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Thread: Daisuke instead of Takahiko - Fair decision or not ?

  1. #61
    Gotta Have Music iluvtodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victura View Post
    It sounds like Kozuka will continue at least past this season, though he will be 28 by the time the next Olympics come around. He also postponed a hip surgery to prepare for these Olympics, and if he decides on the surgery after this season, who knows if he will recover enough to contend in the future. Oda I think has said he wouldn't continue past this season.

    Fair or not, this whole situation is heartbreaking for both Kozuka and Oda. What's done is done though, and I hope that things will change after Sochi that will allow at least one (if not both) of them to compete at Worlds.
    I'm glad that Daisuke will still go to the Olympics, but I am heartbroken for Taka & Nobu. I wish there were more than 3 spots for the amazing Japanese men. I understand that Nobu has retired, so therefore we won't see him @ 4CC, etc. If a spot opens up for Worlds, I hope Taka gets to compete there.

  2. #62
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    I was happy that Dai can go to Sochi. But I was heartbroken for Oda that he was not even considered as a candidate. IMO, Oda's been performing quite well and stable this season. Compared with Dai and Kozuka, he clearly has the most consistent techniques, and did not zayak himself out again...Between Dai and Kozuka, Dai shall go due to his overall performances this season. But I really think Oda should at least be given a spot at the Worlds, and announce his retirement after that in front of the home crowds. So sad for him...

  3. #63
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    According to the JSF, Japanese Nationals is one of the criteria for the Olympic team. The National Champion automatically gets the spot but the remaining two spots are decided comprehensively based on the GP series results, the world ranking, and natioanls results. So as much as I feel sorry for Kozuka, one cannot say it is unfair.

  4. #64
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    I agree with you. A bad decision and one based too much on the past and past reputation rather than what is happening now.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    Yes they should have sent Takahashi to the Olympics, and sent Kozuka to Worlds. Oda should have been the alternate for Worlds. Someone on the other thread suggested sending Machida to the Olympics and Oda to Worlds, but to not send Machida to both events right now would be completely wrong.
    Japan announced their 4CC and Worlds teams? Could someone please link me the article/page that has this information, or tell me which skaters have been named for each competition? (:

  6. #66
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    I don't know why the Fed could not have sent Nobu and Taka to Worlds along with Hanyu. They would have gotten the magic 13 and qualified to three men for 2015. I feel terrible for both. I do think Dai might pull out of Worlds giving Taka the chance to go but it is sort of dismissive to get excise Nobu.

  7. #67
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    Takahashi is one of my big favourites, but in spite of that I´m surprised that he was selected now. I would have expected a simple skate-out in Japan or an official one based on results in 4CC competition.

  8. #68
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Takahashi skated better than Kozuka at both of their GP events this year. He skated better than Kozuka last year and has always shown a higher scoring potential. It's not like Kozuka gave some kind of phenomenal performance at Nationals to make a statement of deserving to be on the team; his SP and LP were both messy. Takahashi easily deserves to be on the team.

  9. #69
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    On that same argument, Takahashi gave an even sloppier SP & LP, and isn't exactly a statement of him deserving to be on the team. And if you want to say Takahashi was terrible due to injury, so was Kozuka last season.

  10. #70
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    It doesn't matter how Takahashi performed at Nationals, his spot on the team was already earned unless the other guys really gave astounding performances at Nationals and showed they have the potential to medal at Olympics. Kozuka failed to do that.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    In terms of why I think Russian judging is more corrupt, 4 words: Cup of Russia 2013.
    Oh, please! What about the skate Canada a few years ago where Chan won with 4 falls? How can you speak about corrupt judging?

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    Oh, please! What about the skate Canada a few years ago where Chan won with 4 falls? How can you speak about corrupt judging?
    Chan is one skater.

    Cup of Russia was one event with four disciplines, with multiple skaters in each discipline.

    You do the math.

  13. #73
    skating philosopher Mrs. P's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    Why on earth should Machida not be allowed to compete at his first ever Worlds, when he clearly earned his spot on both the Olympic and Worlds team. That would be ridiculous and plain wrong on every level. Sending Kozuka who has been outskated by Machida all season long (and was again at Nationals) or Oda who except for the Grand Prix final short program has been outskated by Machida all grand prix season and again at Nationals, to Worlds in place of Machida would be fair how exactly!! I guess sending Takahashi to the Olympics and Oda or Kozuka (Oda IMO) to Worlds might be fair, but Oda retired on the spot without even wanting to go to 4CCs anyway so even that seems moot. Maybe he would have accepted an invite to Worlds, I dont know, but I get the impression his only goal this year was the Olympics anyway.
    Oda outskated him both the FS and SP (and obviously overall) at GPF. In fact, he beat Machida in the FS by five points. That was their only head-to-head face up leading to Nationals.

    It's not accurate to say to Machida beat him all season long when they only competed face-to-face once this season prior to nationals. Their total scores have been comparable all season long, in fact when you average their GP performances, their scores are not that far apart. Oda got 247.33 vs 249.47 for Tatsuki.

    Oda also had a slight edge in SP average in GP events with an 81.49 average versus Machida's average of 80.58. Of course Machida highest score (91.18) is well above Oda's (82+), though one could argue that with a different panel Oda would have received a 90+ score at NHK.

    In the FS, Machida has the edge with a 172.22 vs 167.88 for Oda. Oda's average of course is due to a poor, relatively speaking , FS at Skate Canada, just as Machida's average in the SP down due to his poor GPF SP.

    Point is...Machida was not far and beyond above Oda leading up to Nationals, score wise.

    But that said Machida, did outskate him at Nationals, so yes his Olympic spot is very much deserved as his Worlds spot. My dispute is more for the criteria that clearly favored one skater over another and doesn't quite reflect how the skaters actually performed this season.

    ETA: I get that in general you support Oda had the results at nationals been different, but my statement stands that Machida technically has not outskated Oda all season long since in their one face-to-face matchup Oda beat him in both segements and overall.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    Chan is one skater.

    Cup of Russia was one event with four disciplines, with multiple skaters in each discipline.

    You do the math.
    That year it wasn't only Chan at the Skate Canada, it was also all four events, but the matter with Chan was a bit too much! And yeah, I am doing the math. Two undeserved worlds gold medals, one undeserved Skate Canada title ...shouldn't you be doing the math? Is that OK in your books because it is 'only' Chan?

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    That year it wasn't only Chan at the Skate Canada, it was also all four events, but the matter with Chan was a bit too much! And yeah, I am doing the math. Two undeserved worlds gold medals, one undeserved Skate Canada title ...shouldn't you be doing the math? Is that OK in your books because it is 'only' Chan?
    Excuse you. Patrick Chan is the man. Bow down to his zamboni-style glory!

    Also, no one was talking about Canada until you brought it up. There was, however, a comment about judging in Russia vs. judging in Japan.

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