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Thread: Gracie changing SP music?

  1. #76
    Tripping on the Podium penguin's Avatar
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    You can't do all your elements without the choreo and music without changing the program - you'd essentially be training two separate programs (or four, if we're talking both SP and LP), which is a serious waste of training time. Interpretation, transitions, and presentation are a huge part of the PCS score, and picking a different cut of music or changing your choreo would change up the entire feel of your program. I suppose somebody could do what you're suggesting, but it would be a recipe for failure imo. I think most skaters would rather optimize their chances for a clean skate than risk it because they wanted to surprise people.

  2. #77
    Tripping on the Podium
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    Wow, I honestly had no idea choreography affected jumps and other elements. (Other than obviously not taking the time to set up properly and footwork, where you have to do both at the same time) I always figured it was more like the floor routines in gymnastics - you could do a RO-bh-double layout no matter what music/choreography you did with it. So the important thing was to have your triple-triple consistent and then you could do it no matter if you were performing to Swan Lake, Les Miserables, or Riverdance.

    Is this only because of the COP system and it being more complex, or has it always been this way?

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenaj View Post
    I have found no evidence that Chris Dean ever disavowed Michelle's Bolero program, and I have looked. Dick Button didn't say he spoke with Dean so that is not evidence of anything but his opinion. To assume otherwise is speculation.
    Dick didn't say how he got his information.

    A well respected poster on the Kwan forum who seemed to have privy to inside information (none of the information she provided ever turned out wrong) posted:

    The words was after Dean watched Campbell's broadcasting, Dean called Rafael "It is very important that Michelle skates to the original one". Thus the next competetion they used the exact Dean version.....IMO, spent that type money asking for top choreographer to choregraph a program for her, she at least honered Dean by skating at least ONCE the COMPLETE Dean version 'Bolero'. Considering she only skated the program 5 times in public, and with all those adjustments needed for CoP, ONCE was not that bad, IMO.

  4. #79
    Tripping on the Podium
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    Getting back to Gracie: Does anyone even know what the new SP is? Inquiring minds want to know! Has Frank said anything?

  5. #80
    Celebrating the Excellence of #VirtueMoir golden411's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olderbear View Post
    Getting back to Gracie: Does anyone even know what the new SP is? Inquiring minds want to know! Has Frank said anything?
    On Wednesday night (Dec 11), Gold will perform her SP for a public audience.
    This Disson show will not be televised until February (the weekend before the Olympics start), but no doubt the news of her music choice will be available immediately.

    @GraceEGold
    Traveling to NJ today to perform my new short program at the #AmericanTribute ice show! #excited #AmericanLegends
    2:02 PM - 9 Dec 13
    https://twitter.com/GraceEGold/statu...67572609662977

    ETA:
    It's quite an opportunity for Gold's new SP, if she performs it well, to make a strong impression on a lot of significant eyeballs -- even though it is "just" a show.
    Wagner and Zawadzki also are cast members, so they will be among the first to see Gold's new SP live.
    As will the many former Olympians -- going back numerous decades -- who are scheduled to appear in the show.

  6. #81
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    How did Agnes get invited? Why not give Cesario a shot.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoundtracksOnIce View Post
    Wow, I honestly had no idea choreography affected jumps and other elements. (Other than obviously not taking the time to set up properly and footwork, where you have to do both at the same time) I always figured it was more like the floor routines in gymnastics - you could do a RO-bh-double layout no matter what music/choreography you did with it. So the important thing was to have your triple-triple consistent and then you could do it no matter if you were performing to Swan Lake, Les Miserables, or Riverdance.

    Is this only because of the COP system and it being more complex, or has it always been this way?
    The way choreography fits with the other jumps will always play into a program. Not only does the placement of the jumps need to fit the music, and the spin positions relate to the music, but skating various types of transitions and complex choreography will leave you with less stamina for the big skills. Skaters will probably still always do their best triple-triple or quad in a program, but they will be sure to place it in a way that at least somewhat works with the music but also allows them the best chance of landing it.

    Gymnastics isn't all that different. Yes, gymnasts will probably choose their highest scoring skills, but they will place them carefully in the routine so as to match the music (or will choose music that matches their skills). Just like skaters, gymnasts prefer to place their big skills earlier in the routine because they'll have more stamina. The more choreography and dance skills a gymnast does, the less stamina they will have for their tumbling, just as in skating. This is why some gymnasts pause in a corner before a tumbling run (though pausing too long is a deduction).

    Both sports supposedly have an artistry component (though both have regressed in that aspect since the new codes, gymnastics moreso than skating). In both sports, the time and energy spent on dancing/choreography will affect the big skills. Neither sport would be the same if the elements were performed in absence of a routine. There are lots of athletes who are great at the skills, but have trouble putting them in a routine.

  8. #83
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    I find it extremely rare that skaters do elements to accent the music that they are skating to. I think the good skaters can express the mood of the music well, but the type of things that Sasha would do with music is hard to find these days.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by flying camel View Post
    How did Agnes get invited? Why not give Cesario a shot.
    Trying to read the tea leaves of the Disson casting would be an exercise in futility, I believe.
    - For example, Davis/White are not in the cast. Chock/Bates recently were added. (Perhaps D/W had been asked and declined, but who knows?)
    - When the majority of the cast members first were announced back in September, Wagner and Zawadzki were listed from the beginning. Gold was not added until a few weeks later.
    That said, Disson's invitation to Zawadzki was/is totally reasonable, IMHO. Zawadzki, Wagner, and Gold were the three American ladies' skaters at both the spring and autumn USOC pre-Sochi media summits. (The spring summit included Gao as well.)

  10. #85
    Custom Title Victura's Avatar
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    FYI Gracie's new SP music is to Grieg Piano Concerto in A minor. The beginning is quite nice, from the slow section in the second movement. The second part is faster and more dramatic, which I didn't like as much. (Her arms tend to windmill and flail about much more in fast music, IMO.) Overall better than Three Preludes though. She did a 3Lz-3T, 3Lo, 2A. She two-footed the landing on the 3T in the combination and did it again twice in retakes.

  11. #86
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    I saw the performance and have to say I don't like the new program. The SP and FS are now both to romantic type music and I don't think that does Gracie any favors. She's just not the pretty princess type. While the old SP was grating on the ears, she performed it well and the judges liked it enough to reward her with high marks even when she wasn't perfect. IMO, you don't fix something that's working well.

    Alissa Czisny was in the show and she is a sad shadow of her former self. She did just one jump, a single axel, and even that seemed to cause her pain. She had a hard time keeping up with her music, and all her moves were slow and tentative, even the spins. The person sitting next to me kept wondering why Alissa was in the show, saying she could barely skate compared to all the other skaters.

  12. #87
    Custom Title Victura's Avatar
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    This is not an Alissa thread, but she did a double axel, and a rather nice one at that. I thought her spins were lovely. The program was to a Scotty McCreery song, and most programs to live singers on Disson shows are not exactly standouts, simply one-time performances that skaters don't really have time to choreograph anything to. She didn't look tentative or in pain to me at all, and I was sitting very close to the ice.

  13. #88
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    I tried searching YouTube but I couldn't find Gracie's new SP from the show. Do you think it will go up, or are we just going to have to wait until Nationals?

    Then again, the show was only last night, right? So maybe someone video taped it, although I'm sure they weren't supposed to

  14. #89
    Custom Title cinnamon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Alissa Czisny was in the show and she is a sad shadow of her former self. She did just one jump, a single axel, and even that seemed to cause her pain. She had a hard time keeping up with her music, and all her moves were slow and tentative, even the spins. The person sitting next to me kept wondering why Alissa was in the show, saying she could barely skate compared to all the other skaters.
    Quote Originally Posted by Victura View Post
    This is not an Alissa thread, but she did a double axel, and a rather nice one at that. I thought her spins were lovely. The program was to a Scotty McCreery song, and most programs to live singers on Disson shows are not exactly standouts, simply one-time performances that skaters don't really have time to choreograph anything to. She didn't look tentative or in pain to me at all, and I was sitting very close to the ice.
    Just happy to hear that Alissa was out there to perform in front of people. I hope videos will be up soon somewhere.

  15. #90
    Custom Title Sasha'sSpins's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sochi_2014 View Post
    I tried searching YouTube but I couldn't find Gracie's new SP from the show. Do you think it will go up, or are we just going to have to wait until Nationals?

    Then again, the show was only last night, right? So maybe someone video taped it, although I'm sure they weren't supposed to
    This was posted by user marysy (along with vids from a few other skaters at the show):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4idjEkR-Bs8

    I think it's a nice program for Gracie and by Nationals it could be a great thing. I still don't think there was any need to change her original SP when she was scoring so well with it. And I personally didn't have a problem with the music.

    OT but here's Alissa's skate since she was brought in the thread:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xW18UWOMsk

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