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Thread: Finnstep for the Short Dance

  1. #1
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Mathman started a great thread about the Finnstep in The Edge. These posts have the most technical material about the SD, pattern dance judging, & the Finnstep; I copied them into Reference and made this thread.

    Thanks Mathman!


    Here's R&K, dancinger their Quickstep OD, that was the prototype for the Finnstep, which I believe is from a French gangster movie called "Borsalino" named after a hat company that made fedora hats.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ieH0uk-cks
    Last edited by dorispulaski; 11-22-2013 at 05:50 AM.

  2. #2
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TontoK View Post
    How do they determine the level that a dance pair earns on the CD sequences?

    Theoretically, they're all doing the same sequence, right? So, what's the difference between a level 2 and a level 3, for example?
    From the Handbook for the Tech Panel, page 14

    Each pattern dance sequence (called "element" here) has three key points assigned.

    For level 1, no key points are judged correctly completed but:
    75% of Pattern Dance Element is completed by both partners
    For level 2:

    Pattern Dance Element is not interrupted more than 4 beats in total, either through Stumbles, Falls or any other reason
    AND
    1 Key Point is correctly executed
    For level 3
    Pattern Dance Element is not interrupted more than 4 beats in total, either through Stumbles, Falls or any other reason
    AND
    2 Key Points are correctly executed
    For level 4
    Pattern Dance Element is not interrupted at all, either through Stumbles, Falls or any other reason
    AND
    3 Key Points are correctly executed
    To get credit for a key point, the step(s) involved must be executed exactly as described in the rules. If this is true, you will see a Y for that key point on the protocol. If not executed correctly, you will see an N for that key point

    If the step is done correctly, but not on the correct beat of the music, the key point is not completed for the purpose of assigning a level, and you will see a T (for timing fault) for that key point.

    Note from the rules, even if the key points are judged correctly completed, including being on the correct beat of the music, the team will not earn a level 4 unless all the other steps are done.

  3. #3
    Celebrating the Excellence of #VirtueMoir golden411's Avatar
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    News ISU has published Ice Dance Technical Requirements Season 2013-14 (Mar 5)

    ISU has published Ice Dance Technical Requirements Season 2013-14 (Mar 5)

    Ice Dance Technical Requirements Season 2013-14
    05 March 2013
    ISU Communication 1782 has been published.

    The document is an 8-page PDF.
    * Finnstep key points are on p. 5. *

    As previously announced:

    SD rhythm options for Seniors are:
    - Quickstep
    or
    - Quickstep plus one or two of the following Rhythms: Foxtrot, Charleston, Swing.
    The Pattern Dance Elements must be skated on the Quickstep Rhythm, in the style of Quickstep. The Tempo of the music throughout the Pattern Dance Elements must be constant and in accordance with the required Tempo of the Pattern Dance Finnstep, i.e. 52 measures of two beats or 104 beats per minute, plus or minus 2 beats per minute.

    Pattern Dance Elements for Seniors:
    Two (2) Sections of Finnstep
     Section 1: Steps # 1-27
     Section 2: Steps # 28-70
    skated one after the other, Section 1 followed by Section 2, with Step # 1 skated on the Judges’ side.

  4. #4
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    And yes, the key points for the Finnstep (and Quickstep, which is a different dance, for the Juniors) are in that document that golden411 linked.

    Sequence 1
    Key point 1-this is odd, since the steps are not sequential!
    Lady & Man Steps 1 & 4 (XB-RF, XB-LF) and Lady Step 12 (LFO Tw1½ (Left Forward Outside one and a half rotation twizzle)
    1. XB-RF: free leg crossed behind the skating leg below the knee (Cross behind to right forward)
    2. XB-LF: free leg crossed behind the skating leg below the knee (Cross behind to right forward)
    3. Tw1½: correct Turn

    Keypoint 2
    Lady Steps 20-21 (XB-LBO, XF-RBI/RBI Tw1½/RFO)
    1. Tw1½: correct Turn
    2. XB-LBO: free leg crossed behind the skating leg below the knee
    3. XF-RBI: free leg crossed in front of the skating leg below the knee
    4. Correct Edge (RFO) after Tw1½

    Those guys better learn how to exit exactly in half a twizzle.

    Keypoint 3
    Man Steps 20-21 (XB-LFI, RFO-Sw3/RBI Tw1/RBI)
    1. Sw3, Tw1: correct Turns
    2. Sw3: correct swing movement of the free leg
    3. XB-LFI: free leg crossed behind the skating leg below the knee
    4. Correct Edge (RBI) after Tw1


    Sequence 2:
    Key Point 1
    The first 2 will be easy to spot because not only is there a Closed Choctaw, there is a slide into a stop)

    Lady Steps 32 & 33 (LFO Sw-ClCho, RBI/RBO/RBO Tw1½/RFI slide into stop)
    1. Correct Edges
    2. Sw-ClCho, Tw1½: correct Turns
    3. Sw-ClCho: correct placement of the free foot
    4. Sw-ClCho: correct swing movement of the free leg
    5. Correct Change of Edge (Inside to Outside)

    Key Point 2
    Key Point 2 Man Steps 32 to 33c (LFO Sw-ClCho, RBI OpMo, LFI, RFI/RFI Tw1/RFI slide into stop)

    1. Correct Edges
    2. Sw-ClCho, Tw1: correct Turns
    3. Sw-ClCho: correct placement of the free foot
    4. Sw-ClCho: correct swing movement of the free leg

    Key Point 3

    Lady & Man Steps 64 & 65 (LFI XB-ClCho, RBO3/RFI Tw1½)
    1. Correct Edges
    2. ClCho, 3, Tw1½: correct Turns
    3. XB-ClCho: correct placement of the free foot

    I got one KP in the first sequence, and all 3 in the second, but they did not split the dance at the 35 step point, so I didn't guess them placed in the right sequences .

    By the way, this ISU Communication 1728 confirms that the optional rhythams for senior are Foxtrot, Charleston, Swing.
    and for Junior Foxtrot, Charleston

  5. #5
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    The dance, for a CD is challenging, particularly the timing. P&C will have a relatively even playing field. Only teams who were at 2009 Europeans or 20090 4cc'S OR some of the European nationals in the 2008 - 2009 season have competed this dance.

  6. #6
    Custom Title FSGMT's Avatar
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    Useful videos:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrHfkgp5-xM
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfqkOjLlK2A
    (Notice: I didn't do them, I found them and I'm just posting them because I think they are helpful)

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    Thanks for that instructive video on the Finnstep. I am sure it will have enough difficulty for ice dancers to please most critics. (I posted this info in Fan Fest area) DWTS pro Derek Hough revealed that he will be doing choreo for Davis/White on a program for Sochi. Good bet that this will be the SD.

  8. #8
    Custom Title FSGMT's Avatar
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    And, if I understand well the rules, the twizzle has to be exactly of 1 revolution and a half (a very unusual move), not more, so I think that we will see a lot of levels 1 and 2 for excellent finnesteps because one of the partners has performed a twizzle that had more (or less) than 1 1/2 revolutions right? For skaters who usually have to perform 5/6/7-revolutions twizzles this will be incredibly difficult to perform at the level of perfection that the key-points judging system requires...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by FSGMT View Post
    And, if I understand well the rules, the twizzle has to be exactly of 1 revolution and a half (a very unusual move), not more, so I think that we will see a lot of levels 1 and 2 for excellent finnesteps because one of the partners has performed a twizzle that had more (or less) than 1 1/2 revolutions right? For skaters who usually have to perform 5/6/7-revolutions twizzles this will be incredibly difficult to perform at the level of perfection that the key-points judging system requires...
    I dont expect that to be a problem

  10. #10
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    I really like this dance, especially since it was only used at 2009 euros and four continents. It really separated the boys/girls from the men/women so to speak.

    What I'm looking forward to more though is the no touch diagonal step sequence

  11. #11
    Celebrating the Excellence of #VirtueMoir golden411's Avatar
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    ice-dance.com's article on the Finnstep and Quickstep pattern dances for 2013/14:

    Breaking It Down: Finnstep & Quickstep
    Created on Friday, 21 June 2013 02:03
    http://www.ice-dance.com/main/news/g...step-quickstep

  12. #12
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    Petri Kokko ‏@coccco
    Starting to see Finnsteps for the Olympic season makes me really proud of what we created with @ssusu https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TJA...e_gdata_player
    5:42 AM - 14 Sep 13
    https://twitter.com/coccco/status/378861189180030976

    [@ssusu = Susanna Rahkamo, of course]

  13. #13
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Some more instructional video for recognizing Finnstep keypoints

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrHfkgp5-xM

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfqkOjLlK2A

  14. #14
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    I think it was a mistake for the ISU to require both Finnstep sequences to be skated one after the other, rather than allowing transitions between, and other elements to be inserted between. It gives all the SD programs an unfortunate sameness about them.

  15. #15
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    And in fact, doing 1 1/2 twizzle and exiting on the clean edge prescribed has been one of the most often missed steps in the SD so far this season.

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