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Thread: Fan vs Fanatic

  1. #76
    Six Point Zero Krislite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    [...]

    There is no reason for Akiko Suzuki's Japanese Nationals video to be viewed by a nonfan or the public. At 295k views, it's hardly gone viral. So I don't think it's a stretch to say the majority of people commenting are fans of either 1.) a certain skater or 2.) skating in general.
    I would disagree in this case. Figure skating videos in general are mostly watched by real fans of the sport. However, in the case of the intense rivalry between Korea and Japan, I would imagine there are plenty of nationalistic zealots who take pure advantage of the situation and use their athletes to demonstrate their superiority over another country and disparage them. I've seen this behavior in other sports, especially in the most popular ones. I wouldn't be surprised if those so-called "fans" are only "fans" not because they like and appreciate their favorite skater, but because this great skater so happens to be of the same nationality.

    I never really got this mentality. I don't root for the home team just because they're my home team, and belittle their rivals just because they're from another state/country/city. If I take no interest in the sport I couldn't care less if they were National/Worlds/Olympic champion and born in my city. I've always felt a bit oddly out of place in certain social events because I'm not a hardcore fan of the home team or my alma mater's football team. It's the same thing with college football or the NFL. I work at a university and it's pretty awkward when I get asked about our team's recent games and I give a blank stare.

    As for Akiko's YouTube video, personally I'm baffled by the response. The most I could make out of it is that Akiko has won enemies now that she's on top, but has not gotten enough fan support yet to counter it. Have you guys not realized that 700 out of 295K views is only 0.2% of the total views? Sure the ratio of thumbs up to down is very low, but that's because of the 295k only a few clicked the thumbs up rating. That to me suggests what I've already mentioned--not that there is substantial "hate" for Akiko from so-called "Yuna fans"--but that those nationalistic zealots have swarmed her YouTube video while a smaller fan base has left her more vulnerable.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krislite View Post
    As for Akiko's YouTube video, personally I'm baffled by the response. The most I could make out of it is that Akiko has won enemies now that she's on top, but has not gotten enough fan support yet to counter it. Have you guys not realized that 700 out of 295K views is only 0.2% of the total views? Sure the ratio of thumbs up to down is very low, but that's because of the 295k only a few clicked the thumbs up rating. That to me suggests what I've already mentioned--not that there is substantial "hate" for Akiko from so-called "Yuna fans"--but that those nationalistic zealots have swarmed her YouTube video while a smaller fan base has left her more vulnerable.
    Leaving Suzuki more vulnerable? I don't think so. I guess her fans are more mature and intelligent. It's total waste of time dealing with those idiotic "nationalistic zealots" who are giving Korea a bad name in public.

    If you understand Japanese, you will find remarks from Asada fans as nasty as those comments by Koreans on Youtube. This is nothing new to Suzuki, really. Basically Maobots and Yunabots are really alike.

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frenchie View Post
    Hi Jewels!
    When I started this thread, I was honestly curious as to why the Yu-Na - Mao rivaly had gotten such a negative spin over the years. (for some, not for all)
    I know that noone should generalize. I'm both French and German, so I know about historically based animosity between 2 countries. Since you are Korean, would you mind telling a bit about your take on the role the media play in all this? Any Korean or Japanese member is encouraged to add their 2 cents - as long as we can agree to be civil.
    I know there are "serious media" and "tabloids". That's the same everywhere. Would you say that, in Korea,
    a) Serious Media (news on big tv channel, big newspaper,...) are very much goading the viewers, like what I'd consider a tabloid would be doing in Europe?
    b) Tabloids have more impact on the population, even if the serious media are more politically correct and cautious about not fuelling resentment?
    c) both!
    d) none of the above!
    Same question for Japan.

    I'd say it's politically correct for the French not to think or say hateful things directed towards the Germans. The media are playing their part in not fuelling any such thoughts. I don't know how much insight you as a Korean have into European media and so on, but if you can compare, would you say the media in Korea and Japan don't feel they should try and contribute to peacening the relations between both countries as much? Is fuelling said animosity just viewed as an easy, reliable way to get big viewing figures?

    I realize this subject can be explosive. I regretted ever posting this thread after a few days since all I wanted to say was pretty much "I'm sad for seeing Akiko Suzuki's JN LP have 700 likes and 700 dislikes". I didn't want to pinpoint any special group for massively clicking the dislike button, and I just thought the Yu-Na - Mao rivaly -of which I had heard, read and seen a lot over the years, like with said ugly videos saying things like "nobody likes her, look!" "she's so ugly!" and so on- might be another example of some fans going too far.
    I didn't want to imply that the relations between Korea and Japan had anything to do with that youtube rating, but I just put "I'm aware of the hostile past between Japan and Korea." as an acknowledgement of one possible ingredient.
    I realized when I saw the direction this thread had taken that some formulations of mine were very naive of me.


    I hope we can discuss this serious subject in a respectful way, I'd really like to learn more about it. Thanks!
    Hello Frenchie Well, that's a hard question. On every topic, there are always some exaggerating news to draw more people's interests, and I think most people are able to comprehend those, but there can be some people who get irrational. And the medias.....they don't show any hatred directly, but they don't particularly try to make things peaceful either. About Yuna-Mao, I think Krislite is right, it's a nationality thing I guess, Japan vs Korea things always become issues, not just figure skating, but on every other subjects as well. And there are always some over-excited people mistaking themselves as 'fans'. When Yuna was resting in 2012, there were so many bad comments about her criticizing that she is doing too much modeling in ads while doing nothing, and should just retire. And now they've changed their words and compliments fill the article reviews. None of them are true fans of figure skating or Yuna. Same for the comments on Akiko's Youtube video. I've read their comments, and clearly, they don't know anything about figure skating. They are just using the sport that's all.(And I assume all the nasty comments from Japan are the same)

    Personally I don't have anything against Japanese people, I have several Japanese friends, and they are all very nice and kind. There are many Koreans who like Japanese culture and I heard Japanese do too. I really really wish we could be more friendly countries, it's bad for both to be hostile to each other.

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    With all due respect, I find it hard to believe the majority of dislikes are from Yu Na fans. As much as I love Akiko, I cant imagine any sane Yu Na fan who has ever viewed Suzuki as a rival of any kind to Kim, or one now either. I am shocked at the high number of dislikes though. I think if anything it would more likely be upset Mao fans who are shocked with how Nationals went down. It could be neutral fans who dont like the score (which is stupid given the inflated Nationals scoring from every country, she certainly deserved a higher score than either Julia or Adelina got at Russian Nationals). I think quite likely it could be Miki Ando fans who largely seemed to think Miki could waltz right back and take old Suzuki's spot on the team no problem, and instead Miki had to compose herself and skate after Suzuki all but shut the door on her making the team before her long program even began. Who knows really, but I highly doubt it would be Yu Na fans unless they are a far more paranoid and bizarre group of individuals than I imagined.

    I dont see any real skating fan could dislike that though. It was an exceptional performance and is probably the best moment in figure skating in years from an emotional standpoint.

  5. #80
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    Btw, how can someone not like Akiko's programs from Nationals, these are the best skates I ve seen lately, choreography, musicality, the costumes and Akiko's personal artistry and joy, I love every second of them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    With all due respect, I find it hard to believe the majority of dislikes are from Yu Na fans. As much as I love Akiko, I cant imagine any sane Yu Na fan who has ever viewed Suzuki as a rival of any kind to Kim, or one now either. I am shocked at the high number of dislikes though. I think if anything it would more likely be upset Mao fans who are shocked with how Nationals went down. It could be neutral fans who dont like the score (which is stupid given the inflated Nationals scoring from every country, she certainly deserved a higher score than either Julia or Adelina got at Russian Nationals). I think quite likely it could be Miki Ando fans who largely seemed to think Miki could waltz right back and take old Suzuki's spot on the team no problem, and instead Miki had to compose herself and skate after Suzuki all but shut the door on her making the team before her long program even began. Who knows really, but I highly doubt it would be Yu Na fans unless they are a far more paranoid and bizarre group of individuals than I imagined.

    I dont see any real skating fan could dislike that though. It was an exceptional performance and is probably the best moment in figure skating in years from an emotional standpoint.
    Read those comments made by Koreans using Google translation. Their user names and/or comments are in hangeul, so it's easy to spot.

    Suzuki's video didn't get so many dislikes when she won NHK in 2011.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeko666 View Post
    Read those comments made by Koreans using Google translation. Their user names and/or comments are in hangeul, so it's easy to spot.

    Suzuki's video didn't get so many dislikes when she won NHK in 2011.
    Do you know that many of Korean comments are positive ones? I see only small number of negative comments. Don't you think some YuNa uber fans may have been pleased when Akikko beat Mao?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cosmos View Post
    Don't you think some YuNa uber fans may have been pleased when Akikko beat Mao?
    As long as Suzuki doesn't become a threat to Kim. Yes, they were quite sympathetic to Suzuki when she lost 2012 NHK to Asada by 0.05.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by cosmos View Post
    Do you know that many of Korean comments are positive ones? I see only small number of negative comments. Don't you think some YuNa uber fans may have been pleased when Akikko beat Mao?
    I know I wasn't bothered by Akiko beating Mao (edited for clarity)

  10. #85
    Six Point Zero Krislite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeko666 View Post
    Leaving Suzuki more vulnerable? I don't think so. I guess her fans are more mature and intelligent. It's total waste of time dealing with those idiotic "nationalistic zealots" who are giving Korea a bad name in public.

    If you understand Japanese, you will find remarks from Asada fans as nasty as those comments by Koreans on Youtube. This is nothing new to Suzuki, really. Basically Maobots and Yunabots are really alike.
    By "vulnerable" I mean that she has far fewer fans who would forcefully defend her unlike Mao or Yuna. They feel freer to attack her as a consequence.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    With all due respect, I find it hard to believe the majority of dislikes are from Yu Na fans. As much as I love Akiko, I cant imagine any sane Yu Na fan who has ever viewed Suzuki as a rival of any kind to Kim, or one now either. I am shocked at the high number of dislikes though. I think if anything it would more likely be upset Mao fans who are shocked with how Nationals went down. It could be neutral fans who dont like the score (which is stupid given the inflated Nationals scoring from every country, she certainly deserved a higher score than either Julia or Adelina got at Russian Nationals). I think quite likely it could be Miki Ando fans who largely seemed to think Miki could waltz right back and take old Suzuki's spot on the team no problem, and instead Miki had to compose herself and skate after Suzuki all but shut the door on her making the team before her long program even began. Who knows really, but I highly doubt it would be Yu Na fans unless they are a far more paranoid and bizarre group of individuals than I imagined.

    I dont see any real skating fan could dislike that though. It was an exceptional performance and is probably the best moment in figure skating in years from an emotional standpoint.
    True. We don't know where those 700 negative ratings came from since there were only a few dozen comments in total, only some of which were by Koreans. On the other hand, she did upset several heavy favorites for the Nationals title. Very inconclusive either way, I feel.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    Most of the awful comments under YuNa's FS are from the Koreans. I guess they will never like Mao, nor any other skater. These fans make YuNa look bad. No wonder she has a huge entourage, body guard flotilla. Unhinged fanatics must chase her everywhere. It is too bad she broke with Orser, or the mother more accurately. Canada was clearly a place where she was free to be herself, and skated her best years. I am shocked, but then when I see the behavior of the "mob" on GS and how pushy...I guess nothing surprises me. Perhaps it is for the best the retirements coming soon.
    I am sorry but your obsession with Yu Na Kim and Yu Na Kim fans has become scary. It is 10 times worse than any so called Yu Na Kim uber I have seen (although I dont bother reading comments on youtube, only a bunch of losers would hang out there or go there for anything other than watching interesting videos that others were kind enough to post).

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeko666 View Post
    Read those comments made by Koreans using Google translation. Their user names and/or comments are in hangeul, so it's easy to spot.

    Suzuki's video didn't get so many dislikes when she won NHK in 2011.
    OK I will do that sometime today just to see what you are talking about, although as I said the last thing I like to waste my time on is commenting or going through comments made by youtube losers who actually waste time posting on youtube.

    All I can say is that I am a fan of both Yu Na and Akiko and that I am a bigger fan of Akiko than Yu Na, and nothing would make me happier than something crazy like Akiko winning the Olympic Gold with 160 points in her long program. However I can also say beyond a shadow of doubt I never considered Akiko a threat to Yu Na (and I am someone who would like if she were) and even after her amazing Nationals showing I still dont. Given the way the judges view both, Yu Na would have to bomb badly to lose to Akiko in any head to head competition. The only skater who is a potential threat to Yu Na is Mao if she somehow go through a program with all her difficulty better than almost ever. Akiko is a potential threat to anyone but Yu Na if she skates as well as Nationals, but not to Yu Na. That is my objective viewpoint from the side as someone who likes both, so if there are indeed Yu Na fans who fear Akiko than I can only say they are overly paranoid and delusional individuals who are indeed probably fanatical over Yu Na, the way most of the losers who waste time posting on youtube are fanatical about something or another. As I dont have the mental makeup to think along the same lines as such stupid individuals though I could not relate to their train of thought.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    All I can say is that I am a fan of both Yu Na and Akiko and that I am a bigger fan of Akiko than Yu Na, and nothing would make me happier than something crazy like Akiko winning the Olympic Gold with 160 points in her long program. However I can also say beyond a shadow of doubt I never considered Akiko a threat to Yu Na (and I am someone who would like if she were) and even after her amazing Nationals showing I still dont. Given the way the judges view both, Yu Na would have to bomb badly to lose to Akiko in any head to head competition. The only skater who is a potential threat to Yu Na is Mao if she somehow go through a program with all her difficulty better than almost ever. Akiko is a potential threat to anyone but Yu Na if she skates as well as Nationals, but not to Yu Na. That is my objective viewpoint from the side as someone who likes both, so if there are indeed Yu Na fans who fear Akiko than I can only say they are overly paranoid and delusional individuals who are indeed probably fanatical over Yu Na, the way most of the losers who waste time posting on youtube are fanatical about something or another. As I dont have the mental makeup to think along the same lines as such stupid individuals though I could not relate to their train of thought.
    I agree, if they both skate at Sochi like they did at their nationals, Kim still will win FS. As you wrote, it's all about how the judges view the skaters, not how well the skaters perform. Bombing Kim still will beat perfect Suzuki just like Asada won 2012 NHK.

    I am still surprised that JSF let Suzuki win the national. I thought she was the last skater they would want to give a national title, and am sure I was not alone. I bet Asada's sponsors, which are big corporations, aren't happy. Japan Airlines even made wrapped airplanes for her assuming she was going to win. It's amusing how Japanese major media have been ignoring Suzuki even after she won at the national as if it never happened.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    OK I will do that sometime today just to see what you are talking about, although as I said the last thing I like to waste my time on is commenting or going through comments made by youtube losers who actually waste time posting on youtube.

    All I can say is that I am a fan of both Yu Na and Akiko and that I am a bigger fan of Akiko than Yu Na, and nothing would make me happier than something crazy like Akiko winning the Olympic Gold with 160 points in her long program. However I can also say beyond a shadow of doubt I never considered Akiko a threat to Yu Na (and I am someone who would like if she were) and even after her amazing Nationals showing I still dont. Given the way the judges view both, Yu Na would have to bomb badly to lose to Akiko in any head to head competition. The only skater who is a potential threat to Yu Na is Mao if she somehow go through a program with all her difficulty better than almost ever. Akiko is a potential threat to anyone but Yu Na if she skates as well as Nationals, but not to Yu Na. That is my objective viewpoint from the side as someone who likes both, so if there are indeed Yu Na fans who fear Akiko than I can only say they are overly paranoid and delusional individuals who are indeed probably fanatical over Yu Na, the way most of the losers who waste time posting on youtube are fanatical about something or another. As I dont have the mental makeup to think along the same lines as such stupid individuals though I could not relate to their train of thought.
    As you described well, most YuNa fans do not consider Akikko a threat. And, there was no reason YuNa fans were unhappy when Akikko beat Mao, and there is no reason YuNa fans leave hate comments on the Akikko video.

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