arrangements of movements for this couple always made me scream for help...I just don't understand - he was coaching an ukrainian couple who gained bronze in Torino and I remember that some of their choreographies were fantastic, especially for original dances), the elements are at least better than previous seasons - lifts are amazing and if they will be all executed well along with the other elements ofc, this dance would be mindblowing for me. Now I see they captured the feeling, the essence of this music and I see they try to express drama, love, passion, anger and other emotions and that's the attitude which I like for dance couples. Even with weak technically step sequences they shown much more character than Davis/White - I see the chemistry between them, some artistic spark which may not be get from great technique but form the fact that when they dance, they put not only their bodies into choreography but also their minds and feelings. I always have some doubts when ice dancers picked overused, popular music with well-known story interpreted by thousands artists - I have them there also, but after watching it I'm interested and I'm strating to get into their story. One last thought about costumes - they looked fabulous, but please Elena get out off your beautiful head this tacky plastic tiara and put there a headband which you had on practice session!
Davis/White - in my post at SA FD thread I wrote about my feelings about this FD and my opinion isn't changed - they are almost perfect technically already, this perfection gives them monstreous PCS score, this can't be denied. But this performance leaves me once again with feeling of well- executed program and nothing more, while in comparision Elena/Nikita and especially Piper and Paul (about them I'll write below) interested me with their dances, not only programs treated as "some choreo put along with some music". As I said execution and technical level, sharpness, speed are incredible - in that scoring system this is almost everything, because if you're a good technician, performance is good also and so PCS is high - and if we add to this the reputation of a skater, there's no possibility to not getting high scores. Davis and White knows that and this is why they are the best, but they may not have the best fd/sd themselves. Compared to other, worse technically teams their this season dances are not the best - when they skate them I can see big elements well-executed with no personality and some character. One of users said earlier something about them as a robots under Marina - somehow it is truly statement for me, because in last season and in the present one when I watched them I see only technicall execution of choreography which may be good or bad and for me there is no deeper thought about interpretation, personality, the story telling - the music is Notre Dame, they have some costumes suitable for it the same in Scheherezade, but I don't see they become the characters on ice. I would be even more excited and glad with them just playing the roles of characters in that Scheherezade story without putting some new wave of personal interpretation of the story and music, but now there isn't even that thing... Now I just see a great skated program with huge score, nothing else and comparing to other's performances in which I feel much more than that (some emotions - good or bad about THE DANCE), it's sad.
and Piper and Paul - when I watched them my jaw was litterally dropped down, what a great suprise from them!! When they started to skate together I considered them as a good-looking couple with some interesting choices of music and choreos. And when they skated even I with my non-professional eyes could see a technical difference between him and her. They were for me one of some medicore couples...until now. In last night's sd they shown me some promise - both in technical and presentation side, promise that they're better dancers, not only better skaters. And tonight's fd prove that promise, got it into life - there was everything I always expect from dance: a great choice of music (not overused- good ground for putting some freshness and personality), well-connected innovative choreo (timing of elements was great, lifts were just amazing, especially first one OMG) and to give the movements personal feeling, to alive them, not only execute them as parts of the program and they just alive that music, that choreo. All Their movement was in character all the time when they skated - even little music details were mentioned by moves. Also they created some "aura" there - some feeling of anxiety, unknown, tension - and yes, THEY created it along the music and it's super rare nowadays. And the technique was there also - I see she worked hard on edges, hands etc. and I very aprieciate that, because it shows that she wants to be better and so wants they to be better as a couple. To sum up - great positive surprise, because I would never pick that music for them and that's what I love - the courage (some unexpected choices and self - power of transformation, of changing along with that choices, that's great for them not only as a dancers but as a people)
) and sorry as always for the lenghtElena/Nikita - firts of all I think they should do programs like that - to maybe overused pieces but with some dramatic, characteristic storyline, because their last two season's free dances made me shivers and no in a good way unfortunately...They are exquisite on ice - have great presence, character, good ice coverage imo, but their potential was (and for me still is) not used and shown in 100%. Music is suprisingly well-connected with choreo, which is quite good itself (I'm suprised in a good way, because Morozov's arrangements of movements for this couple always made me scream for help...I just don't understand - he was coaching an ukrainian couple who gained bronze in Torino and I remember that some of their choreographies were fantastic, especially for original dances), the elements are at least better than previous seasons - lifts are amazing and if they will be all executed well along with the other elements ofc, this dance would be mindblowing for me. Now I see they captured the feeling, the essence of this music and I see they try to express drama, love, passion, anger and other emotions and that's the attitude which I like for dance couples. Even with weak technically step sequences they shown much more character than Davis/White - I see the chemistry between them, some artistic spark which may not be get from great technique but form the fact that when they dance, they put not only their bodies into choreography but also their minds and feelings. I always have some doubts when ice dancers picked overused, popular music with well-known story interpreted by thousands artists - I have them there also, but after watching it I'm interested and I'm strating to get into their story. One last thought about costumes - they looked fabulous, but please Elena get out off your beautiful head this tacky plastic tiara and put there a headband which you had on practice session!
Davis/White - in my post at SA FD thread I wrote about my feelings about this FD and my opinion isn't changed - they are almost perfect technically already, this perfection gives them monstreous PCS score, this can't be denied. But this performance leaves me once again with feeling of well- executed program and nothing more, while in comparision Elena/Nikita and especially Piper and Paul (about them I'll write below) interested me with their dances, not only programs treated as "some choreo put along with some music". As I said execution and technical level, sharpness, speed are incredible - in that scoring system this is almost everything, because if you're a good technician, performance is good also and so PCS is high - and if we add to this the reputation of a skater, there's no possibility to not getting high scores. Davis and White knows that and this is why they are the best, but they may not have the best fd/sd themselves. Compared to other, worse technically teams their this season dances are not the best - when they skate them I can see big elements well-executed with no personality and some character. One of users said earlier something about them as a robots under Marina - somehow it is truly statement for me, because in last season and in the present one when I watched them I see only technicall execution of choreography which may be good or bad and for me there is no deeper thought about interpretation, personality, the story telling - the music is Notre Dame, they have some costumes suitable for it the same in Scheherezade, but I don't see they become the characters on ice. I would be even more excited and glad with them just playing the roles of characters in that Scheherezade story without putting some new wave of personal interpretation of the story and music, but now there isn't even that thing... Now I just see a great skated program with huge score, nothing else and comparing to other's performances in which I feel much more than that (some emotions - good or bad about THE DANCE), it's sad.
and Piper and Paul - when I watched them my jaw was litterally dropped down, what a great suprise from them!! When they started to skate together I considered them as a good-looking couple with some interesting choices of music and choreos. And when they skated even I with my non-professional eyes could see a technical difference between him and her. They were for me one of some medicore couples...until now. In last night's sd they shown me some promise - both in technical and presentation side, promise that they're better dancers, not only better skaters. And tonight's fd prove that promise, got it into life - there was everything I always expect from dance: a great choice of music (not overused- good ground for putting some freshness and personality), well-connected innovative choreo (timing of elements was great, lifts were just amazing, especially first one OMG) and to give the movements personal feeling, to alive them, not only execute them as parts of the program and they just alive that music, that choreo. All Their movement was in character all the time when they skated - even little music details were mentioned by moves. Also they created some "aura" there - some feeling of anxiety, unknown, tension - and yes, THEY created it along the music and it's super rare nowadays. And the technique was there also - I see she worked hard on edges, hands etc. and I very aprieciate that, because it shows that she wants to be better and so wants they to be better as a couple. To sum up - great positive surprise, because I would never pick that music for them and that's what I love - the courage (some unexpected choices and self - power of transformation, of changing along with that choices, that's great for them not only as a dancers but as a people)
I blame Gillers & Poirier for not being able to enjoy I/k.
The whole time I was watching Swam Lake I was thinking how generic and bland that whole program was. Yes the first 30 seconds are fantastic, but everything after that felt so... basic. I'm left wondering if this team would be better off with another coach.
I've also noticed she cries a lot, of course stress could be the simple answer, but this is something that has bother me since they were juniors. It just makes me wonder if we are ignoring some huge red flag here. I'm not going to pussyfoot around this, but I get the feeling the environment around her is a bit toxic and it has been going on for some time now.
both of Zuevas's teams were less energetic (than Skate America) I have not doubt they were being careful in order to get the levels, but it was a bit too vanilla for me.
IMO G/P placing fifth is everything that is wrong in icedance. Inventiveness and innovation are not being rewarded, and to be honest I/k and Shib sibs are not that much better than them. Sorry if I hurt some fans. They just aren't.
C/L... he is just a weak partner.
They were so much better at Skate America, actually everyone was so much better at Skate America, that I actually had them below the Shibutanis.
My ranking would have been:
1) D/W
2)Shib Sibs
3)G/P
4)C/L
5)I/K
The whole time I was watching Swam Lake I was thinking how generic and bland that whole program was. Yes the first 30 seconds are fantastic, but everything after that felt so... basic. I'm left wondering if this team would be better off with another coach.
I've also noticed she cries a lot, of course stress could be the simple answer, but this is something that has bother me since they were juniors. It just makes me wonder if we are ignoring some huge red flag here. I'm not going to pussyfoot around this, but I get the feeling the environment around her is a bit toxic and it has been going on for some time now.
both of Zuevas's teams were less energetic (than Skate America) I have not doubt they were being careful in order to get the levels, but it was a bit too vanilla for me.
IMO G/P placing fifth is everything that is wrong in icedance. Inventiveness and innovation are not being rewarded, and to be honest I/k and Shib sibs are not that much better than them. Sorry if I hurt some fans. They just aren't.
C/L... he is just a weak partner.
They were so much better at Skate America, actually everyone was so much better at Skate America, that I actually had them below the Shibutanis.
My ranking would have been:
1) D/W
2)Shib Sibs
3)G/P
4)C/L
5)I/K
- Joined
- Aug 1, 2011
I just watched it on Youtube and have been sitting here for three or four minutes just saying, wow. Wow. I had the same reaction to Alexander Johnson's FD last season. Just one of those programs that is SO well choreographed, so clever, so interesting that, even if it doesn't win a medal (and it probably won't), you know it will stay with you long after those medal winning performances have faded from memory. I am super impressed.
PS I know you're very impressed with I/K's FD, and while it's well skated, it's a 6.0 program in an IJS world, down to the "we're so emotionally distraught from skating this we can barely make our Uber Dramatic way to the boards to hug our coaches" exit. Someone should clue them in that it is 2013 and not pre-Salt Lake City 2002. Just sayin'...
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2012
I really like how I/K FD is choreographed, the music cuts and the lifts, and it is certainly better than Ave Maria and Ghost (which I HATED), but after the first 30 seconds or so I agree that it becomes a bit generic, it looks almost as if they don't really understand what they're doing, and towards the end you're not really paying attention to what they're doing...
And, sorry, but seeing Maia Shibutani acting like MJ on the ice looks a bit 
And, sorry, but seeing Maia Shibutani acting like MJ on the ice looks a bit
Um, in the post interviews Elena said she was incredibly touched by the Japanese reaction (who gave them a standing O) and that brought her to tears.
Nothing to do with theatrics or whatever it is they are being accused of.
I/K- not my favorite program (huge improvement from last year) but they skated that really well. Lots of flow, speed and overall just gorgeous skating technique (the best, IMO). Very elegant and fluid upper body movements. Loved the new lifts too. The transitions between the big elements very open and rather generic though. They are still very expressive and have great chemistry.
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- Oct 31, 2006
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Piper Gilles and Paul Poirier are far and away my favorite North American ice dance team! I have always loved this team and it is clear that they have improved together as a team and have become more free and cohesive on the ice. They are always innovative and interesting and they always push the envelope breaking all status quo and conventions of ordinary themes and warhorse music selections in figure skating and ice dancing. They are their own unique team and I very much appreciate that! What a chilling, haunting program and Paul's resemblance to Norman Bates, particularly that face he makes at the beginning of the program is creepy in the best possible way. 
Ahhh, I loved every second of this program; they are such a breath of fresh air! This can definitely become a signature piece for them and those highlight moves are very complex and memorable. They can still make improvements in terms of matching their body lines and extension better and increasing their speed, but for them to have missed so much training and preparation time together because of his training accident where his blade hit his leg during a missed twizzle sequence causing him to have a fracture dislocation in his right ankle, I will say that they are on target and I'm sure hoping to be their best in January at the Canadian Nationals. With ice dancing, it is so important to make what is difficult appear effortless and with so much missed time in training, they haven't quite mastered that aspect for this program yet, but it is their very first event of the season and they have time now to receive feedback from the judges and build up. I wish them all the best and can easily say that their FD has just become my favorite program of any dance team in the world this season! :yay: I can't wait to see how they continue to improve and progress! GO PIPER & PAUL!!! :yay:
Ahhh, I loved every second of this program; they are such a breath of fresh air! This can definitely become a signature piece for them and those highlight moves are very complex and memorable. They can still make improvements in terms of matching their body lines and extension better and increasing their speed, but for them to have missed so much training and preparation time together because of his training accident where his blade hit his leg during a missed twizzle sequence causing him to have a fracture dislocation in his right ankle, I will say that they are on target and I'm sure hoping to be their best in January at the Canadian Nationals. With ice dancing, it is so important to make what is difficult appear effortless and with so much missed time in training, they haven't quite mastered that aspect for this program yet, but it is their very first event of the season and they have time now to receive feedback from the judges and build up. I wish them all the best and can easily say that their FD has just become my favorite program of any dance team in the world this season! :yay: I can't wait to see how they continue to improve and progress! GO PIPER & PAUL!!! :yay:
