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Thread: Can Adelina Sotnikova overcome the pressure? (Part 2)

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaylee View Post
    Then why would you bring it up in reference to Ashley getting too high PCS if it had no relevance to Ashley's situation and score?
    You clearly have completely misunderstood what I was saying. Technical mistakes ruin the overall spectacle of a program, but under COP/IJS, that is often not reflected in the PCS marks. Patrick Chan's FS from the 2013 World Championships is one of the worst examples of this (i.e. despite multiple falls in his programs, his PCS often holds up despite it - which is ridiculous). Ashley Wagner's FS today was another example, although far less extreme. With the mistakes she made in her program today, her PCS marks should have been in the upper 50's. Instead, they were in the mid 60's.

    Time to bring back the 6.0 system

    Quote Originally Posted by jaylee View Post
    In terms of packaging alone, Wagner deserved higher components. Adelina's dress is awful.
    That is your very subjective opinion, and one in which many would disagree with. As I said, its in the eye of the beholder. I certainly think Sotnikova's dress is better than Wagner's.

  2. #17
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    After the sp where her Flutz dg combo was hit with near unanimous -3 in goe she did some things in the lp that made sense. While not doing 3/3 was a mistake at least she didn't do Flutz dg loop again!

    I don't think pressure is the problem. It's a program design that completely ignores her flaws. Why didn't she do a 3 Jump combo? Bad program design. Why do a flip as a start of a 3 jump combo if it means no 3 jump combo? Why give a victory to Wagner with Flutz dg loop in the sp? And then don't Do 3/3 at all in the lp and leave out a jump? These program designs are still extremely poor and need reform.

  3. #18
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    In either case I think Sotnikova is definitely not favored to make the team along with Julia. Tuktamysheva is increasingly falling out of the running completely, and Anna showing bigger scoring potential now based on her score here combined with her consistency pushes Elizaveta further behind the 8 ball (note I mean bigger scoring potential than Anna was thought to have previously, not bigger than Elizaveta). If Sotnikova continues to skate even reasonably well though the team will be Julia and Adelina, no question.

  4. #19
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    I am a big Adelina fan but I am satisfied with today's result. I would have had Ashley's PCS maybe a bit below Adelina's but not enough to drop her to 2nd overall.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mao88 View Post
    You clearly have completely misunderstood what I was saying. Technical mistakes ruin the overall spectacle of a program, but under COP/IJS, that is often not reflected in the PCS marks. Patrick Chan's FS from the 2013 World Championships is one of the worst examples of this (i.e. despite multiple falls in his programs, his PCS often holds up despite it - which is ridiculous). Ashley Wagner's FS today was another example, although far less extreme. With the mistakes she made in her program today, her PCS marks should have been in the upper 50's. Instead, they were in the mid 60's.
    Oh, I did not. Your argument just made no sense. Ashley only had one technical mistake that was glaring, and it wasn't even a fall. She did not have multiple step-outs, she didn't have one fall or multiple falls. Why should her PCS take a dive because of her flutzing (another mistake) or slight two-footing when she still performed her program well? For example, in spite of those mistakes, Ashley's performance had some eye-catching transitions, such as the split jump out of the 2A and the spread eagle into the 3Lo. Hence, there shouldn't be an issue with her TR score remaining relatively high at this competition. I can't think of any transitions by Adelina, though Adelina made fewer mistakes, that fit her program and music as well.

    That is your very subjective opinion, and one in which many would disagree with. As I said, its in the eye of the beholder. I certainly think her dress is better than Wagner's.
    Of course that's my subjective opinion. But again, you have provided no support for your belief that Adelina has a better program than Wagner. You've only insisted that Wagner's program is poorly choreographed, but no details to support an argument that Adelina's is better.

  6. #21
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    How was Sotnikova's FS better choreographed than Wagner's? Sotnikova looked great to me when I watched the stream with sound turned off but after watching the video with sound, I have to agree with jaylee. Wagner has had better programs in previous seasons but her program was far better even with the near-fall.

  7. #22
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    My issue with Sotnikova going to the Olympics is that she reminds me of Sasha Cohen beautiful skater but struggles to have a clean competition- a clean free skate and short. And she doesn't have the musicality or wow moments that allowed Cohen's final score to overcome the jump errors.

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    To be honest, I think Adelina always have very difficult/complicated step sequences and spins that most other top ladies cannot deliver, but those steps are not always matching the music or the esthetics of the skating.
    I think as long as she learned not to rush into her jumps, gets more tactical choreography, softens her movements a little, she can be very consistent in her jumps, and be totally awesome. She just has not shown her true potential at the senior level at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hippomoomin View Post
    I think as long as she learned not to rush into her jumps, gets more tactical choreography, softens her movements a little, she can be very consistent in her jumps, and be totally awesome. She just has not shown her true potential at the senior level at all.
    But Russia can't exactly afford to gamble that her true potential may or may not show up at the Olympics.

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    I guess I am thinking of the next few years, Olympics or not. Seriously hope she got tactical programs like Julia's next season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amei View Post
    But Russia can't exactly afford to gamble that her true potential may or may not show up at the Olympics.
    Yes they can. It is not like they have a real good shot to medal this year anyway. They already have their consistent and solid contender, and probably most likely hope of a medal. They can certainly send with her their erratic but potentially brilliant headcase who if she skates well could pull a big surprise. Anna and Elizaveta have no hope of a medal at the Games, so are the most pointless to send if they have 2 spots.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    Yes they can. It is not like they have a real good shot to medal this year anyway. They already have their consistent and solid contender, and probably most likely hope of a medal. They can certainly send with her their erratic but potentially brilliant headcase who if she skates well could pull a big surprise. Anna and Elizaveta have no hope of a medal at the Games, so are the most pointless to send if they have 2 spots.
    Plus Adelina usually wins head-to-heads against other Russian skaters, so there aren't any viable alternatives to Adelina and Julia on the team.

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    Sotnikova is still a headcase, not until she proves her free skate wasn't a fluke
    but given that she is her Federation's favorite, Sptnikova is almost certain to make the Olympics

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    Quote Originally Posted by sky_fly20 View Post
    Sotnikova is still a headcase, not until she proves her free skate wasn't a fluke
    but given that she is her Federation's favorite, Sptnikova is almost certain to make the Olympics
    and since you know Julia is making it the 2 women team is already a sure thing. Now they are fighting for which skates the team event or if they share that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sky_fly20 View Post
    Sotnikova is still a headcase, not until she proves her free skate wasn't a fluke
    but given that she is her Federation's favorite, Sptnikova is almost certain to make the Olympics
    You mean like Yuzuru being a headcase who has yet to skate a clean FS (the closest being worlds two years ago)?

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