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Thread: Can Gracie Gold finally win US Nationals ?

  1. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by sky_fly20 View Post
    I don't see the need to propel Wagner
    USFS clearly sees Gracie Gold as their No.1 lady and the highest chance for an Olympic medal
    You think USFS will completely dismiss facts like: a) Wagner had far more successful this year in competition than Gold, and gave the USA a GP bronze whereas Gold failed to even qualify; b) Wagner's World rank is #3 while Gold's is #8 c) Gold beating Wagner would be the first time that's ever happened.

    And who cares who's perceived as the #1 lady, honestly? USFS is concerned with sending their best 3 skaters... if Gold and Wagner fail to skate cleanly in Sochi, it won't matter who the US "sees" as their #1 skater.

    USFS dumping Wagner for Gold would be like the Japanese federation dumping Mao and claiming that Suzuki is their best chance for an Olympic medal just because she defeated Mao at Nationals -- and dismissing Mao's success earlier in the year.

    You're saying the USFS sees Gold as their #1 lady based off a single SP where Gold skated cleanly and Wagner did not... not to mention Wagner still received higher PCS with her error. Oh yeah, USFS "clearly" sees Gold as their #1 lady. That'd be as illogical as if I had said after the 2014 Russians SP "The Russian fed clearly sees Sotnikova as their No.1 lady and the highest chance for an Olympic medal, because she placed higher after skating cleanly the SP over Lipnitskaia who had an error."

  2. #137
    the Golden Era sky_fly20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    You think USFS will completely dismiss facts like: a) Wagner had far more successful this year in competition than Gold, and gave the USA a GP bronze whereas Gold failed to even qualify; b) Wagner's World rank is #3 while Gold's is #8 c) Gold beating Wagner would be the first time that's ever happened.

    And who cares who's perceived as the #1 lady, honestly? USFS is concerned with sending their best 3 skaters... if Gold and Wagner fail to skate cleanly in Sochi, it won't matter who the US "sees" as their #1 skater.

    Dumping Wagner for Gold would be like the Japanese federation dumping Mao and claiming that Suzuki is their highest chance for an Olympic medal just because she defeated Mao at Nationals -- never mind Mao's success earlier in the year.
    you didn't get the point did you ?
    it matters because Mao has the backing on her Fed, Gracie has been propped and has finally delivered, you saw her score
    she has always been the USFS darling and backed skater, there was a time when Gracie was not yet that consistent and so Wagner was the leading skater

    put it this way:
    Mao has biggest support form her Fed
    Gracie has the biggest support from her Fed
    Sotnikova has the biggest supoort from her Fed

    at this point, it is wise they are pushing Gracie now
    with her renewed confidence and consistency, she has the highest chance to podium at the Olympics
    Wagner looks to be on a downward trend

  3. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    USFS dumping Wagner for Gold would be like the Japanese federation dumping Mao and claiming that Suzuki is their best chance for an Olympic medal just because she defeated Mao at Nationals -- and dismissing Mao's success earlier in the year.
    Again, Mao is still a favorite for a medal, and a gold medal contender. Mao is multiple WC. Still Japan #1.
    Wagner doesn't have that luxury. Are you confusing Wagner with Mao? Look them up, completely different league.

    JAL airline put Maoster on their Boeing 777-300ER livery. Imagine Delta put Wagner on their livery. Yeah, I don't think so.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8bVbxuPp3E

  4. #139
    Tripping on the Podium
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    If Gracie in Sochi skate as she did in this national short, I think she can be on the podium.
    Good luck to her~

  5. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by sky_fly20 View Post
    you didn't get the point did you ?
    it matters because Mao has the backing on her Fed, Gracie has been propped and has finally delivered, you saw her score
    she has always been the USFS darling and backed skater, there was a time when Gracie was not yet that consistent and so Wagner was the leading skater

    put it this way:
    Mao has biggest support form her Fed
    Gracie has the biggest support from her Fed
    Sotnikova has the biggest supoort from her Fed
    Can you wait until the FS is over until you say Gracie has "delivered"? I'm sure you said the same thing about Gold being clearly the #1 US lady after watching her Skate Canada short program.

    Wagner has been more of a darling for the USFS than Gold at least in terms of delivering much better results than Gracie in the past two seasons. To suggest that a clean skater getting a higher score than a skater with an error (using just a single SP as a sample size) is a clear indication of a federation throwing their support behind the former is delusional.

    Also, Sotnikova doesn't just have the biggest support from the Russian Fed -- she also has it from the international judges. Note that when Adelina and Julia both went clean in their GPF SP, Adelina was in 2nd and Julia was in 4th. If both go clean in Sochi (and Julia's flutzes are rightfully called), everyone knows Sotnikova will be ahead of Julia.

  6. #141
    the Golden Era sky_fly20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post

    Wagner has been more of a darling for the USFS than Gold at least in terms of delivering much better results than Gracie in the past two seasons. To suggest that a clean skater getting a higher score than a skater with an error (using just a single SP as a sample size) is a clear indication of a federation throwing their support behind the former is delusional.
    where have you been ?

    Gracie has been propped since the past seasons
    now that she has delivered, USFS can finally proclaim her a US No.1
    they have been waiting in the wings for Gracie

  7. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlattFan View Post
    Again, Mao is still a favorite for a medal, and a gold medal contender. Mao is multiple WC. Still Japan #1.
    Wagner doesn't have that luxury. Are you confusing Wagner with Mao? Look them up, completely different league.

    JAL airline put Maoster on their Boeing 777-300ER livery. Imagine Delta put Wagner on their livery. Yeah, I don't think so.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8bVbxuPp3E
    That's my point. It's ludicrous to say that because of the Nationals loss, you can definitively say Mao & Lipnitskaia & Wagner (if she loses) have clearly been replaced by the victor as the Sochi favourite (especially when they've had a significantly stronger season than those who happen to defeat them Suzuki+Murakami & Sotnikova & Gold-tentatively speaking). Even more ludicrous to do so before the competition is even over, as sky_fly seems to think it is (especially considering Gold's FS problems this year). I'm pretty sure many people believe Takahashi is more of a Sochi medal favourite than Machida, because he's a former WC and reigning Olympic bronze medalist, even though logically speaking Machida is a better medal bet at this point.

    This is all ridiculous banter anyways as Gold hasn't even won. If Wagner happened to win overall, I'm sure sky_fly would grasp at straws and say "Oh, but what about Gold's SP lead?"

    Anyways, it's a win-win situation for all of us -- if Gold wins, then we can revel in her winning her first US title... if Wagner wins, we can revel in sky_fly going nuts again like after Russian nationals.

  8. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by sky_fly20 View Post
    where have you been ?

    Gracie has been propped since the past seasons
    now that she has delivered, USFS can finally proclaim her a US No.1
    they have been waiting in the wings for Gracie
    I don't see what she did tonight (a clean SP) much different that what she already "delivered" at Skate Canada, if you recall, and we all know how her season went after that.

    She can finally be proclaimed a US No. 1 if she wins on Saturday. Until then, she is simply the leader after the Nationals short program.

  9. #144
    I'm out. aftertherain's Avatar
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    Hmm. As much as I want Gracie to do well, I think I've changed my mind about her SP. When I first saw the fan cam of it for the American Legends event, I thought it was a wonderful program for her. Now, I don't think I was right.

    All this program does is force her to be "artistic"--not the kind that necessarily invokes strong feelings in someone, but rather what the judges can cushion PCS with. Sure she smiles more, but her movements are artificial fluff that serve no purpose other than to convince judges that she's become Lu Chen or something.

    Make no mistake though, I still like this better than her first SP.

  10. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    Hmm. As much as I want Gracie to do well, I think I've changed my mind about her SP. When I first saw the fan cam of it for the American Legends event, I thought it was a wonderful program for her. Now, I don't think I was right.

    All this program does is force her to be "artistic"--not the kind that necessarily invokes strong feelings in someone, but rather what the judges can cushion PCS with. Sure she smiles more, but her movements are artificial fluff that serve no purpose other than to convince judges that she's become Lu Chen or something.

    Make no mistake though, I still like this better than her first SP.
    I'm personally not blown away by either of Wagner or Gold's SPs. Gold's SP is certainly less awkward looking than her previous SP this season. But, oh my, Gold's lutz... it's the best lutz we've seen from a US woman since Tonya Harding... it's absolutely massive!

  11. #146
    Tripping on the Podium Kirk's Avatar
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    That new sp of Gracie's was a cheap rushed replica of Mao's Nocturne. Look at the transitions and choreo in between elements.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirk View Post
    That new sp of Gracie's was a cheap rushed replica of Mao's Nocturne. Look at the transitions and choreo in between elements.
    How funny, Mao's SP came to my mind as well! I still liked it a lot and thought she looked like a different skater out there, very sophisticated

  13. #148
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    Anyone seen these? (Good vid interviews)

    http://msn.foxsports.com/buzzer/stor...n-sochi-010814

    http://msn.foxsports.com/olympics/st...program-010914

    The Carroll factor this year can boost her credit considerably leading to Sochi

  14. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by os168 View Post
    Anyone seen these? (Good vid interviews)

    http://msn.foxsports.com/buzzer/stor...n-sochi-010814

    http://msn.foxsports.com/olympics/st...program-010914

    The Carroll factor this year can boost her credit considerably leading to Sochi
    Right now for Gracie it's one step at a time and first she needs to finally skate a good LP while holding a lead. I don't want to see her overwhelmed like she has been in the past. This is her moment she needs to take it because something tells me the girls behind her are going to skate great. Ashley is always dangerous in the LP especially when she's behind and Polina has no real pressure but is confident that she can make the team. As we've seen in the past with Oksana and Tara beware a confident 15 year old who can jump and doesn't get rattled in the big moments.

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    I enjoyed her SP more than her previous one. Especially the first half of the program. She's improved much over the course of the season. If she stay on that track and keep polishing her programs for the remaining month before Sochi, I think she can finish on the Olympic podium. I love the determination written over her mean, lean body.

    It looks like the young American ladies will hold their ground just fine against the Russian wonder kids. I think they have superior scale, technique for the jumps. With more polishing, they can compete with anybody for the top.

    I'm curious about how tall Gold and Edmunds are now. They look taller than their listed height at 5'4+" in the ISU profile.

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