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Thread: Tuktamysheva's Career

  1. #16
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    Elizaveta definitely has chances in the future. She could improve alot further, and we have no idea how Adelina, Julia, and Anna will all progress in the future, or in the case of Radiaonova and Lipnitskaia what will happen when their bodies change.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    I think Julia will always be a consistent skater. She already had most of her growth spurt and came out well. Her jumps are not big, but not tiny as some of her detractors say. They are much bigger than say Caroline Zhang ever did. What her career will become I dont know, but I think she will be the consistent champion Russia looks for.
    Julia may have grown TALLER, but that is only one stage of growth: she hasn't gone through physical maturity yet, and that is the stage that killed Caroline Zhang's skating. Julia may be 15, but she has the body of a 10-year-old prepubescent girl. Once she develops hips and curves and her center of gravity changes, she may struggle with jumps the way Adelina does.

  3. #18
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    Number one necessity is to change coaches. The current situation not working for sp or pcs. She can do technically flawless lp with close to no errors. The problem though is none of her fs jumps matter because of the sp and horrible pcs. New coach and jump doctor! Get away from her current situation. It's ruining her career.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by hurrah View Post
    I love Liza's jumps, but she looks to be someone who doesn't have the physical capability to have the proper stamina to be an elite athlete.
    I think that once the dust settles after Sochi, the only wonderbaby standing will be Adelina. The rest will fall by the wayside (even Elena, and I love her to bits).
    How horrible! Sotnikova the only one? So back to the post slutskaya era then? 2006-2008?

  5. #20
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    Elizaveta is 17 years old and having to adjust to her body changes, something that happens to all teens. And people are already writing her off? This is pretty sad. It seems there's an impatience and a demanding attitude towards these girls where if they don't do it NOW and ALL THE TIME they are done. What happened to acknowledging a skater has potential but has time to mature? Maybe a new coach would do her good, Mishin doesn't really strike me as a super supportive type, and maybe not the best coach to guide a teenage girl through maturity.

    However, she isn't done by far. People wrote off Irina Slutskaya after 1998-99 and look at how she came back. This isn't the Tara Lipinski jumping bean era, most of the world champions have been older teens, and there are several women. Ashley Wagner, Joannie Rochette, Carolina Kostner and Akiko Suzuki all broke through as mature women, and Suzuki at the "Ripe" age of 26-27 won her first world medal.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by coppertop1 View Post
    Mishin doesn't really strike me as a super supportive type, and maybe not the best coach to guide a teenage girl through maturity.
    I agreed with pretty well everything you said except for this load of bull.

    Please show me an example where Mishin has been unsupportive of Liza (or of Artur, who has also been having a rough time). Your answer will be blank. He has been incredibly supportive and good with both of them.

    *

    Elizaveta Tuktamysheva thread:

    - weight issues mentioned - check
    - calls for retirement/declarations that she's done - check
    - get a new coach - check
    - mental issues mentioned - check
    - unfounded hate - check

    Ah, must have been started by sky_fly20.

  7. #22
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    Maybe Liza needs another packaging indeed. I dont know yet for coach change, I wait for her to pass her growing up seasons. Mishin is brining in his team great choreographers for Liza, he is open to changes. Arthur also has worked with many known ones. I think the issue is somewhere else because when she started seniors she had better programs and costumes. I love that I have been following her since 2008, when she was a jumping bean, to being a great young lady and I m looking forward to seeing her more, but probably this season is not her season.
    Mishin is really supportive of his students and in failure even more, I can sign it in a paper. From Plush to the tiny ones in his group. Also Elisaveta has two coaches, and with the encouragement of Mishin she kept her old coach for this very reason, he knew she woud need a female advice once she grows to a teen.

  8. #23
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    She's too strong a skater to dismiss because of a bad year. If her technique were letting her down it would be one thing, but I think learning to compete mentally and dealing with nerves has a learning curve, and you don't fix that all at once. She's younger than some other skaters who are considered to be on their way up (Gracie Gold, Samantha Cesario, Katelyn Osmond) so it seems silly to dismiss Liza as past her peak. Adelina is starting to really pull it together this season; I don't see why Liza can't also figure it out.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by karne View Post
    I agreed with pretty well everything you said except for this load of bull.

    Please show me an example where Mishin has been unsupportive of Liza (or of Artur, who has also been having a rough time). Your answer will be blank. He has been incredibly supportive and good with both of them.
    OK, maybe I was a bit hasty in that one.

    *

    Elizaveta Tuktamysheva thread:

    - weight issues mentioned - check
    - calls for retirement/declarations that she's done - check
    - get a new coach - check
    - mental issues mentioned - check
    - unfounded hate - check

    Ah, must have been started by sky_fly20.
    It's ridiculous. I like Liza. If she has weight issues, we're all doomed! She has an athletic build, not everyone has to look like Sasha Cohen (is that Dick Button's influence at work that all skaters should look like the American ballerina skaters). She's not done, like I said why do we now demand they deliver as soon as they hit senior ranks. Maybe a new coach would help, maybe not. Mishin has had success with several skaters, if he has coached Liza this far, she must think he's a good coach an dif he's open then that's good. Mental issues? Or maybe she's feeling the pressure of a deep field in an Olympic year. Is the deliver now or you're done mentality what Lipnitskaia and Radionova are in for? Makes me think it's not worth being a teen star when people only like you when you're young and cute, and lose faith when you struggle.

    Yup, it was started by sky_fly20. She borders on trolling it seems.

  10. #25
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    Yeah mental issues that are common for athletes and why there's a branch for sports psychology. Sports specific psychologists that do nothing but deal with athletes. What's the deal with the bad Short Programs?

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Julia may have grown TALLER, but that is only one stage of growth: she hasn't gone through physical maturity yet, and that is the stage that killed Caroline Zhang's skating. Julia may be 15, but she has the body of a 10-year-old prepubescent girl. Once she develops hips and curves and her center of gravity changes, she may struggle with jumps the way Adelina does.
    Julia does not look like a 10 year old girl - that's Elena. I think very feasibly Julia does not change much physically in coming years. To me she looks like a slight athlete of 15, not a little kid. Some women do stay very petite and thin as adults. My aunt is 5'2" and about 90 or 95 lbs, she's in her 50s and has been that size since her late teens and was even thinner in her early teens. But she hit puberty at 13 and then just didn't change much afterwards. And she was never much of an athlete and she eats like a normal person, she's just in general an active, nervous person and has good genetics. Given that and how Julia looks now, I think there's a good chance that her mature build is 5'2" and 90 or 95 pounds - which is what Sasha was in her competitive days and what my aunt is.

  12. #27
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    If she has good skating skill, her career might be salvageable post Sochi. Problem is her SS is subpar. Slow, little ice coverage. Basically a Caroline Z with better jumps.
    Last edited by seniorita; 12-08-2013 at 04:29 AM.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    Anna had quite a good competition at the Final and lost to Adelina who had a poor LP again. So that doesnt bode well for Anna's chances to beat out Sotnikova for the 2nd spot.
    I agree with it not boding well considering Sotnikova's horrible LP... However Pogorilaya did not have "quite a good competition", considering the botched axel in the SP (6th) and fall/errors in the LP (5th). She placed last and scored 13 points less than her personal best.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    I agree with it not boding well considering Sotnikova's horrible LP... However Pogorilaya did not have "quite a good competition", considering the botched axel in the SP (6th) and fall/errors in the LP (5th). She placed last and scored 13 points less than her personal best.
    Yes, it was far from Pogorilaya's best but she still held it together, and her FS was 8 points better than Sotnikova. I think at this point clean SPs should really be the focus of Pogo, her 3lz-3t is strong and she can do the spins, and as we saw at GPF she really needs a good start order to help boost her PCS up. She's always solid enough in the FS. At GPF it was unfortunate the fall came at the end because it ended what had been a good skate on a bad note and caused her to rush her last spin (resulting in a level 1) and finish late (resulting in a time deduction). So between the fall and the spin and time violation, and that all that probably hurt her PCS, she lost about 5 or 6 points in the program.

    Further, Sotnikova is usually good enough in the SP, and Liza is usually pretty good in the FS, so what Anna needs to focus on to maximize her chances to make it to Euros (or even the Olympics) is having a clean SP and a solid FS. It's great if she can go clean in the FS, but we have seen she's usually reliable to land most of her jumps, unlike Adelina, and recently Liza's SPs have been getting better and her FSs worse, so really, clean SP is the ticket for Anna, had she had a clean SP at GPF, she would have beaten Sotnikova overall and maybe could have skated 2nd in the FS instead of 1st.

    For Liza doing a clean SP with 3lz-3t would also help her chances immensely because even though some of her FS scores have not been terrific this season, they have all been over 110 and some in the 120s, so if she could just skate a clean SP, then she could beat Adelina if Adelina has a FS like Japan Open, CoC, or GPF. But idk, I guess I'm more confident for Anna to skate a clean SP than Liza just because SPs have been Liza's nemesis for some time now and Anna skated clean SPs all last season and this season has only botched the axel, which she has been able to do in the FS. Of course, Liza can do her jumps in the FS too and had a great SP at Russian Nats last season so maybe there is still hope.

    At this point though, even with the meltdowns, I think Adelina is going to the Olympics. At her best she is quite good and will score higher than Liza or Anna, so she is the logical guess. I think the only way Liza or Anna gets on the team now is if they beat Adelina at Nationals and Euros (and beat her overall, not just in the FS).

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by silverlake22 View Post
    Julia does not look like a 10 year old girl - that's Elena. I think very feasibly Julia does not change much physically in coming years. To me she looks like a slight athlete of 15, not a little kid. Some women do stay very petite and thin as adults. My aunt is 5'2" and about 90 or 95 lbs, she's in her 50s and has been that size since her late teens and was even thinner in her early teens. But she hit puberty at 13 and then just didn't change much afterwards. And she was never much of an athlete and she eats like a normal person, she's just in general an active, nervous person and has good genetics. Given that and how Julia looks now, I think there's a good chance that her mature build is 5'2" and 90 or 95 pounds - which is what Sasha was in her competitive days and what my aunt is.
    Julia is already 5'2" but has NO hips and NO bust. She looks like a tallish 10-11 year-old girl who hasn't gone through puberty yet. Inevitably, Julia's body will change.

    It was said years ago that Liza would remain small as her family were all small. Yes, Liza is small, but she did grow, only out rather than up. Adelina grew up, then her body matured and she is still struggling to adjust to those changes.

    Sasha Cohen was a small girl and is still a small woman, but she struggled with her jumps early in her career as she went through that difficult pubescent stage.

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