Psychologizing skaters: attributing success and failure to mental states | Golden Skate

Psychologizing skaters: attributing success and failure to mental states

Pepe Nero

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 11, 2011
Psychologizing skaters: attributing success and failure to mental states

Do you know what I hate? I know, you don't care what I hate. :) But still...

I hate when people commenting on figure skating (whether they are people paid for their opinions on television broadcasts or anonymous internet opinionators) psychologize skaters: attribute their successes or failures to what is going in their minds.

Here’s what I mean: Skater A has a bad skate in an important competition. “Oh, well, she is just so fragile. She gets really nervous. She is beautiful and oh-so talented, but can’t handle competition.”

Or: Skater B has a good skate in an important competition: “She really knows how to focus and quiet her demons. She doesn’t let the pressure get to her.”

I’m not saying these explanation aren’t sometimes true. My point is that no one who says these things ever has any basis for saying these things. Unless one is the skater herself, her coach, or her therapist, one has no basis for saying such things. Especially for explaining the quality (or lack thereof) of a particular performance.

(I’m using feminine pronouns because I think female figure skaters are overwhelmingly the ones who are psychologized. This is due, no doubt, to the global gender stereotype of women being ruled by their emotions.)

You all are with me, right? :)
 

Franklin99

Medalist
Joined
Nov 11, 2013
Do you know what I hate? I know, you don't care what I hate. :) But still...

I hate when people commenting on figure skating (whether they are people paid for their opinions on television broadcasts or anonymous internet opinionators) psychologize skaters: attribute their successes or failures to what is going in their minds.

Here’s what I mean: Skater A has a bad skate in an important competition. “Oh, well, she is just so fragile. She gets really nervous. She is beautiful and oh-so talented, but can’t handle competition.”

Or: Skater B has a good skate in an important competition: “She really knows how to focus and quiet her demons. She doesn’t let the pressure get to her.”

I’m not saying these explanation aren’t sometimes true. My point is that no one who says these things ever has any basis for saying these things. Unless one is the skater herself, her coach, or her therapist, one has no basis for saying such things. Especially for explaining the quality (or lack thereof) of a particular performance.

(I’m using feminine pronouns because I think female figure skaters are overwhelmingly the ones who are psychologized. This is due, no doubt, to the global gender stereotype of women being ruled by their emotions.)

You all are with me, right? :)

So true. The same psychological judging was done at last year summer Olympics esp. in Gymnastics and Track & Field.
 

penguin

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 31, 2012
I really, really hate the word "headcase." So diminishing, dismissive, and many times inaccurate, but it's used with alarming frequency to describe figure skaters. I wish it would stop.
 

CaroLiza_fan

EZETTIE LATUASV IVAKMHA
Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 25, 2012
Country
Northern-Ireland
I really, really hate the word "headcase." So diminishing, dismissive, and many times inaccurate, but it's used with alarming frequency to describe figure skaters. I wish it would stop.

This is something that really winds me up as well, penguin.

But, to be fair, I have noticed that this particular term is most often used by members who are from countries that do not speak English as their first language. Hence, I don't think they realise the true meaning of the term, and hence how diminishing it is.

Here is Google's definition of "Headcase":

headcase
Pronounciation: hɛdkeɪs
Noun Brit. informal
noun: headcase; plural noun: headcases; noun: head-case; plural noun: head-cases

  1. a mentally ill or unstable person.
synonyms:
madman/madwoman, maniac, lunatic; informal loony, nut, nutcase, nutjob, nutter, fruitcake, cuckoo, basket case, headbanger, schizo, crank, crackpot, oddball, weirdo, weirdie, sicko; informal odd bod; informal radge; informal screwball, crazy, kook, geek, nutso, meshuggener, wacko, wack; informal wing nut; informal dingbat; informal case

So, I think we do need to get it sensed into these members that "headcase" is not an acceptable way to describe a skater that is not performing to the standard that we would normally expect of them.

CaroLiza_fan
 

Alex D

Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 23, 2013
This is an interesting observation OP and yes, there are quite a lot people that forget quite fast, but at the same time praise you very quickly for a good performance.

Personally, I have also mentioned nerves in some of my articles, but that doesn't mean a Skater is bad or that I think bad of him / her. It is more an observation over a period of time.
You do have a few candidates that can be a bit nervous on the ice, but seriously who isn't? That's why all those practice sessions very often give you a much bigger view on the whole condition of a skater than the actual 3 or 4 minute program in the competition.

Still, some reviews or "analyst´s" indeed go a bit too far, especially if its about weight, costumes or program composition. A Skater shouldn't be attacked for having a specific program or outfit, there are always reasons why and those reasons a fan doesn't know in most cases. It is something that those would understand a lot better by being a skater themselves or actually having some more insight in the whole procedure, including talks to coaches or the skater him / herself.
 

RobinA

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
I disagree that you can't necessarily tell what is in a skater's mind. If you sit there and watch practice after pratice and the person does beautiful jumps and wonderful flowing run-throughs, and then that person shows up for the competition stiff as a board, splating throughout, I think it's fair to say they have a problem with nerves. Plus, the people commentating have been there. I'd venture to say that every skater walks out onto that ice with nerves buzzing in their heads. Some find a way of dealing, some don't. It's a big part of who stands on top of the podium and who does not.

And I will defend the use of "headcase," as it is frequently used in sports and everybody knows it doesn't mean "crackpot" or one of those other synonyms. It means a person whose psychology is getting in the way of their other abilities in the sport. Everybody in every sport has something (or a bunch of somethings) to conquer on their way to the top. It doesn't mean there is something wrong with them.

As spectators of sports, we speculate on what is going on. The speculation can go over the top, but when it doesn't, it's part of the fun of spectating.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Headcase is a particularly bad example because some skaters take a while to peak (see Kostner and Wagner) and yet people chew them out or say there's something wrong with them. Skating isn't easy. Most of the time skaters do not skate perfectly and are prone to errors. Mental errors are inevitable but it's hard attempting triples on ice so calling athletes a headcase when they make mistakes isn't fair nor does it heed how difficult it is to skate well.
 

coppertop1

On the Ice
Joined
Sep 19, 2006
Headcase is a particularly bad example because some skaters take a while to peak (see Kostner and Wagner) and yet people chew them out or say there's something wrong with them. Skating isn't easy. Most of the time skaters do not skate perfectly and are prone to errors. Mental errors are inevitable but it's hard attempting triples on ice so calling athletes a headcase when they make mistakes isn't fair nor does it heed how difficult it is to skate well.

I'd add Joannie Rochette to the late bloomer list as well, on the podium and hit her consistency at 23.

I think it's more about consistency and mental toughness-- to me that means being a good competitior. I know what people mean by headcase but how about finding another, more appropriate word for it. Why not just say "She's inconsistent".
 

coppertop1

On the Ice
Joined
Sep 19, 2006
Yeah, it's easier to insult a skater than just state the facts. I agree there's no need to insult a skater. Sandhu frustrated me with his inconsistency to no end, but I won't insult him, I'd just wonder why he was so inconsistent.
 

noidont

Final Flight
Joined
Mar 27, 2010
All "inconsistencies" stem from lack of training and/or lack of physical talent to a degree. So what's more polite, call a skater "lazy" or "inconsistent"? Keep in mind, no skater is truly lazy at that level, but some do work harder and are more focused than others, especially when they don't have money issue and/or other problems to worry about. If we don't psychologize a skater we could very well potentially physicalize them. It's a lot harder to dispute physical states than mental ones.

Personally I value intrinsic talent more than anything. Why is it that only winning is plausible? I don't mind Nikol Gosviani falling on all her triple jumps, as long as she moves beautifully in between them. She is just not a gifted jumper or even someone who has the winner mentality. Does it matter?
 

caitie

Medalist
Joined
Sep 14, 2013
I think sometimes it's hard to understand why you can watch a skater do beautiful jumps during warm ups... and then they go out and bomb their jumps in the program. I think skating is just frustrating because the audience naturally wants an explanation for why someone isn't performing well, and the idea that they are folding under pressure is the simplest explanation that most people jump to. If you're more knowledgable about skating, then maybe you look at other issues and take time to listen to what skaters are saying in their interviews. Like Javi mentioned that his jumps feel good in practice, but in his program something about the choreo/transition leading into it is throwing him off which obviously he and his team need to look at. Maybe Max Aaron is doing too many quads, maybe he's doing too many jumps too late in his program. Also, at this elite level I believe people often have a romanticized idea of athletes being up before dawn and training until after sundown, and the idea that they aren't training for every aspect of their competitions as much as they should or could be -- for whatever reason, sometimes it's because of a recent injury! -- doesn't necessarily leap to people's minds as the simplest explanation.
 

coppertop1

On the Ice
Joined
Sep 19, 2006
I wonder sometimes about the most artistic yet notoriously inconsistent skaters. Do they have an artistic temperament that makes it hard for them to coach or be consistent?
 

Robeye

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
All "inconsistencies" stem from lack of training and/or lack of physical talent to a degree. So what's more polite, call a skater "lazy" or "inconsistent"? Keep in mind, no skater is truly lazy at that level, but some do work harder and are more focused than others, especially when they don't have money issue and/or other problems to worry about. If we don't psychologize a skater we could very well potentially physicalize them. It's a lot harder to dispute physical states than mental ones.

Personally I value intrinsic talent more than anything. Why is it that only winning is plausible? I don't mind Nikol Gosviani falling on all her triple jumps, as long as she moves beautifully in between them. She is just not a gifted jumper or even someone who has the winner mentality. Does it matter?
It only matters for the purposes of modern competitive figure skating. For all other purposes, including private enjoyment according to one's very personal standards, be they logical/internally consistent or no; or imagining that it's the free skate of the 1972 Olympics and valuing accordingly (well, except for the winning part), it doesn't matter.

There is nothing wrong, of course, with making up one's own rules for enjoyment, but it must be recognized that someone watching a skate from such a private perspective, and someone else evaluating according to competition rules, are in a very real sense watching two entirely different things, even if they happen to be watching the same set of physical phenomena (say, a Gosviani skate).

What must also be recognized, IMO, is that there are very few public events, whether they be skating, or dance, or baseball, or spelling bees, which do not incorporate some communal notions of what is good or bad, better or worse, what wins or loses.

The vast majority of the audience do not spend time savoring, in even a local spelling bee, the creative ways in which a word can be (mis)spelled, except, perhaps, the parents of the offender, and maybe her third-grade boyfriend. ;)

Even in a more purely artistic endeavor such as dance, the winning/losing aspect of a public performance (as mediated according to some set of communitarian criteria) is merely more indirect and fragmented in process, not absent. If the dancer is great, according to the known criteria for that genre, she will be feted and celebrated, and will receive a leading place in the dance company.

The issue with someone like Gosviani, from the perspective of public appreciation, is that, given the current breadth and depth of the skater pool, there will always be skaters who have a more complete set of capabilities, including the ability to jump as well as the ability to do other things "in between".

There is always a place for appreciating skaters with brilliant skill/talent in some narrower aspect (e.g. a Lucinda Ruh, or a Katherine Healy), but, to reverse your proposition, to be able to excel at a broader array of criteria is not a bad thing.

IMHO, no skater reaches the very highest levels of the sport without having won a lot, without enjoying winning, and without some ambition to keep on winning until they have won the biggest prizes possible. I daresay that this probably applies to Nikol as well. Sure, I can appreciate those who did not win but demonstrated excellence in some way, but I believe that we need to give "winning" its pride of place, not least because the skaters themselves do.
 

phaeljones

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 18, 2012
I disagree that you can't necessarily tell what is in a skater's mind. If you sit there and watch practice after pratice and the person does beautiful jumps and wonderful flowing run-throughs, and then that person shows up for the competition stiff as a board, splating throughout, I think it's fair to say they have a problem with nerves. Plus, the people commentating have been there. I'd venture to say that every skater walks out onto that ice with nerves buzzing in their heads. Some find a way of dealing, some don't. It's a big part of who stands on top of the podium and who does not.

And I will defend the use of "headcase," as it is frequently used in sports and everybody knows it doesn't mean "crackpot" or one of those other synonyms. It means a person whose psychology is getting in the way of their other abilities in the sport. Everybody in every sport has something (or a bunch of somethings) to conquer on their way to the top. It doesn't mean there is something wrong with them.

As spectators of sports, we speculate on what is going on. The speculation can go over the top, but when it doesn't, it's part of the fun of spectating.

:agree:

The mental aspect is a big part of all sport, this one especially. There are certain skaters who always skate well under relatively little pressure but never skate well under immense pressure. You can't describe that skater without describing the mental component. I don't think that I am a "hater", but the term "headcase" seems to apply to at least a few of them. Trying to figure out the mental aspect is an integral part of accurately understanding the sport. The mental aspect is a fact of the sport. Are we just supposed to ignore the reality of it?

Even the best and highest-winning skaters occasionally get mental blow-outs. Some skaters, we all know, get them more frequently. (We each have our own list and I am not going to give you mine. :p ) It does not mean that they are bad skaters, but it does mean that they have mental issues affecting their competitive standing (at least at a particular time). I can't imagine anyone on this board, when making predictions about who is going to win which event, not taking into account the mental state of the skater based on their past performances. And if there actually is, I would love to wager a few bets with them.

Regarding the term headcase, whether it is used properly or improperly, nicely or in hate, it depends on the nature and motive of the user. It can be appropriate and it can be used without mal-intent. I don't think that I have ever used it (although I may have), but I sure have thought it. There are "haters", very true, and they over-use terms like "headcase", but I don't think that they would be slowed down without the term being there. As well, the term can be used in contexts of fair objectivity (or at least in a way that is as objective as an opinion or perception can be).

This is a competitive sport. People judge the competitors and they can't help but assess the mental aspect, as best as possible, of the skaters over time based on performance. It is part of the way we rank the skaters. Anyone who cannot handle that should not compete as a skater and maybe not even in sports. I respect the compassion and kindness of the contrary opinion, but I cannot agree with it. Sorry.
 

Poodlepal

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 14, 2010
There are athletes who can competen well under pressure and those who can't. It happens in all sports. I can think of two players on my favorite baseball team, the Yankees, who were famous for suddenly slumping in the playoffs after playing well all year. Was it nerves and pressure? Probably to some degree.

I think we ask a lot of these kids, in a way. To be a successful competitor at this sport, you'd have to be an extreme extrovert, feeling no nervousness at being judged or having no performance anxiety being in front of a crowd. But you'd also have to be an extreme introvert to give up most of your teenage social life to spend time in a rink with adults working on which way your foot is leaning on your lutz. It's a rare person who can be both.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
...very few public events, whether they be skating, or dance, or baseball, or spelling bees,…

Off topic, but speaking of spelling bees, why are Indian children better spellers than anyone else in the U.S.?

The last six winners of the National Spelling Bee are Sameer Mishra, Kavya Shivashankar, Anamika Veeramani, Sukanya Roy, Snigdha Nandipati, and Arvind Mahankali (edging out Vismaya Kharkar (6th), Vanya Shivashankar (sister of Kavya, 5th), Nikitha Chandran, Amber Born (!!!, 4th), Sriram Hathwar (bronze), and Pranav Sivakumar (silver).

Me, I'm too much of a head case to watch the National Spelling Bee on TV. It makes me too nervous. :yes:
 

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
Off topic, but speaking of spelling bees, why are Indian children better spellers than anyone else in the U.S.?

The last six winners of the National Spelling Bee are Sameer Mishra, Kavya Shivashankar, Anamika Veeramani, Sukanya Roy, Snigdha Nandipati, and Arvind Mahankali (edging out Vismaya Kharkar (6th), Vanya Shivashankar (sister of Kavya, 5th), Nikitha Chandran, Amber Born (!!!, 4th), Sriram Hathwar (bronze), and Pranav Sivakumar (silver).

Me, I'm too much of a head case to watch the National Spelling Bee on TV. It makes me too nervous. :yes:

I believe that you mean Indian-AMERICAN children, Mathman. :) Most, if not all of the kids mentioned above, are American-born, IIRC.
And I would add that of the spellers whom you listed, I'm pretty sure that one or more actually is of Pakistani -- as opposed to Indian -- descent.

As to the point of your question, my hunch is that a cultural/family emphasis on education in general is a large part of the explanation.
For example, I am 99% certain that one of the boys named above won the National Geography Bee as well -- might have even been the same year that he won the Spelling Bee. :bow:
 
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