Skaters Facing Pay Cuts | Golden Skate

Skaters Facing Pay Cuts

Yazmeen

On the Ice
Joined
Jul 29, 2003
Great. Now we have to adjust the long program in US to maximize the TV viewing audience, never mind how the athletes might actually feel. Are they also going to put in a clause that Michelle Kwan can never retire since she's the biggest draw and that Sasha must add more of her amazing flexibility moves to improve ratings? Gee, I'm sure Jenny, Amber, Angela and Ann Patrice are thrilled to know that their performances were "meaningless." :rolleye:
 
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nymkfan51

Medalist
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I agree Yazmeen. This has been the problem with FS coverage IMO ... they treat it more as an entertainment event, rather than a sports competition. They have been adding more and more fluff pieces, and we see less skaters every year. Now this ... reorganizing things just to suit the TV networks. You don't see them screwing with the other sports this way!
Frankly, for me this year's GP was the last straw. Showing events weeks after they occured ... plus mixing the coverage of two different events the same weekend ... really pathetic as far as I am concerned.
I say, bring on the Ice Channel!!! I'd gladly pay extra for good coverage.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Boy, I don't know what to think. Money talks. If the television networks can realize only $5 million dollars in advertizing revenue from ISU events, instead of $20 million, then something's gotta give.

Other sports do make changes all the time to make their product more marketable on television. They schedule "commercial" time outs while the games are in progress, they choose to show on TV the teams that they think most people want to see at the expense of other teams, they make the athletes and coaches interact with the media to promote the sport, they make rules changes to make the game more exciting to the fans (like changing the strike zone in baseball so there will be more home runs) -- lots and lots and lots of stuff.

I don't think we can say, hey, this is sports not entertainment. Sports is entertainment. I don't think that the skaters themselves would say, let's forget about making all this money and return to some imaginary time in the past when we were pure.

I also took note of Cinquanta's plan to allow the the speed skaters to vote on the CoP to insure that it will pass. Business as usual in any major corporate organization.

Actually, according to Mark Lund in his book Frozen Assets, Michelle Kwan does have a separate contract with ABC that says she can't retire and has to appear in all of the Campbell's-type contest for the next several years.

Mathman
 

insecureedge

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 22, 2003
Interesting snippets for those not wanting to register to read the article (although it is free...):

The International Skating Union is close to signing a TV contract that will take international figure skating off over-the-air TV in the U.S. and force the ISU to make significant cuts in prize money
...
the multiyear contract would be with cable network ESPN for approximately $5 million annually. That is less than 25 percent of the $22 million the ISU currently receives from ABC...

Also in the works: Giving ABC a long program final with the last six skaters competing in reverse order of their short program finish.

Slick maneuver: Cinquanta has a plan to help him get approval of figure skating's new Code of Points scoring system in championships and the Olympics. Although judging issues normally are considered by only figure skating delegates, Cinquanta will argue that so much of the ISU's revenue comes from figure skating the entire organization should have a say in a reform designed to restore confidence in figure skating results.

InsecureEdge
 

hockeyfan228

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Prize money for each GP even is $61K per event, which is not a lot of money in the big scheme of things, but the question is, where does the $22M in TV revenue go today? Obviously several million, presumably already paid, to develop CoP, and whatever it costs for the event venues (Jr. and Sr.), event advertising, some event operational costs, ISU executive travel expenses, record keeping, judge training and development, organizational overhead, legal fees. How much of speed skating does the figure skating TV revenue cover? How much goes into development programs, like the ISU-sponsored skater development program that crosses Scandinavia, the Baltics, and UK? I expect that the ISU already knew this was coming; they monitor attendance and viewing patterns. Another reason to push through the CoP before the money ran out!

If the prize money is cut, I wonder if this will affect who goes to GP events and how often they skate. If the incentive for a third event is to earn enough to pay for training, will they skate three events and spend the money to travel for themselves, coaches, and support teams? If not, maybe that's a good thing. It would spread the money out more, and to up local attendence and revenue, the host countries could be allowed to send one more participant. (None of which would make the broadcast, but it might get butts in chairs, especially if the participants were local.)
 

Ptichka

Forum translator
Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 28, 2003
If not, maybe that's a good thing. It would spread the money out more, and to up local attendence and revenue, the host countries could be allowed to send one more participant. (None of which would make the broadcast, but it might get butts in chairs, especially if the participants were local.)
I doubt it. Suppose SA were held in Boston (Year, I know, funny notion, but still...). I would go to see my favorites skate, but I don't think I would go to see some skater just becasue he/she/they train in Mass.
 

nymkfan51

Medalist
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Mathman ... good points about changes made in other sports as well. Also ... I agree it is both sport and entertainment. I guess my biggest complaint about the coverage is that so little is ever shown live ... and that even when it is shown on tape, it's weeks (months) later. I have never seen this with other sports. Granted, because of time differences, some things are shown on tape delay ... but never weeks after they happened.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
I've been saying this for years. Television is in the business of lmaking money any which way it can. Sponsors of TV showings are interested in the number of viewers who may buy their product. All State and Smart Ones have been the backbone of figure skating in the US. If they pull out, we're in trouble.

The once every four year competition will draw viewers, and for that one night only, there will be more sponsors. But those sponsors will drop out after the Olys.

Of course, a scandal will help.

Joe
 

Grgranny

Da' Spellin' Homegirl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I would have liked to read it but you have to register and I don't want them to have any way to harass me.
 

Bijoux

Match Penalty
Joined
Jan 8, 2004
Reasons why viewership are down

1. Clashing with football coverage (it's a man's world, still).

2. All the pro skaters, whom I like, have been skating since 1984-90's, and til 2004. If we get bored with Scott, Kat, Roz, Orser etc, imagine the casual viewers' thoughts. But they aren't injured, and do doubles, I'd say-the quality, the spins, edging are all there.That's why I will watch, wishing for others to show up, too

3. Eligible skating has ruined the stars of the 90's. Tara, Elvis, Yagudin and stars since 2000, like Timmy with bad injuries.

4. Michelle fills the ladies final at Nats but what does the casual viewer say? Oh Yes, Michelle again? or oh no, Michelle again and that's why Sasha, Jenny, whoever, can't become a star. Just have heard this.

5. We need a scandal as Joe says, and there are so many scandals kept quiet. Someone retired needs to write a tell all...what it is really like at this level of competition. Katia, Kat, Oksana B, Pasha Grishuk and so many more have interesting lives. A bestselling expose will get viewers. Yeah, it's not all "nice" but something has to save Figureskating for the masses. Cable is expensive. How much for the Ice Channel?

6. The USA pro favorite Kristy had a baby. We have Kwan, the Oly underdog, who many love, but she doesn't have the big prize that the casual viewers consider the medal one must have.

7. And there are many more ponderings. Todd Eldridge is good but no Oly medals. It's been a long time since Bri Boitano. Men's skating field is lackluster. Timmy may be done and he was maybe 4 years on the senior scene. In a quad world he had great luck in 2002. But then these last two seasons were not his best. People who watch casually need a while to get to know someone to become a fan and invest in watching a two hour comp. Many women watch and we don't hear women uniting for the type tv entertainment we like. All are too busy, too tired or dealing with bigger issues.


For casual viewers we need a truly georgeous skate Goddess from our country-a la Hamill and Fleming.With the gold, willing to stay 4 years more for a second Oly a la Witt. People still like to watch her.

We need more disney specials (michelle?) or those quality productions, esp for children. They become viewers-next generation.

GP season is too much for on top skaters. maybe 3 events and a final would seem more do-able for casual viewers to track and watch. the level of amateur skating must go up. Maybe learn school figures for beautiful basics and forget 2 3/3's quads or 3axels from women. Who cares if they are poor skaters? unnatractive, terrible line, poor presenters? We do, and so do casual viewers. What fun is a splatfest with half of all the skaters skating injured, withdrawing, etc.?

I think if Jenny, Mich or Sasha win Oly gold in 2006, there may be a renewal afoot. But USA casual watchers want an American Princess. We all like Irina or Fumie, but that won't excite the TV audience near as much.

Ideas off the cuff--you all have many more.

Maybe the big money of the 90's helped corrupt the sport. Maybe only those who love it truly and can afford it will skate. We had great skaters for decades who made very little $$.

And maybe Cinquanta and the ISU won't controll it all. Ice Channel is a reality. If we have another skating boom/scandalous skaters, many will turn it on and ABC will be back to get some of it. Everything changes except the power of money.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
Bijoux - Your post was fascinating and I believe it to be your opinions on so many points which affect the status of figure skating today.

1. Clashing with football is a good point but you do not suggest a remedy for this clashing. I presume you would have the ISU check with the NFL in advance so that they can have the figure skating events on different nights.

One idea circulating the skating forums is that Figure skating is the most popular sport - Not So! Football in America will definitely top it; Hockey in Canada willl definitely top it; and Soccer (Fussbol) will topi it all over the world. Figure Skating does have a good night during the Olympics every four years.

2. Getting bored with some skaters is a natural feeling. You seem to be suggesting an automatic disappearance of some skaters after a certain period. Am I correct?

3, Was it eligihble skating that ruined what you call 'stars' or was it fans on forums demanding more from them? He raised the bar; he can't win without a quad; etc. Figure skating can be a dangerous sport and the skater is left to understand his limitations. What he decides is his business.
As for "Pro" competitions, in my opinion, it is just another form of 'Show" skating. I am not alone in that opinion.

4. How many casual viewers have you spoken to? MK filled the arena because she is a very popular skater same as if I would run to see a Meryl Streep movie. I think Sasha and Jenny have a huge fan base and I think they helped to fill the arena that night. Again, you seem to be putting limited duration on figure skaters.

5. People love scandals.

6. Sarah Hughes has the BIG prize. No problem. If you believe that 2 strikes and your out, will that apply to all skaters or just MK?

7. Timmy is having only one poor season after the 2002 Worlds. There has been much discussion on the problem. Todd and Brian B are pro skaters. That facit of sport has never really been built up, imo, to make it interesting. Too many silly props. The competition is basically about who is the most outlandish?

The rest of your opinions are well taken. and much of those are worthy of topics for discussion on the forum. You defintely care about the sport of figure skating, and that is what will keep the sport on the networks, hopefully.

Cheers - Joe
 

berthes ghost

Final Flight
Joined
Jul 30, 2003
Slightly OT, but with regard to term limits and turnover in popularity, I think that skating has no one to blame but itself. I can think of no other sports, with perhaps the exception of gymnastics (which I don't follow closely) that has built itself so strongly around a 4 year cycle. The whole idea that a skater peaks, reighs supreme for 4 years and then gracefully bows out to let the youngers have thier day in the sun comes straight form the skating world, and was drilled into the minds of fans for decades. Now that the ISU has decided to run pro skating out of town, the fans are suppose to adapt to the new system like the flip of a switch after a lifetime of conditioning? It's unrealistic and I think unfair to blame market fatique on the fans, especially with a product that changes so little over the years. Kwan takes most of the heat because she dominates the sport, but let's face it, what skater is always coming up with new and different routines? None.

I also think that skating is experiancing the down side of oversaturation of the market. It's like the Planet Hollywoood of sports. After Tonya/Nancy, one couldn't turn on the TV without some skating show being shown somewhere. What goes up, must come down.

Skating used to be the star of "neglected sports", hence being the darling of "Wide World of Sports": the show for ugly step sister sports everywhere. Other than it's 15 minutes of fame between 94 and 98, skating will never be as popular as the holy trinity ( football, basketball and baseball ) and other sports like Hockey and Tennis because it's not accesable. It's not something one can do easily in gym class or in the street on a summer evening and it's rules are so archane, one needs to take a friggin school course just to understand what's going on. Yes, I know that COP is the darling of skating nerds on the web world wide, but mark my words, it's clutter of meaningless marks all over the TV screen is going to alinate so many casual or would-be fans, that the sport is going to hemerage fans like a war torn nation.
 

hockeyfan228

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
berthes ghost said:
Yes, I know that COP is the darling of skating nerds on the web world wide, but mark my words, it's clutter of meaningless marks all over the TV screen is going to alinate so many casual or would-be fans, that the sport is going to hemerage fans like a war torn nation.
Under OBO the viewer and the fan in the arena sees a series of X.Y marks (under original OBO) or a string of unpaired X.Y marks (under the interim system), that are relative and make no sense to the viewers, even when a string of ordinals comes up. And even if the placements are good, they have to be factored with QR/SP or CD/OD points to get the final standings.

"She was in fourth place after the SP, but because she beat Skater A and Skater B beat Skater A, she's now the gold medallist."

"Because the judges couldn't agree on which skater was better, but they did agree that everyone else was worse, Jeff Buttle won 4C's because he had the most 2nd place votes."

At least under CoP there's a little "Total to beat=XXX.YY" line above the scores, and if the total is less than that, the skater team is not in the lead. If the total is more than that, the skater is in the lead. That's the way every other sport works, except where the lowest (time) is the leader.

I think that skating has no one to blame but itself. I can think of no other sports, with perhaps the exception of gymnastics (which I don't follow closely) that has built itself so strongly around a 4 year cycle. The whole idea that a skater peaks, reighs supreme for 4 years and then gracefully bows out to let the youngers have thier day in the sun comes straight form the skating world, and was drilled into the minds of fans for decades.

Gymnastics has a three-of-four year cycle: World Championships in odd years and Olympics in every other even year.

A couple of thoughts on this:

Dropping school figures and televising the rest means that most of the standings can't be pre-rigged to the extent that the reigning champion could be held up away from the cameras. That means that reigns and predominance are less sturdy in singles. Also dropping school figures means that younger and younger kids can concentrate on tricks; the bigger and better the tricks, the more volatility in the standings, and the more likely it is to have instant winners like Baiul, Lipinski, and Hughes, who each only had a few years in Seniors and top-ranked standing, instead of four to eight-year stints at the top.

If anything, this has added interest and emphasis to the Olympics, because you never know what will happen, until it's over over. Why watch what happens in between? It's like the regular season in so many sports -- who cares if you win your division if you're ousted in the first of four rounds of playoffs? Only "real" fans watch the regular season, and there aren't that many "real" fans for figure skating, although you'd think that a dedicated concentration of middle-aged women, many of whom control household income, and teenaged girls would be a great demographic to have, especially as huge numbers of baby-boomers continue to hit middle age. ("Lady in Red..." [Insert gagging icon])

I think the GP series was meant to establish a World Cup-like system, in which the local markets with the highest concentration of fans (or potential fans) were given yearly events to keep interest high. (With its prize money, the GP also replaces the training money that was provided by the State, pre-Perestroika.) Instead it, along with cheezfest TV contracts, have made it so lucrative to stay in the eligible ranks, until injury takes its toll. The GP events also give skaters a lot more exposure -- a podium finish at Trophee Lalique will likely be televised on North American TV, but an 8th-place finish at Worlds will not, unless the skater/team is local, or is added, like Tamura's skate on the CBC broadcast, to provide drama in the outcome.

The one point directly on topic: for skaters who have cheezfest contracts, where the fees dwarf any prize money from "real" competitions, just as appearance money for tennis players dwarfs tournament earnings, any pay cut due to the new competition broadcast TV contract will be meaningless. That's why we may see Plushenko limp through one last cheezfest in April before having surgery. When this contract expires -- 2007, I think -- it will be interesting to see how lucrative it is to stay in eligible skating, coupled with ISU-related pay cuts. Add that to lower audience attendance at Champions on Ice, which will result in lower appearance fees/salaries, and eligible skating may lose even more of its lustre.

With the money draining away, this will be a golden opportunity for the WSU or some other group to provide an alternate professional organization to the ISU, one that gives the top skaters the opportunity for meaningful competition apart from ISU-sanctioned events, with judging that will be considered fair by the competitors and not the beauty pagent evaluations that happen today in pro contests. (I keep waiting for Paul Abdul and Phil Esposito to show up as judges.) A well-organized pro organization would give skaters the incentive to move on. And if it were to be run by qualification -- not purely on invitations based on TV ratings -- any eligible skater could go pro and hope to compete in the pro ranks. Since TV exposure in the future will be delegated to whenever a cable network decides to run skating broadcasts, a few judicious, low-revenue TV contracts with broadcast network for a couple of live/recently-taped events scheduled around football, March Madness, the Stanley Cup, the World Series, the World Cup, etc. could bring professional skating back, along with movement out of the eligible ranks.
 

Doggygirl

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2003
TV Coverage and $$ Advances the sport..

I've given this quite a bit of thought before posting. A significant question here involves whether competitive (amateur) Figure Skating is "sport" or "entertainment." I would say it's both, and I believe strongly that the entertainment (and subsequent TV / $$ interest) has advanced the sport dramatically.

Having been an amateur competitor in a primarily unknown sport as a teenager, I can say for sure there is little motivation to continue in that sport once you graduate from high school. With the exception of low paying coaching / judging engagements for the extremely enthusiastic, you almost have to give it up in preparation to make a living at something else.

TV has elevated this sport to star levels, and at varying degrees over time. Several people have mentioned that controversy and scandal raise the ratings, which I believe is true. (Sad, but true) I believe a big part of the elevation of the sport in terms of amateur skaters longevity, and income (I think the two are tightly tied) is the broader interest in TV viewing. Young skaters today actually have the potential to make a living performing in their sport. If the sport was treated only as a competition (and not an entertainment event to some degree) this financial potential would not exist (or be limited severely) and no one but the "born wealthy" could stay around after the age of 17 or 18 to advance the sport with difficulty or presentation of the quality such as MK.

I'm not sure if this is fact - this is second hand information. NASCAR is one of the most followed sports in the US behind NFL Football. Why? Football is understandable. Most young boys (and hopefully some interested girls are out there these days!) is available to the masses through local programs and schools. But NASCAR?? How many kids grow up with a race car in their garage?? I really believe one of the reasons NASCAR is so popular is that the entire sports machine recognizes the value of fans, and caters to them. This happens with the drivers, the teams (at a higher and more expensive level) and the media. I'm pretty sure that NASCAR racing has advanced over the years (speed, sponsorship, $$, etc.) because of the fan catering, increased popularity through TV, etc.

So to ignore the importance of "catering to TV viewership / fan participation" V. "let's keep the competition pure" in my opinion would be submitting to taking the figure skating sport backwards. I would personally love to watch a televised FS event where every seat in the arena is occupied, and there is a frenzy of fans in mass outside who cannot get a nosebleed ticket.

Just my 2 cents..

DG
 
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Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Hey, Doggygirl, we were just wondering about you over in the Cafe.

Lots of interesting opinions here, but I wanted especially to comment on a couple of the points raised by Bijoux.
1. Clashing with football coverage (it's a man's world, still).
It has always seemed peculiar to me that men would rather look at beefy lads bent over a football -- not that there's anything wrong with it! -- than pretty girls skating in skimpy outfits.

But I think I know why. Sport is a metaphor for war, or at least for a smash-mouth gang fight, which is "what men really want." Thus the attack on Nancy Kerrigan was good for the sport, but other scandals -- the Salt Lake City judging controversy or Pasha Grischuk stealing Maya Usova's husband -- is ho hum at best. We may need a scandal, but a National Inquirer tell-all won't fill the bill.
4. Michelle fills the ladies final at Nats but what does the casual viewer say? Oh Yes, Michelle again? or oh no, Michelle again and that's why Sasha, Jenny, whoever, can't become a star. Just have heard this.
I don't think that figure skating is losing its audience because Michelle Kwan wins everything. When Michael Jordan was winning everything with the Chicago Bulls, the Bulls were still the biggest draw in the NBA, even when people in other cities came out to root against him.

Golf was never more popular than when Tiger Woods was winning everything in sight. Now that Tiger has dropped back into the pack, TV ratings are dropping, too. Even on a tournament by tournament basis, if Tiger's not in the hunt on Sunday, nobody is interested in watching. Indeed, the other golfers are enjoying huge paydays from the money that Tiger has brought into the sport.
We have Kwan, the Oly underdog, who many love, but she doesn't have the big prize that the casual viewers consider the medal one must have.
Are you saying that the whole sport of figure skating is losing its audience and hence its television contract because Michelle Kwan does not have an Olympic Gold medal? Come on. Michelle is big, but is she THAT big?

I think this is living in the past, or in Europe. I think the days are long gone when people will come out to see a skater perform just because she won something at the Olympics a year or two before. I think the attitude of most casual fans is, OK, that's nice, but what have you done for me lately? I don't think that American ladies having won the Olympic Gold Medal in 1998 or in 2002 did anything much one way or the other for the popularity of the sport.
For casual viewers we need a truly gorgeous skate Goddess from our country-a la Hamill and Fleming.
???We have one.

The only difference is that Michelle Kwan has won as many Olympic, World and National medals as Peggy Fleming and Dorothy Hamill together.
With the gold, willing to stay 4 years more for a second Oly a la Witt. People still like to watch her.
Yes, people still like to see Katerina Witt perform. That's why Kat gets the big endorsement contracts and the big appearance fees, it's why she skates last at every COI show, why audiences go crazy whenever she performs...Oh, wait, that's not Katerina...
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
Quote:

So to ignore the importance of "catering to TV viewership / fan participation" V. "let's keep the competition pure" in my opinion would be submitting to taking the figure skating sport backwards. I would personally love to watch a televised FS event where every seat in the arena is occupied, and there is a frenzy of fans
in mass outside who cannot get a nosebleed ticket
.___________________________________________________

And just how would you get every seat in the arena occupied without the Stars? or in the case of baseball, without the Yankess? or in Tennis without the top seeds? Sports drive on stardom as well as entertainment. And there is plenty of entertainment in sports but, oh, without the props.

Joe
 

berthes ghost

Final Flight
Joined
Jul 30, 2003
But NASCAR?? How many kids grow up with a race car in their garage??

Everyone knows how to drive, especially in the US. Even kids understand the properties of what makes a car go foward. One doesn't need a degree in Physics to understand that the cars go round in a circle and the fastest car wins.

How many of us looked at our first skating comp and instantly understood "Oh, I see. There are jumps, spins and footwork. There are 3 basic footwork sequences. Each skater must do a minimum of 4 spins and include a combination and or change foot spin in order to get more points. There are six different jumps and a skater can repeat no more than 2 of these, but if repeated they have to be in combination with another jump, which is either a toe loop or a loop because of the right outside edge landing/take off. Ice coverage and variation of speed are obviously judged in the presentation mark." ? :rolleye:
 
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