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Thread: A Female Skater Who Has Everything, Is It Possible?

  1. #106
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    Sounds like fun, Layfan! Definitely add Alissa's spins.

  2. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Layfan View Post
    Well... what if we were to throw in Ito's triple axel?
    Throw in all of Ito's edge jumps, actually. Her loop and Salchow blow away any from the previous 3 you mentioned.

  3. #108
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    No one will ever surpass Kwan for me. She was the most musical skater I have ever seen. She skated with pure joy.

  4. #109
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    Well if you combine Midori's jumps, Michelle's Consistency,Yuna's speed, Sasha's flexibility, Ruh's spins, and Lu Chen's choreography that would be the perfect female skater in my opinion.

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    Here is an interesting article that sheds some light on both Yuna's athletic as well as aesthetic qualities. It has to do with her body ratios:

    http://english.chosun.com/site/data/...022400425.html

    "Standing 164 cm tall and weighing 47 kg, Kim's lower body from waist to the ankle bone measures 96 cm, almost double the length of her torso, which is 50 cm. Fashion stylist Kim Seong-il said, "With normal people, if the ratio of the upper and the lower body is 4.5:5.5, we consider them long-legged. Because of her long legs, Kim's jumps look bigger and more elegant."

    If an upper-to-lower body ratio of 4.5:5.5 is considered long-legged, then Yuna, at around 3.5:6.5, has the "body proportions of a fashion model". There are very few women who are 5' 5" (164 cm) with such elongated proportions. The athletic point that the "fashion stylist" (above) misses, of course, is that such proportions not only make Yuna's jumps "look" bigger, but they provide the leverage to make them actually bigger, higher, wider. This is one of the key ingredients to the flight that she gets, for example, on her 3-3 combos.

    "Her long and slender arms, which measure 68 cm, also help boost her expression grade. Dr Chung Jae-young at Jelim Plastic Surgery Clinic said, "Normally, the length of your arms stretched out matches your height. But for Kim, the length of both arms plus her shoulder width, which is 46cm, is almost 180 cm. Her arms are very long." That makes small arm movements look softer and more fluid."

    We've known intuitively that something of the sort was probably the case (many posters have noted her gazelle-like limbs). And, of course, musicality and training are a large part of what individuates Yuna's style of movment. This commentary, however, clearly quantifies one physical aspect of why Yuna's movements seem more than ordinarily graceful, elegant, and lovely, and almost impossible to mistake for any other skater.

    Another skater who stands out in terms of physique, who is also marked by elongated proportions, is Carolina. But Caro is both slightly taller and heavier than Yuna, which makes her seem more statuesque and Juno-esque, and these physical qualities are quite clearly reflected in her own style of movement.

    If I were to draw an analogy to automobiles (being a car fan), Caro moves with the massive ease and self-assurance of a Maybach, and can build terrific speed and momentum on straights and open terrain, which is what the vehicle is built for. Despite her Italian nationality, I see something essentially Teutonic in her style. Yuna, somewhat ironically, is more like a Ferrari, smaller, and nimble, supple and sinuous in its movements, with hints of a more organic sensuality.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robeye View Post
    If I were to draw an analogy to automobiles (being a car fan), Caro moves with the massive ease and self-assurance of a Maybach, and can build terrific speed and momentum on straights and open terrain, which is what the vehicle is built for. Despite her Italian nationality, I see something essentially Teutonic in her style. Yuna, somewhat ironically, is more like a Ferrari, smaller, and nimble, supple and sinuous in its movements, with hints of a more organic sensuality.
    Carolina is from South Tyrol which has a large number of German speakers. That might explain your impression of her.

  7. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarneAsada View Post
    Carolina is from South Tyrol which has a large number of German speakers. That might explain your impression of her.
    Actually, I knew this. I believe Caro is ethnically German, as a matter of fact.

  8. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robeye View Post
    Another skater who stands out in terms of physique, who is also marked by elongated proportions, is Carolina. But Caro is both slightly taller and heavier than Yuna, which makes her seem more statuesque and Juno-esque, and these physical qualities are quite clearly reflected in her own style of movement.

    If I were to draw an analogy to automobiles (being a car fan), Caro moves with the massive ease and self-assurance of a Maybach, and can build terrific speed and momentum on straights and open terrain, which is what the vehicle is built for. Despite her Italian nationality, I see something essentially Teutonic in her style. Yuna, somewhat ironically, is more like a Ferrari, smaller, and nimble, supple and sinuous in its movements, with hints of a more organic sensuality.
    Really interesting article! It's true that her proportions, and moreso the perfect use of those, makes for an extremely elegant package.
    You using the word "statuesque" reminded me of a US commentator using that word for Lenka Kulovana in 1993:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcMeIUy3D7o
    Like Kim Yu-Na and Carolina Kostner, she's tall with long legs and arms, and uses those to make the maximum out of every move. Sure, technically, 2x3T; 2x3S and 2x2A isn't mindbobbling, but I always had a soft spot for her sheer elegance. Look at how well she uses her arms and hands throughout the entire program.
    Oh, and about your car allegory: Carolina is from South Tyrol, which is very different in most regards to the rest of Italy: The majority of the population is of Austro-Bavarian heritage and speaks German. She trains in Oberstdorf, Germany, with a German Coach. So from her upbringing, one could say she's closer to a Maybach than a Ferrari... Let's agree on a Lamborghini - Italian, but owned and influenced by Audi!
    Oh, and... I'm NOT saying Lenka Kulovana is anything like a Škoda!

  9. #114
    I'm gonna Customize the CRAP out of this Title!!! Frenchie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarneAsada View Post
    Carolina is from South Tyrol which has a large number of German speakers. That might explain your impression of her.
    Quote Originally Posted by Robeye View Post
    Actually, I knew this. I believe Caro is ethnically German, as a matter of fact.
    Oops, looks like I took too long to finish my post!
    Quote Originally Posted by Frenchie View Post
    Oh, and about your car allegory: Carolina is from South Tyrol, which is very different in most regards to the rest of Italy: The majority of the population is of Austro-Bavarian heritage and speaks German. She trains in Oberstdorf, Germany, with a German Coach. So from her upbringing, one could say she's closer to a Maybach than a Ferrari... Let's agree on a Lamborghini - Italian, but owned and influenced by Audi!

  10. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frenchie View Post
    Really interesting article! It's true that her proportions, and moreso the perfect use of those, makes for an extremely elegant package.
    You using the word "statuesque" reminded me of a US commentator using that word for Lenka Kulovana in 1993:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcMeIUy3D7o
    Like Kim Yu-Na and Carolina Kostner, she's tall with long legs and arms, and uses those to make the maximum out of every move. Sure, technically, 2x3T; 2x3S and 2x2A isn't mindbobbling, but I always had a soft spot for her sheer elegance. Look at how well she uses her arms and hands throughout the entire program.
    Oh, and about your car allegory: Carolina is from South Tyrol, which is very different in most regards to the rest of Italy: The majority of the population is of Austro-Bavarian heritage and speaks German. She trains in Oberstdorf, Germany, with a German Coach. So from her upbringing, one could say she's closer to a Maybach than a Ferrari... Let's agree on a Lamborghini - Italian, but owned and influenced by Audi!
    Oh, and... I'm NOT saying Lenka Kulovana is anything like a Škoda!
    Thanks for adding additional background details about Carolina.

    Also, you are a treasure trove of knowledge of some interesting Central European skaters who, sadly, are not very well-remembered, particularly in America. This is my first viewing of this quite lovely (and statuesque ) Czech skater.

    (And I must agree: Lenka is NOT a Skoda, as she is much too elegant a skater for that; although I understand that Skodas are a lot better than they used to be. At least they were never as bad as the Soviet-era Ladas. )

  11. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robeye View Post
    Also, you are a treasure trove of knowledge of some interesting Central European skaters who, sadly, are not very well-remembered, particularly in America. This is my first viewing of this quite lovely (and statuesque ) Czech skater.
    yeah... I know I'm probably annoying people by now... Let me know when to shut up. I actually listen to input. I have this missionary gene in me of sharing what I viewed as an often more elegant and exciting era, even if the amount of triples was nowhere near today. ... But also the hope that more people add interesting links to skates I haven't seen myself!
    Quote Originally Posted by Robeye View Post
    (And I must agree: Lenka is NOT a Skoda, as she is much too elegant a skater for that; although I understand that Skodas are a lot better than they used to be. At least they were never as bad as the Soviet-era Ladas. )
    Oh, they were as bad... during the same time-period! I'm a car fan myself... And back to Lamborghini: Škoda started becoming something completely different when the VW Group gradually took over beginning 1991. No link to Kulovana here

  12. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frenchie View Post
    yeah... I know I'm probably annoying people by now... Let me know when to shut up. I actually listen to input. I have this missionary gene in me of sharing what I viewed as an often more elegant and exciting era, even if the amount of triples was nowhere near today. ... But also the hope that more people add interesting links to skates I haven't seen myself!
    I, for one, am appreciative of your fresh point of view. I can't imagine how anyone would be annoyed by a broadening of the usual horizons.

  13. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zamboni View Post
    No one will ever surpass Kwan for me. She was the most musical skater I have ever seen. She skated with pure joy.
    Joy and musicality are not the same thing. Michelle was not the most musical even of her contemporaries. She was a very consisten jumper with good spins, nice spiral, very outgoing and emotive with face, mostly smiling. She did well with lyrical music. I only saw her in person once doing Fields of Gold, which she phoned in-a long tour after 2002 Olympics.

    zSasha was more musical because she could do much more with body positions. Ssasha was very much the artistic skater, but her falls marred the impression.

    Akiko Suzuki is more musical than kwan, and I am a Kwan fan, esp of her 1996-2001 period. And then Tosca was really powerful and great. She made more effort before 2002 to skate with nuances. After that defeat and losing her edge, she worked to get the jumps in. There really were very little transitions, fancy footwork even in her 2003 win with Aranjuez. I used to get exasperated at the way she ride a long edge into the lutz and turn robotically and then jump. It was like "execute, Michelle' was on her forehead.

    I suppose I missed a great many exhibition programs with Tom Collins where she was more musical than her comp. programs. As she got older, she kind of lost the musicality, I thought.

    But outgoing, joyous, heart on her sleeve and wonderfully consistent are a great package, and always lovely with beautiful costumes. I think Akiko, Ashley, Caro and Mao are wonderfully musical skaters. Osmund may be the most musical/versatile of all of them. Rare to have someone dance that well and do triple jumps as well. So hope she is healing-love that girl.

  14. #119
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    Kwan was overrated, the only good thing about her was her spirals.

    Carolina is the closest had her jumps been more reliable in the big events
    she has speed, jumps and a body type ideal for both presenting herself and long stroking on the ice
    Kostner is perfect for galas at least

  15. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by sky_fly20 View Post
    Kwan was overrated, the only good thing about her was her spirals.
    Wow. You've officially outdone yourself in the hating on skaters department.

    Saying Kostner is the closest if her jumps had been more reliable is like saying Sasha is the female skater who has everything, except for the whole lack of consistency thing.

    You're actually suggesting Carolina is closest to being the female skater who has everything... more than Michelle Kwan....

    Although, tbh, I'm disappointed you didn't suggest someone even more ludicrous like Gold.

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