Japanese Nationals 2013-2014 - Ladies

I think Miki's effort really deserve a shout out here; she is in good shape and make a great progress of the beginning of the season. She is more expressive and seems to really skate from heart. I wish she is with her current coach rather than Morozov in her prime!

MaiKatze said:

And she always chooses great music and programs. Honestly it never gets boring when Akiko skates.

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You've forgotten to mention her costume!!

Just catching up in the thread...and some of you are evil! My heart almost gave out three times!!

I am so thrilled to see all of the top ladies put forth their and best skated well. I was a little worried about Kanako and Akiko but I'm so happy both of them delivered here. I can't wait to see the videos.

I'm going to keep my fingers crossed that the standings stay the same after the FS. I really want Mao, Akiko and Kanako on the team. And judging by the criteria they use in selecting the team, there really isn't a better option than those three...

FS_rrb said:

That triple axel was underotated by a quarter or maybe a little bit more but not by 1/2.
Waiting to see your opinions

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Sure. I paused the image when they showed Mao's 3A in slow motion the moment she touched the ice. That's at the 4:55 mark on this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=171US...fUueVYf4Xj0gEA
Then I let the video play on. What I saw was the blade make a complete 180° on the ice. It looks to me as if the direction she continues gliding after the landing is complete is not exactly the direction she was gliding before the jump, but significantly more "to the right". So that's the base point in terms of °, not the direction she was heading before she jumped.
TO ME (and I can only emphasize that I don't have all the equipment the technical specialists have to determine the exact rotation), that was a clear <<.

FS_rrb said:

I don't know why but everybody seems to be counting rotations in HER triple axel from the moment her blade leaves the ice.

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About what you said with the pre-rotating: It seems that the judges don't even consider applying this guideline (I thought it was meant to apply mostly to the loop), so I stopped.
Otherwise, Satoko Miyahara would be in deep trouble... She has developed an amazing technique to maximize the pre-rotating to the extreme: It's really interesting to watch the blade in slow motion.
5:25 here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBrZGE78hxQ
She actually makes a "toe-pick" on the BACK of the blade she stands on (left for Lutz/Flip; right for toeloop) and uses it to get "ahem... height", her standing foot blade is facing forward before she leaves the ice. You could call that a heel-pick. Trade-mark pending!

Almost everybody slides into the axel rotation, which is considered as about 1/4 a turn. But that's considered normal.
The very rare cases of Axels that take off without any pre-rotation that come to my mind are Laetitia Hubert, Evelynn Grossmann and Marina Kielmann, all of them often messed those up (Grossmann: almost always!).
In German, they call the 2 ways "in den Axel rutschen" (slide into the Axel) and "von der Kante springen" (jump from the blade/edge). I don't know of an english terminology.
So it soon became obvious as the "wrong way" to teach children the Axel. As far as I know, there was never a triple Axel done jumping "straight off the edge".

WOW!!! From the scores and brief descriptions, sounds like the ladies all brought their A game. Really impressive! Although my heart aches for a number of the ladies and men who will not be able to go to the Olympics, I am so impressed with their abilities and with the way they are competing here! Special feeling of joy for Akiko (wow, wow, wow) and for Miki - way to come back!

I understand what you mean, Frenchie. However, if you consider that a 1/4 prerotation is "normal" (and it is if we watch most men's triple axel in slow motion) the last 1/4 she rotates on the ice should not be considered as "lack of rotation". I mean, she prepares the axel and then prerotates 1/4. If we're are consistent with out theory of allowing a triple axel to be prerotated by 1/4, then we should expect her to land after rotating 3.5 revolutions from the moment she prepares (sorry, I cannot explain this well) not from the moment the blade leaves the ice. Then the "right" way to land it would on a line forming 90º with her blade in the actual landing. I don't know why she keeps rotating (maybe because of the boards?) because she makes it look like she's underotating the jump more than she's actually doing.

Forgive me if I cannot explain this well. I'm not making this up, I've checked some of her landings...it's just that I find it difficult to be put it into words.

They published the starting order for the LP:

Ladies - Free Skating Starting Order

1 Ayana YASUHARA
2 Mai MIHARA
3 Kako TOMOTAKI
4 Risa SHOJI
5 Yuki NISHINO
6 Shion KOKUBUN

7 Riona KATO
8 Kaho KOMAKI
9 Ayaka HOSODA
10 Yukiko FUJISAWA
11 Kana MURAMOTO
12 Yura MATSUDA

13 Saya UENO
14 Kaori SAKAMOTO
15 Miyu NAKASHIO
16 Rika HONGO
17 Mariko KIHARA
18 Miyabi OHBA

19 Satoko MIYAHARA
20 Akiko SUZUKI
21 Miki ANDO
22 Haruka IMAI
23 Kanako MURAKAMI
24 Mao ASADA

I like that Akiko will start 2nd, I think that's the best spot for her. I really wish them all luck. I'd wish them more than 3 spots for the OG!

FS_rrb said:

I understand what you mean, Frenchie. However, if you consider that a 1/4 prerotation is "normal" (and it is if we watch most men's triple axel in slow motion) the last 1/4 she rotates on the ice should not be considered as "lack of rotation". I mean, she prepares the axel and then prerotates 1/4. If we're are consistent with out theory of allowing a triple axel to be prerotated by 1/4, then we should expect her to land after rotating 3.5 revolutions from the moment she prepares (sorry, I cannot explain this well) not from the moment the blade leaves the ice. Then the "right" way to land it would on a line forming 90º with her blade in the actual landing. I don't know why she keeps rotating (maybe because of the boards?) because she makes it look like she's underotating the jump more than she's actually doing.

Forgive me if I cannot explain this well. I'm not making this up, I've checked some of her landings...it's just that I find it difficult to be put it into words.

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Hey, there's no worry at all! I was struggling to put my thoughts into words... Hence resorting to German!
I guess where we agree to disagree is the rotating AFTER the jump, I'm not AT ALL counting her pre-jumping.
To me, it was exactly 180°; to you, it was "a little more than 90°.
We're all good

this is kind of random but does anyone know if rika hongo is full japanese? i think she looks a bit mixed but maybe its just me

Wow! the ladies really brought it! I love Mao--she's rightfully first--and I'm very happy for Kanako (although I do think that the second 3T in the combo was <--lovely performance, however!). But two performances brought me to tears: Akiko and Miki. Akiko is without a doubt the most expressive female skater out there at the moment and I could watch her for hours on end. And Miki--just amazing that she could lay it down like that, only 8 months after having a child! She also performed her program incredibly well--she skated from the heart, as Uncle Dick would say--and she looked so happy to be there!!

Oh I'm so happy right now I was having a heartattack waiting for Kanako that I just needed to get away from the internet from a while ugh I'm so happy and proud of you baby please make the team, and Akiko ugh don't let me get started because I'm an big fan of hers and she killed ugh I love her she's so expressive and artistic ugh she's queen and she's beautiful Miki was having the time of life out there and she was so happy I just can't believe she just came out like that after having a baby and Mao was gorgeous and ethereal! great job ladies and good luck in the free!

Wow wow the ladies all brought their A game. So impressed with Miki, to land those gigantic 3T+3T and landing 3Lz after giving birth. Glad Kanako and Akiko nailed it and peaking at the right moment. Regardless of making to the Sochi, Miki at least give her best shot and she had a great career.

Akiko's 2nd 3toe of her 3-3 combo was underrotated.

Frenchie said:

Sure. I paused the image when they showed Mao's 3A in slow motion the moment she touched the ice. That's at the 4:55 mark on this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=171US...fUueVYf4Xj0gEA
Then I let the video play on. What I saw was the blade make a complete 180° on the ice. It looks to me as if the direction she continues gliding after the landing is complete is not exactly the direction she was gliding before the jump, but significantly more "to the right". So that's the base point in terms of °, not the direction she was heading before she jumped.
TO ME (and I can only emphasize that I don't have all the equipment the technical specialists have to determine the exact rotation), that was a clear <<.

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You have to consider the starting direction, though. Otherwise, how do you count the revolutions? By your criterion, if a skater did two 3 turns out of the jump then it would be a << too. In reference to her entry direction, her 3A was definitely short by a bit over a 1/4 turn but not by 1/2 or even close.

CarneAsada said:

You have to consider the starting direction, though. Otherwise, how do you count the revolutions? By your criterion, if a skater did two 3 turns out of the jump then it would be a << too. In reference to her entry direction, her 3A was definitely short by a bit over a 1/4 turn but not by 1/2 or even close.

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Thank you, that's what I was trying to say. I think Frenchie was counting revolutions from the exact moment Mao's blade left the ice, hence it seemed like it was cheated by 1/2 turn. I agree with you, in reference to her ENTRY DIRECTION (that's why I mentioned the 1/4 prerotation) the triple axel lacked a little bit more than 90º. I'm not against the UR call, though. Not this time.

Akiko Suzuki skates with so much soul.She becomes the music and her body is the instrument. The music and understanding of music oozes from every inch of her body. She draws you into her emotion. For me , she may not have all the major or biggest titles but she is one of the greatest skaters I have ever witnessed. So blessed. She has this incredible euphoric charisma. Simply astounding!

Just got through watching icechannel2011's youtube videos... WHAT A COMPETITION! All of the ladies I saw skated their best, and every one of them was a delight. THANK YOU icechannel2011 whoever you are!

I was particularly impressed by Imai skating clean, and she has improved noticably in the last year or so.

I shed a tear with Ando... what a joy to see her skating full-speed, with confidence, and smiling all the way through. What a fighter! She did it her way!

More tears shed with Kanako... amazing return to form, and a fantastic skate, and such emotion afterwards.

Asada and Suzuki as beautiful as ever, of course.

Can't wait for the FS...

christinaskater said:

Akiko Suzuki skates with so much soul.She becomes the music and her body is the instrument. The music and understanding of music oozes from every inch of her body. She draws you into her emotion. For me , she may not have all the major or biggest titles but she is one of the greatest skaters I have ever witnessed. So blessed. She has this incredible euphoric charisma. Simply astounding!

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Couldn't agree more!

Akiko is a joy to watch! Good luck to her in the long!

I really like the way Kanako Murakami jumps.

I am obsessed with Mao's SP dress. Very airy program for her, I liked it.

It's too bad Miki is 5th after the SP with a strong skate.

christinaskater said:

Akiko Suzuki skates with so much soul.She becomes the music and her body is the instrument. The music and understanding of music oozes from every inch of her body. She draws you into her emotion. For me , she may not have all the major or biggest titles but she is one of the greatest skaters I have ever witnessed. So blessed. She has this incredible euphoric charisma. Simply astounding!

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I completely agree!