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Thread: Brian Boitano announces he's gay before trip to Sochi

  1. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    Perhaps it will be better for you to stop pretending that you know more than I do. Also read through the related threads ( Over a half dozen of them were there currently. At least a couple of them were gone, unfortunately.) in the politics section where people have discussed on this topic in deeps.

    Science and history are there for everyone who is willing to study. Calling others "ignorant" is just a way to quickly put off and discredit the different views.
    I did not call you ignorant nor did I imply you are. Furthermore, I don't understand why you are being so agitated about this. At the end of the day, people are free to believe what they want, irrespective of scientific evidences. Some people firmly believe the Earth is flat even though science says otherwise. Likewise, science says human sexuality is innate and hard wire, some people continue to believe it's a "choice" and "changeable" or "can be learned or promoted". Even if it's a choice, for the sake of argument, one's religion is a choice as well so why should religious freedom be protected while the former is not?

    You have every right to express your disdain for any topics just as people have the right to dislike your viewpoint and let you know about it.

  2. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    Perhaps it will be better for you to stop pretending that you know more than I do. Also read through the related threads ( Over a half dozen of them were there currently. At least a couple of them were gone, unfortunately.) in the politics section where people have discussed on this topic in deeps.

    Science and history are there for everyone who is willing to study. Calling others "ignorant" ( though you didn't use the exact word, many did, you have hint the same meaning ) is just a way to quickly put off and discredit the different views.
    There's a distinction between different views and views that are disparaging to other people. Certainly on GS, homophobia and remarks that say really foul things about people, even if it's one's own discriminatory views, shouldn't be tolerated (and you shouldn't be surprised when people aren't tolerating your intolerance). Also, when you say things like being gay is a behaviour, when overwhelming scientific evidence and testimonies of many LGBT people who say they were "born this way" have proven otherwise, expect to be called on it too. As mentioned, there are people who will always claim the world is flat, just as there are those who claim these laws protect children and that gays have some agenda (even though there is no evidence of this - other than 'evidence' from religious groups that denounce LGBT people).

  3. #153
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    According to the Royal College of Psychiatrists Study (2013)
    “The Royal College of Psychiatrists holds the view that LGB people should be regarded as valued members of society who have exactly similar rights and responsibilities as all other citizens. This includes equal access to health care, the rights and responsibilities involved in a civil partnership, the rights and responsibilities involved in procreating and bringing up children, freedom to practice a religion as a lay or religious person, freedom from harassment or discrimination in any sphere and a right to protection from therapies that are potentially damaging, particularly those that purport to change sexual orientation

    There is now a large body of research evidence that indicates that being gay, lesbian or bisexual is compatible with normal mental health and social adjustment. However, the experiences of discrimination in society and possible rejection by friends, families and others, such as employers, means that some LGB people experience a greater than expected prevalence of mental health and substance misuse problems.
    Although there have been claims by conservative political groups in the USA that this higher prevalence of mental health difficulties is confirmation that homosexuality is itself a mental disorder, there is no evidence whatever to substantiate such a claim

    In conclusion the evidence would suggest that there is no scientific or rational reason for treating LGB people any differently to their heterosexual counterparts. Socially inclusive, non-judgemental attitudes to LGB people who attend places of worship or who are religious leaders themselves will have positive consequences for LGB people as well as for the wider society in which they live.”

    Additionally there is no substantive evidence to suggest parenting or early childhood experiences play a role when it comes to sexual orientation.

  4. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    I did not call you ignorant nor did I imply you are.
    My apology if you didn't mean that.

    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    science says human sexuality is innate and hard wire, some people continue to believe it's a "choice" and "changeable" or "can be learned or promoted".
    Where did science say that? In the politics section, There was a link about homosexual activities in Arab world which has shown perfectly that sexual behavior could be used and adopted. Isn't a fact better than some politicalized "scientific studies"? One cannot make a clear cut on whether it is a choice or it is not. For some, it might be a hard to resistant temptation. For others, it could be an easy alternative, chosen behavior. In fact, some of the homosexual people themselves have admitted that they chose to be homosexuals. Human nature is much more complicated and human behavior is largely a choice and environmentally bound.

    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    Even if it's a choice, for the sake of argument, one's religion is a choice as well so why should religious freedom be protected while the former is not?
    I did not say this. The problem is what is "human rights"? I do not believe that having access to all children and introducing homosexual concepts to 5 year olds is human right. While we accept the existence of homosexuality in human race, it should not be celebrated, encouraged, promoted especially among minors who do not know what to follow and imitate.

    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    You have every right to express your disdain for any topics just as people have the right to dislike your viewpoint and let you know about it.
    Sure.

  5. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    I did not say this. The problem is what is "human rights"? I do not believe that having access to all children and introducing homosexual concepts to 5 year olds is human right. While we accept the existence of homosexuality in human race, it should not be celebrated, encouraged, promoted especially among minors who do not know what to follow and imitate.
    Just because you don't condone homosexuality doesn't mean other people shouldn't be allowed to be proud of who they are. By virtue of being something and not being treated as abnormal, you are not "promoting it". Are a man and a woman kissing in public in front of minors "promoting heterosexuality" and "indoctrinating them into choosing to be straight"?

    The relationships of LGBT people don't affect your life, and if you think they're making kids impressionable or prone to their own same sex relationships, feel free to spread your own "straight propaganda" and make out with a man in front of kids or give pamphlets on how great it is to be straight, in order to reel them back in. Because, you know, that's totally how kids work.

  6. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Just because you don't condone homosexuality doesn't mean other people shouldn't be allowed to be proud of who they are. By virtue of being something and not being treated as abnormal, you are not "promoting it".
    By showing off your pride in semi naked and/or cross dressed in a parade?

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Are a man and a woman kissing in public in front of minors "promoting heterosexuality" and "indoctrinating them into choosing to be straight"?
    Yes, that's true. That should be limited too. Many parents do pay attention to avoid it being seen by their little kids. That's why there is a thing called "age appropriate". However, sorry to point this, but without straight sexual activities, you will not be on this earth, and human race will not go on.

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    The relationships of LGBT people don't affect your life, and if you think they're making kids impressionable or prone to their own same sex relationships, feel free to spread your own "straight propaganda" and make out with a man in front of kids or give pamphlets on how great it is to be straight, in order to reel them back in. Because, you know, that's totally how kids work.
    That was true before, but it is not true anymore.

  7. #157
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    How do the relationships of gay people adversely affect your life personally, other than their very relationship being an affront to your own prejudiced views? Do you sleep less at night, or have emotional issues, or are physically harmed by men being in relationships with other men and women with women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    By showing off your pride in semi naked and/or cross dressed in a parade?
    I have done neither. Now who's generalizing about gays?

  8. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    How do the relationships of gay people adversely affect your life personally, other than their very relationship being an affront to your own prejudiced views? Do you sleep less at night, or have emotional issues, or are physically harmed by men being in relationships with other men and women with women?
    Have you read my previous post in this thread? I have listed some of the affects because of LGBT and supporters aggressiveness.

    As of generalization, I did not mean you yourself. You were talking about the general pride of gay people, weren't you? That was my impression at least. Therefore I was talking about the general impression left by the gay people. They still do leave the same impression. By protesting this Russian law, they gathered in front of a Russian embassy in another country. A bare topped woman tried to jump into the embassy. They gathered in Amsterdam, a man posed on street on a high platform with only underwear. (That was a highlight in mainstream US media.)

  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    Have you read my previous post in this thread? I have listed some of the affects because of LGBT and supporters aggressiveness.
    There are many more severely adverse effects of anti-LGBT aggressiveness, not limited to bullying (leading to suicide), gay bashing and violence, and persecution/imprisonment of gays.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    As of generalization, I did not mean you yourself. You were talking about the general pride of gay people, weren't you? That was my impression at least. Therefore I was talking about the general impression left by the gay people. They still do leave the same impression. By protesting this Russian law, they gathered in front of a Russian embassy in another country. A bare topped woman tried to jump into the embassy. They gathered in Amsterdam, a man posed in only underwear. (That was highlighted by mainstream US media.)
    If that is your "general impression" of gay people, then perhaps you are deserving of being called ignorant. I suppose you might also think blacks are "generally" thugs, and Muslims are "generally" terrorists?

  10. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    Then you are wrong. I do know some decent homosexual people, like the gym instructor I have mentioned before. Also, Brian Orser, and Brian Boitano. Regardless his political stance, Boitano has been one of my favorite skaters. In fact, he was the one who drew me into figure skating back in the 80s.
    Is said gym instructor/Brian Boitano/Brian Orser half-naked on floats or dressed in drag (not that there's anything wrong with that, IMO)? I'm saying that, for the same reason you said I can't speak on behalf of all LGBT people (and I certainly do not), perhaps you should reconsider the notion that a gay person wanting to be seen as normal and not be discriminated for loving who they love is characterized by a half-naked guy on a float. You are stereotyping, and this is clearly confounding your perception of what LGBT people are all about.

    Gay pride isn't about strutting half-naked on a float. It's about being proud of who you are and comfortable in your own skin. Being proud means coming to terms with the fact that you are not abnormal, despite what others may say about you. Instead of being made to feel ashamed, embracing one's sexuality is quite empowering. As the saying goes, if you can't love yourself, how are you going to love anybody else?

    And if anything, many straight people are convincing their gay kids into hating themselves or being ashamed about something that is inherent to them. What do you think is more common -- heterophobic gay parents raising a kid who tell their straight male kid "I wish you were gay, your straightness is just a phase, etc." and encouraging him to find a nice guy to marry.... or homophobic straight parents raising a gay kid who tell him "I wish you were straight, your gayness is just a phase, etc." and encouraging him to find a nice woman to marry? Who exactly is trying to manipulate kids into being something that they are not, because of their own prejudices?

  11. #161
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    Kristi Yamaguchi: I Support Brian Boitano For Coming Out As Gay Ahead Of Sochi Olympics
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/0...n_4550836.html

  12. #162
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    In the spirit of the upcoming US Nationals, a throwback to Ashley Wagner's vocal support of the LGBT community
    http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2...figure-skating

    I think it's wonderful that so many current and former US athletes are banding together for the sake of equality (as they say in schools ... liberty and justice for all). My respect for Ashley increased tenfold after her decision to publicly stand up for her beliefs, and to do it in such a classy way. The girl's got chutzpah.

  13. #163
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    Brian Boitano was just on NBC nightly news with Brain Williams, in a feature about the Russian laws. The footage from Russia showed people getting beat up and was generally critical of the anti-gay laws heading into the Olympics.

  14. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverFish View Post
    In the spirit of the upcoming US Nationals, a throwback to Ashley Wagner's vocal support of the LGBT community
    http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2...figure-skating

    I think it's wonderful that so many current and former US athletes are banding together for the sake of equality (as they say in schools ... liberty and justice for all). My respect for Ashley increased tenfold after her decision to publicly stand up for her beliefs, and to do it in such a classy way. The girl's got chutzpah.
    Yes, the girl is a real leader; probably the reason the Americans will win in the team event.

  15. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Brian Boitano was just on NBC nightly news with Brain Williams, in a feature about the Russian laws. The footage from Russia showed people getting beat up and was generally critical of the anti-gay laws heading into the Olympics.
    MM, there is a very lively debate as to why Russia has chosen this particular scapegoat (LGBT) at this time. It seems like there are a few alternatives. The traditional scapegoat in Russia has been Jews; however, for all the negative stuff one can say about Putin, he is not an antisemite, and his rule, for what it's worth, hasn't been bad for the Jewish community of Russia. For years, migrants from former USSR republic fit the bill; one opinion as to why this particular hatred is being reigned back a bit (opinion I subscribe to as well) is that it begats too much violence as many of the migrants can certainly stand up for themselves; the correct scapegoat should be adequately obedient. There is, of course, the constant undercurrent of America-bashing, but that is just too far away; I mean sure, punishing the country's orphans through the law of a year ago build up a bit of the warm-and-fuzzy patriotism, but that just fades too darn quick. And then probably someone came up with the brilliant idea of using LGBT community of the scapegoat. Whoever came up with that was a real genius, if you ask me! Most people in Russia don't know may gays, so they're easy to demonize; as a community, they also tend to be not-too-aggressive, so they're relatively safe to beat up to let the youngsters get blow off the steam. The real irony, of course (sorry if this has already been discussed at length) is that Russian pop culture and pop music uses a lot of the traditionally gay attributes and no one seems to find any contradiction in that!

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