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Thread: French Nationals 2013-2014. Dec. 12 to 15th

  1. #16
    Tripping on the Podium
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    Nope, not me. I've been really looking forward to seeing Papadakis/Cizeron FD, but I haven't been able to find anything.

  2. #17
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    Men LP -top 3, TSS = TES + PCS SS TR PE CH IN Deduction

    1 Brian JOUBERT FRA 155.97 74.11 81.86 8.31 7.75 8.31 8.25 8.31 0.00 #6
    2 Florent AMODIO FRA 148.97 63.83 85.14 8.63 8.13 8.56 8.50 8.75 0.00 #7
    3 Chafik BESSEGHIER FRA 141.16 69.02 72.14 7.44 6.88 7.19 7.31 7.25 0.00 #5

    Overall -top 3

    1 Florent AMODIO FRA 227.86 1 2
    2 Brian JOUBERT FRA 226.45 2 1
    3 Chafik BESSEGHIER FRA 205.25 3 3

    Very happy for Brian to win LP! Congrats to Florent to win his third Nats.

    But sad sad to see Brian clearly outskated Florent but still lost overall, due to lower PCS... I love Florent and Brian both as skaters, for a different reason, but Brian surely has better SS than Florent. As for TR, on par with Florent's, at least (if we talk about 'rather transitionless' programs compared to other top skaters' such as Patrick's)...

  3. #18
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowflake View Post
    Seems to me that French figure skating is declining, which is sad. Brian and Florent not at all in previous forms. And where are the young guys taking over? Some hopes for ladies though Is James/Cipres the only French pair? I do'nt follow dance closely, but Pechalat/Bourzat has been my favorite pair for ten years now. Suppose this is their last season. I really hope they medal in Sochi.
    Popova/Massot are the second French pair, but she is injured at the moment. Technically the second French dance team is Carron/Jones, and they were away at the Universiade (which they won easily). The third/close to second team is Papadakis/Cizeron, but this is just their first senior season. The men's field isn't too promising at the senior/junior level - I don't know what Amodio's plans are following this season, but Besseghier isn't a podium threat, I heard they might have some promising kids at the novice level.

    I share your hopes re P/B and also hope that Joubert and Amodio will be in better form later this season, especially Joubert.

    Quote Originally Posted by deedee1 View Post
    Very happy for Brian to win LP! Congrats to Florent to win his third Nats.

    But sad sad to see Brian clearly outskated Florent but still lost overall, due to lower PCS... I love Florent and Brian both as skaters, for a different reason, but Brian surely has better SS than Florent. As for TR, on par with Florent's, at least (if we talk about 'rather transitionless' programs compared to other top skaters' such as Patrick's)...
    I think the FFSG wanted Amodio as the national champion and that message went through loud and clear to the judges. Amodio did have his 4S, but otherwise seems to have been in about same form as he was on the GP, and we know what sort of marks he got there (note that French Nats tend to track international scores more closely than most nationals). We'll see what happens later this season...

  4. #19
    Custom Title LRK's Avatar
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    It also seems to me that Brian has been dubbed "Just a Jumper" while Florent is "The Artist" - so obviously Brian can't have higher PCS; stands to reason, no? (There is more than one kind of Reputation scoring). And I say this as someone who actually likes Florent. I just don't like the putting people in boxes, with a neat little lable on it. Also, as a Brian fan, I'm really tired of people undervaluing his actual skating and performance. The Swedish Eurosport commentators actually put him in the same sentence with... Kevin van der Perren! After just having remarked that while his (KVDP's) jumps were nice, they wondered how he managed to skate from one side of the rink to the other without falling down... This was a year or two ago, obviously, but they have scarcely anything nice to say about Brian, ever. His jumps they'll praise, but that's it. When they actually say something nice, like, "well, he does have personality on the ice, we can't take that away from him", I'm in actual shock... Anyway, sorry about that. It just annoys me, rather... If anyone could tell.

  5. #20
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    The majority of Joubert's programs (in terms of choreo and transitions) are very basic... but so are Amodio's! Both Amodio's programs this season are really empty and have hardly any redeeming features, to be honest. Amodio does have better posture and lines and whilst his SS aren't as good, he has very smooth edges. But I don't really see how the big gap on the PCS is justified.

    Joubert is basically getting the 'kthxbye' message. Maybe it's a continuation of Gailhaguet's power trip.

  6. #21
    Custom Title LRK's Avatar
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    Yes, that's what confuses me... Amodio - or his programs - never get the same kind of flak that Brian does. On the contrary. And I feel mean saying that - it's not that I sit around wondering "Hey, why does no one pitch into Florent?!" - it's just that I don't really get the dissonance. But so it is. Brian is "The Jumper", so nothing he does apart from that can be any good - while Florent is "The Artist", so obviously he can do no wrong in that department... It's the only explanation I've been able to come to as to the discrepancy... Oh, well... (shrugs) I'l (try to) shut up about it now; don't want to bore everyone silly.

    PS - just a little thing more... They're for ever denigrating Brian's skating skills - and I mean skating skills, not transitions. "Skridskoskicklighet" - apparently he's got... none.

  7. #22
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    The majority of Joubert's programs (in terms of choreo and transitions) are very basic... but so are Amodio's! Both Amodio's programs this season are really empty and have hardly any redeeming features, to be honest. Amodio does have better posture and lines and whilst his SS aren't as good, he has very smooth edges. But I don't really see how the big gap on the PCS is justified.
    I think that 1. Joubert's programs this season are promising, and I agree with LRK that he's consistently underrated on the non-jump aspects of his skating, often by people who apparently last saw him skate in 2005 or so (not referring to you). 2. Amodio is a wonderfully musical skater, but the programs he gets don't showcase that even remotely well. What a waste.

    Joubert is basically getting the 'kthxbye' message. Maybe it's a continuation of Gailhaguet's power trip.
    I hope that's the message he gives Gailhaguet when the FFSG asks him to skate in the post-Olympic tour. Joubert has better options lined up anyway.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowflake View Post
    Seems to me that French figure skating is declining, which is sad. Brian and Florent not at all in previous forms. And where are the young guys taking over? Some hopes for ladies though Is James/Cipres the only French pair? I do'nt follow dance closely, but Pechalat/Bourzat has been my favorite pair for ten years now. Suppose this is their last season. I really hope they medal in Sochi.
    Shocking to see only 3 Dance teams competing (C/J were at Universiade I realize) but the score for the 3rd team is …?!?

  9. #24
    Custom Title Mattieu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lcd View Post
    Shocking to see only 3 Dance teams competing (C/J were at Universiade I realize) but the score for the 3rd team is …?!?
    There were 2 withdrawals, which would've had better scores than the 3rd team here, though nowhere near Papadakis/Cizeron.
    France will only have 2 viable senior couples post Sochi, Carron/Jones and Papadakis/Cizeron thanks to the Federation's lack of care of up and coming couples

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mattieu View Post
    There were 2 withdrawals, which would've had better scores than the 3rd team here, though nowhere near Papadakis/Cizeron.
    France will only have 2 viable senior couples post Sochi, Carron/Jones and Papadakis/Cizeron thanks to the Federation's lack of care of up and coming couples
    Yeah, and Carron/Jones might even retire shortly after Sochi (like maybe stick around for two more seasons and then go). Not that I've heard anything about that, but they have been around awhile.

  11. #26
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    Oh and I'm glad Brian was able to at least win the free skate and only finish a point behind overall. Not bad for someone who got such a *cough* late start on his season.

  12. #27
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    I know that Carron/Jones have recently beaten Papadakis/Cizeron in front of an international judging panel but it's quite unfair that the latter didn't get an opportunity for a face off here.

  13. #28
    Custom Title Mattieu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    I know that Carron/Jones have recently beaten Papadakis/Cizeron in front of an international judging panel but it's quite unfair that the latter didn't get an opportunity for a face off here.
    They also had a face off at French Masters, where Carron/Jones beat Papadakis/Cizeron convincingly. So Papadakis/Cizeron have had 2 opportunities to beat Carron/Jones in direct competition, that seems more than a fair judgement of which is the stronger couple, one national and one international competition. So even if Carron/Jones had been present at Nationals, and had been beaten by Papadakis/Cizeron, that would still be 2 out of 3 competitions in Carron/Jones favour.

    To be fair to Carron/Jones, they have shown marked progression after a couple of years of stagnation, and have also put out consistent performances all season.

    I think medium and long term Papadakis/Cizeron have more potential and are world podium material, particularly him, but at the present moment Carron/Jones are simply the stronger couple. You can't mark "potential", you have to mark what is put out there.

    So for my money, despite my love of Papadakis/Cizeron, I'd rather see a consistent, experienced mature couple get Sochi, than a couple who are young, inexperienced and inconsistent, as could be seen in their contra-performance in the Russian GP. A couple just up from juniors will always be an unknown quantity.

    HAVING SAID ALL THAT, THE FRENCH FEDERATION AKA DIDIER, WILL SEND WHOEVER THEY WANT TO REGARDLESS OF RESULTS!!

  14. #29
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    As much as I love Papadakis/Cizeron who are clearly more promising long-term, I agree with you on all points Mattieu. Carron/Jones are having a very good season and I think their FD is stunning.

  15. #30
    Custom Title LRK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue_idealist View Post
    Oh and I'm glad Brian was able to at least win the free skate and only finish a point behind overall. Not bad for someone who got such a *cough* late start on his season.
    And especially considering, too, all the mistakes he had in his NRW Trophy FP... Also, he said he was "not ready" - we know what can happen when he is "not ready" (ahem - Olympics 2010... )

    But, anyway, here's his FP:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRXZZ...ature=youtu.be

    (The sound is weird, though... You can barely hear Brian's music, and WTH is going on in the background? You can hear some other, tinny, music going on as well, and what sounds like... an announcer... ? - shakes head - yeah, I don't know... )

    Any other videos? (I'm especially curious about James/Cipres.)

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