- Joined
- Nov 16, 2005
How did Agnes get invited? Why not give Cesario a shot.
Gracie changing SP music?
- Thread starter Tonichelle
- Start date
- Joined
- May 17, 2011
The way choreography fits with the other jumps will always play into a program. Not only does the placement of the jumps need to fit the music, and the spin positions relate to the music, but skating various types of transitions and complex choreography will leave you with less stamina for the big skills. Skaters will probably still always do their best triple-triple or quad in a program, but they will be sure to place it in a way that at least somewhat works with the music but also allows them the best chance of landing it.
Gymnastics isn't all that different. Yes, gymnasts will probably choose their highest scoring skills, but they will place them carefully in the routine so as to match the music (or will choose music that matches their skills). Just like skaters, gymnasts prefer to place their big skills earlier in the routine because they'll have more stamina. The more choreography and dance skills a gymnast does, the less stamina they will have for their tumbling, just as in skating. This is why some gymnasts pause in a corner before a tumbling run (though pausing too long is a deduction).
Both sports supposedly have an artistry component (though both have regressed in that aspect since the new codes, gymnastics moreso than skating). In both sports, the time and energy spent on dancing/choreography will affect the big skills. Neither sport would be the same if the elements were performed in absence of a routine. There are lots of athletes who are great at the skills, but have trouble putting them in a routine.
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
I find it extremely rare that skaters do elements to accent the music that they are skating to. I think the good skaters can express the mood of the music well, but the type of things that Sasha would do with music is hard to find these days.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2012
Trying to read the tea leaves of the Disson casting would be an exercise in futility, I believe.
- For example, Davis/White are not in the cast. Chock/Bates recently were added. (Perhaps D/W had been asked and declined, but who knows?)
- When the majority of the cast members first were announced back in September, Wagner and Zawadzki were listed from the beginning. Gold was not added until a few weeks later.
That said, Disson's invitation to Zawadzki was/is totally reasonable, IMHO. Zawadzki, Wagner, and Gold were the three American ladies' skaters at both the spring and autumn USOC pre-Sochi media summits. (The spring summit included Gao as well.)- When the majority of the cast members first were announced back in September, Wagner and Zawadzki were listed from the beginning. Gold was not added until a few weeks later.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2012
FYI Gracie's new SP music is to Grieg Piano Concerto in A minor. The beginning is quite nice, from the slow section in the second movement. The second part is faster and more dramatic, which I didn't like as much. (Her arms tend to windmill and flail about much more in fast music, IMO.) Overall better than Three Preludes though. She did a 3Lz-3T, 3Lo, 2A. She two-footed the landing on the 3T in the combination and did it again twice in retakes.
I saw the performance and have to say I don't like the new program. The SP and FS are now both to romantic type music and I don't think that does Gracie any favors. She's just not the pretty princess type. While the old SP was grating on the ears, she performed it well and the judges liked it enough to reward her with high marks even when she wasn't perfect. IMO, you don't fix something that's working well.
Alissa Czisny was in the show and she is a sad shadow of her former self. She did just one jump, a single axel, and even that seemed to cause her pain. She had a hard time keeping up with her music, and all her moves were slow and tentative, even the spins. The person sitting next to me kept wondering why Alissa was in the show, saying she could barely skate compared to all the other skaters.
Alissa Czisny was in the show and she is a sad shadow of her former self. She did just one jump, a single axel, and even that seemed to cause her pain. She had a hard time keeping up with her music, and all her moves were slow and tentative, even the spins. The person sitting next to me kept wondering why Alissa was in the show, saying she could barely skate compared to all the other skaters.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2012
This is not an Alissa thread, but she did a double axel, and a rather nice one at that. I thought her spins were lovely. The program was to a Scotty McCreery song, and most programs to live singers on Disson shows are not exactly standouts, simply one-time performances that skaters don't really have time to choreograph anything to. She didn't look tentative or in pain to me at all, and I was sitting very close to the ice.
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2013
I tried searching YouTube but I couldn't find Gracie's new SP from the show. Do you think it will go up, or are we just going to have to wait until Nationals? 
Then again, the show was only last night, right? So maybe someone video taped it, although I'm sure they weren't supposed to
Then again, the show was only last night, right? So maybe someone video taped it, although I'm sure they weren't supposed to
- Joined
- Sep 13, 2010
Just happy to hear that Alissa was out there to perform in front of people. I hope videos will be up soon somewhere.
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- Apr 2, 2009
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I tried searching YouTube but I couldn't find Gracie's new SP from the show. Do you think it will go up, or are we just going to have to wait until Nationals?
Then again, the show was only last night, right? So maybe someone video taped it, although I'm sure they weren't supposed to
This was posted by user marysy (along with vids from a few other skaters at the show):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4idjEkR-Bs8
I think it's a nice program for Gracie and by Nationals it could be a great thing. I still don't think there was any need to change her original SP when she was scoring so well with it. And I personally didn't have a problem with the music.
OT but here's Alissa's skate since she was brought in the thread:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xW18UWOMsk
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2010
Thank you!
The music is so much better on the ears; I do prefer this program to the screechy one.
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2012
the thing about gracie is that i can really appreciate the individual elements (like, nice triple combo, nice layback spin, et al), but the sum of these parts don't add up to the whole. don't get me wrong: if she hits, she'll score big. but it's terribly disjointed to me, and at least the previous gershwin's brashness and angularity seemed better at disguising that quality.
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
For me, Gracie looks so much more elegant and refined than before. Part of it is that I love her costume here, but she is also using her arms better. This partnership with Frank looks like it is going to help her improve in area which she needed the most help (artistry).
- Joined
- May 19, 2011
To be honest, painfully screechy violin music and windmill-y footwork aside, there was nothing that wrong with her first program. When I watched it with the music turned down it was okay. I think a different version of the music and a reworking of the footwork would have been fine...I'm not sure why they decided the scrap the entire thing. If anything her FS is what needed a complete do-over.
This new program is very blah and meh...bleh...it's a bleh program. It's all soft and pwetty and I just don't get why they keep steering this incredibly fast and powerful skater down this soft and delicate road with these programs. Why can no one give this poor girl a program that highlights her strengths and minimizes her weaknesses? Powerful fast skater = powerful fast music to highlight all of the power and speed. It's not rocket science people...
This is your typical run-of-the-mill generic pretty skating program. I do think her spins looked very fast in the video so that's a plus, but her arms are still too stiff and straight...I don't know if they'll ever be able to fix that. But overall, this is nothing special, unique or memorable.
Personally I think they should have spent their time working on her jumps; not redoing her SP. That's what's been what's missing this season. We all know it doesn't matter what she skates to as long as she lands the jumps and she hasn't been landing them. That's where the focus should have been. Now she'll have the task of debuting a new program at the most pressure-filled event of her life which is adding to the pressure she's already under, and we all know Gracie doesn't manage pressure well.
This new program is very blah and meh...bleh...it's a bleh program. It's all soft and pwetty and I just don't get why they keep steering this incredibly fast and powerful skater down this soft and delicate road with these programs. Why can no one give this poor girl a program that highlights her strengths and minimizes her weaknesses? Powerful fast skater = powerful fast music to highlight all of the power and speed. It's not rocket science people...
This is your typical run-of-the-mill generic pretty skating program. I do think her spins looked very fast in the video so that's a plus, but her arms are still too stiff and straight...I don't know if they'll ever be able to fix that. But overall, this is nothing special, unique or memorable. Personally I think they should have spent their time working on her jumps; not redoing her SP. That's what's been what's missing this season. We all know it doesn't matter what she skates to as long as she lands the jumps and she hasn't been landing them. That's where the focus should have been. Now she'll have the task of debuting a new program at the most pressure-filled event of her life which is adding to the pressure she's already under, and we all know Gracie doesn't manage pressure well.
To be honest, painfully screechy violin music and windmill-y footwork aside, there was nothing that wrong with her first program. When I watched it with the music turned down it was okay. I think a different version of the music and a reworking of the footwork would have been fine...I'm not sure why they decided the scrap the entire thing. If anything her FS is what needed a complete do-over.
This new program is very blah and meh...bleh...it's a bleh program. It's all soft and pwetty and I just don't get why they keep steering this incredibly fast and powerful skater down this soft and delicate road with these programs. Why can no one give this poor girl a program that highlights her strengths and minimizes her weaknesses? Powerful fast skater = powerful fast music to highlight all of the power and speed. It's not rocket science people...
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Only the first part is soft and pretty. The second part--the part where she does the footwork--is very powerful. Unfortunately, I don't think Gracie is up to interpreting this powerful music. Too bad Lori didn't give this music to Carolina this year. But the bottom line for Gracie is that this is much better than her Gershwin program, music-wise. The soft part helps her to restrain her helicopter arms and she may grow into the second part.
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
This new program is very blah and meh...bleh...it's a bleh program. It's all soft and pwetty and I just don't get why they keep steering this incredibly fast and powerful skater down this soft and delicate road with these programs. Why can no one give this poor girl a program that highlights her strengths and minimizes her weaknesses? Powerful fast skater = powerful fast music to highlight all of the power and speed. It's not rocket science people...
I agree with you, and the only thing that I can think of it that they are trying to create programs that are more palatable for the judges. While we see her as a power skater, maybe she sees herself as an artistic skater who is great at jumps. I do like this program (if only because I hated the last one) and it will score near 70 if skated well, which is about all we can ask from her at this point in her career.
The judges were fine with her original program. They were certainly giving her relatively high PCS for it. It's the online forum buzz that was very negative on it.
As someone that like the first SP just fine, I think this program is lovely. The Grieg piece isn't a huge warhorse (I believe the last time we heard it was when Miki did it in 2011?) and it does seem she is making improvements in presentation.
Also, she had to adjust the program to a smaller rink, so I don't think it's the best representation of what the program could be.
Also, she had to adjust the program to a smaller rink, so I don't think it's the best representation of what the program could be.
- Joined
- May 19, 2011
I agree and I'm sure it's Frank who demanded this change. From Tiffany Chin to Michelle Kwan to Evan Lysacek, all of Frank's skaters have been known for their presentation and artistry. Technically, they were all strong skaters but the technical side wasn't their forte; the artistic side was. I don't think Frank has ever had a skater whose forte was the technical, so he's just going with what he knows. Rather than giving Gracie Tosca, Carmina Burana or something strong and powerful to skate to, he's trying to encourage her artistic side to catch up with her technical side.
The program is nice and Gracie skates it well...but not as convincingly as someone who is naturally inclined to be artistic and graceful. Gracie is learning to be artistic and graceful; it's not natural to her and (to me) I can clearly see that in her delivery.
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2013
Ummmmm Frank did coach Tim Goebel....but I get your point.
I like the new SP much more than the previous one. Thank GOD she spared us from that horrible music.
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