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Thread: Yuna Kim's short and long programs

  1. #526
    Six Point Zero Krislite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nguyenghita View Post
    Okay, please do not said for our fans's mind as if you are one of us

    We did expect, yes, but not something "must be very special" eveytime she show us her hard work products. Yuna is human afterall, she has her limit, she was tired too, why always complain "this not good enough for her standard"; "this good but not masterpiece"; "this great for eveyone else but not for Yuna" blah blah blah ... so frustrating

    And it's not like you appreciate Yuna sooo much to want her do something more special for her good, you simply just want to find something to criticize her, nothing Yuna do make you feel "ah, it's great", so get over it

    You hate her then fine, don't care, leave her alone, thank you!!!
    Is this the first time you've encountered our dear, sweet skateluvr? No amount of venting will help, I assure you...

  2. #527
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krislite View Post
    Is this the first time you've encountered our dear, sweet skateluvr? No amount of venting will help, I assure you...
    Yeah, my bad

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    Quote Originally Posted by Selene View Post
    Yuna's programs this season bore me. The musical selections are poor and she isn't bringing it performance-wise, especially in the long program. Maybe she is too introverted to pull off a tango? She isn't giving any of the fire needed to bring the program to life. She is skating the program like a robot/zombie.

    I also don't see how her program is that difficult. She is basically doing a million crossovers across the whole expanse of the rink with no transitions (except for the spread eagle into double axel) into her jumps. She is in no way the female Patrick Chan in terms of the complexity her programs. In fact, I feel that she and Wilson often use arm movements to distract from the lack of complexity of her programs.
    Wow Are you kidding? I can see many choreos and transitions in YuNa's LP.Very impressive choreo right after the opening 3-3, foot work preceding to the 3s-2t andalso very unique choreo right after the 3S and beautiful tango step after the flip.ina bauer and very difficult spread eagle entry changing edge three times before the 2A in SP also foot work before her 3 flip in SP, beautiful step in choreo sequence.

    Do you even know what transition means? Transition includes choreos, edge changes, steps. ect.I quite agreed with British Euro's commentator's opinion on Mao's LP “just Up and Down, up and down before the step..”

  4. #529
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    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    No one has answered me why this is so difficult
    The emotions the music stirs are private. It's not bombastic extroverted music. You can't just go out there and emote this kind of performance to the audience. You have to really draw them in.

    ETA:
    And as someone else pointed out, the program is physically demanding. There are no breaks.

  5. #530
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krislite View Post
    Is this the first time you've encountered our dear, sweet skateluvr? No amount of venting will help, I assure you...
    Oh, Krislite. I am sweet and so are you. Where have you been? Will you stay here when she retires? I sure hope rabid does...the nice uber.

  6. #531
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krislite View Post
    It could also be the music--the flurry of notes in her choreographic sequence at the end demands energy and rapid movements, as opposed to her Les Mis choreo sequence which by the nature of the music helps to carry her to the end. There is music than can imbue you with energy and then there's music that demands energy from you. I think Adios is the latter.
    That's a really good post Krislite, thanks for sharing your thought.

  7. #532
    축복, 축도 RABID's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    Oh, Krislite. I am sweet and so are you. Where have you been? Will you stay here when she retires? I sure hope rabid does...the nice uber.

  8. #533
    Adiós Melon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    Oh, Krislite. I am sweet and so are you. Where have you been? Will you stay here when she retires? I sure hope rabid does...the nice uber.
    what

  9. #534
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    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    Please calm down. No one hates Yuna, esp the person...do not use incendiary words like "hate." It is ridiculous false and sounds childish. She is your idol, I am sure. We all want to see Olympic level skating from all the ladues!!!! Please chill, I am sure it will get better. She doesn't need you to act like a Doberman. Please, be polite. We discuss opinions here and it is no slight to you. I am sorry if you do not understand. Be well.
    Speaking of being incendiary and childish, I thought you won those categories hands down when you mentioned something about North Korean DNA and how Yuna fans share the same vile genetic information. I think your comments are full of thinly-veiled disdain for the reigning Olympic and World champion and I'm sure that's the general sentiment here.

  10. #535
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    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    No one has answered me why this is so difficult, so I will assume it is only someone's opinion, or someone repeating what YuNa said. She did not say why it was difficult, and maybe, she took out transitions david put in to make it less so. I don't know. I wish someone would address that, tho.

    YuNa has skated to Tango Roxanne, and she was very fiery then. It was a long time ago, tho, and that is the criticism, that YuNa did not skate with fire and commitment at either nationals or Zagreb. Les Mis was very good music for her and I liked it. She maybe was in better shape last year, no stated injury as in this year.

    Well, I have watched Clowns a few times. YuNa is not ever over stated in her facial expressions. She does however seem to feel this music if you watch her face. And it was skated litely. I like it better every time I watch. Her SP is not the problem. I feel she will not win the crowd at this point with Adios Nonino. It needs a lot I think. But comparing 2014 to 2010 Yuna is a no win, even Les Mis. I thought was well done, and clearly it was a clean great skate for Yuna and she deserved to win. I think many Yuna fans just wanted to see some special, hardly used music, different choreo. I was hoping David Wilson would out do himself. My idea was to revive "Lark" a program from the young innocent YuNa and see what it would look like as a mature young lady who has won an OGM. The choreography of many CoP programs are about amassing points. Like RABID said, I'd rather see something very special, and memorable, and stunning dress and music than something that was the best technical program they could maange to get her on podium. I am afraid many will be looking for 2010 Yuna. Korea will love whatever she does, but after waiting so long and seeing so little of her this year, it is only normal for all the regular fans to be expecting something awesome. And ubers too.
    Sorry, I was out. I didn't see your post until just right now. To understand better the difficulty of Adios, I will compare it to Gershwin. In fact, Gershwin is incredibly difficult to skate to as well. the nuance, lack of continuity, sophistication characterized by droplet like pause and piano strokes that leaves skaters audibly vulnerable compared to music echoing throughout the auditorium; it does not shield skater's blade's noise, etc. all are unnerving factors that unsettle skaters. While violin music gives stability because of its continuity compatible with linearity of skater's motion. think about how other skaters would skate to Gershwin. Is there anybody who possibly replicate the way Kim did? Unless you move like a ballerina, light as a feathery grace, while you executing technical elements and embodies interpretive musicality in choreography at the same time, Gershwin will be a nightmare. Now Adios, first of all interpretation still needs to be identified. Gershwin is quintessential grace, that being said, Kim did brilliantly. I can't pinpoint theme yet in Adios. that's first difficulty. then once theme is identified, how to embody in a bodily language is another thing. Like Gershwin Adios does not provide overarching shield of music which skaters can feel comfortable with. For example, Les M. is a relatively easy music to skate to; it has linearity, development to climax is easy to identify, and its prototype follows musical logistics; it's not internally inventive. you don't have to extrapolate anything in order to find what centers on that piecemeal type compound such as Gershwin or Adios. But in Adios, what kinds of language you are going to use needs to be decided. in case of Gershwin, it was ballerina type dance, but what is in the Adios? Hard to answer. It is certainly not her 2007 Tango. Skating to music means you are making interpretive move while skating; that you and your moves are subject to music, that is music is dominating you not you dominating music. As in Gershwin or Adios, you can't expect that to happen. Not that music moves you, so to speak, you have to creatively and conductively move the music to the audience, because the kind of music you are skating to are not providing that basic rendering in these two cases. hope this helps

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    Quote Originally Posted by Selene View Post
    Yuna's programs this season bore me. The musical selections are poor and she isn't bringing it performance-wise, especially in the long program. Maybe she is too introverted to pull off a tango? She isn't giving any of the fire needed to bring the program to life. She is skating the program like a robot/zombie.

    I also don't see how her program is that difficult. She is basically doing a million crossovers across the whole expanse of the rink with no transitions (except for the spread eagle into double axel) into her jumps. She is in no way the female Patrick Chan in terms of the complexity her programs. In fact, I feel that she and Wilson often use arm movements to distract from the lack of complexity of her programs.
    I totally agree.

  13. #538
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    Those who strongly feels this LP don't have the emotional pull, fair enough, I am not even going to bother convince you otherwise since at least to me, this is clearly not the direction this program is about. Adios wasn't originally conceived as a eulogy and was written some 5 years ago prior to the composer's father's passing as a fusion of Jazz and Tango, certainly one only need to hear this particular Jazzy music edit on a visceral level to know the team are going for a decisively modern take to refocus on the skating rather than the all too obvious (and therefore cheapened) sentimentality. I am a big believer in the strength of concepts and the quality of decisions to create any piece of creative work are just as valuable than the superficial rendering of it, and Yuna Kim's programs continues to provide me the bests.

    In this rapid paced internet age under anonymity, it provide people a false sense of entitlement to toss any fickle minded self absorbed drivel through sheer volume, but they are too often of little value (it is the top 10% quality thoughts that keeps me coming back), especially when someone's 'blessed ignorance' can be just as valued as someone else's real 'knowledge' and 'insights' regardless the quality of their education or life learning experience. They are usually short sighted and lacks in context, or at worst, agenda driven. It seems all a bit of a pointless exercise in the end, other than let the work speak for itself: at the Olympics, beyond the Olympics to see how will this piece of work be truly appreciated and understood on its own merit, and whether this program will outlasts those who recycled their 'greatest' programs this year.

    I will say this, just like my gut reaction tells me Les Miserable will be an amazing classic EPIC at its first inception for the history of ladies figure skating in that little arena that only fit 300 people. Or that Gershwin is the most sophisticated program that evoke such strong feelings as if I have witnessing the very peak of virtuosity done as effortlessly and naturally on ice as humanly possible - before I am even aware who is Kim Yuna is or the score been announced. Or that her Homage deserve to win WC2011 solely on the merit of that program, despite of its somewhat puzzling reception at the world championship arena full of murmurs. I will stick by my opinion Adios will be the most amazing work of the highest order by an elite athlete / artist in every sense of the word, who reaches the full maturation to realise her craft on her own terms. Who does not compromise the integrity of her sport and arts to be popular, to be readily understood, to gain favours easily from the judges or the casual observers through familiarity and deliver what is expected. It seek beyond that. In more ways than one, SITC already proved Yuna Kim is fully capable to deliver the standard convention of what makes a classic lovely ladies program of the old worlds, but she chose not follow the same stance on her last program, why? After all, when all said and done, beyond the Olympics, beyond COP, beyond our life time, what are the true universal values of excellence for someone who have proved she can do it all and have done it all? What does skating for herself mean @ 2nd Olympics?

    Art at its purist in ideology and execution does not conform to any standards of conventions. Art is not a popularity contest vote by democracy, nor created for entertainment or commercial values. It is certainly free from any established standard of cultural identity, or institutional standard of believes other than the laws which it need to abide by in order to thrive. Rather, at its core essences, it is about peeling away the layers of banality to advance with purest intentions to discover new truths and merits that are valuable to the artists while they seek new standards of excellence, of transcendence.

    The most important pieces of art work of any great artist are rarely about any particular techniques, execution, imitation, composition, replication of previous successes, certainly not about any particular calculated intentions for mass appeal. The lower end of art spectrum are usually done through aesthetics superficiality, instant gratification through emotionally calculation but they lack in substance, essences and failure to harness real wealth of knowledge, experience and insights to 'critically' examine the quality of decisions to discover and realise a new type of work. Elite learning of the highest order is a solitary process of uncompromising self actualisation that is honest, authentic to the artist life learning, journey and experience. It is what rendered them unique individuals with unique perspectives and opinions. It seeks to break down barriers, to go outside the box, for liberty and be truly artistically free. Had the same tradition been followed again and again, art became stagnant, it is stuck in its ways, it might as well be dead.

    Art when done well has the capability to expand intellectual horizons. It can expand the imagination, shook believes, cause self doubts, and takes you way outside your comfort zone. Artists should never be afraid to challenge perceptions by risks taking, have courage and experimentation to seek authentic realisation.

    There are very few programs appeals to me in the true artistic sense of the word under this COP tick list system, but that hasn't stop me declaring these best programs this quad upon first viewings are Hanyu's Romeo and Juliet, Tessa and Scott's Carmen, Jeremy's Muse, Patrick's Elegie, Mao's Jupiter, Dai's 2011 programs. The one constant reason that keeps me watching this sport is Yuna Kim, always surprising, who's team continues to make bold choices, reinvent herself season after season, challenge audience's perceptions, step outside her comfort zone, not for the sake of reinvention, but about making the right choices at the right time. She knows herself, although always ambitious, she rarely over promise. Like all greatest artists, her arts has aspect of art imitate life, and her Adios certainly will be on her own terms. I am really looking forward to see if she can deliver as it is intended.

  14. #539
    Yuna's Ice Rink cooper's Avatar
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    at least yuna didn't run to her old programs.. and chickened out.. lol.. at least she's taking a risk with this music cut of adios which is not even a crowd pleaser.. when i saw her lp again through other fan cams.. w/ more close ups you can tell the program has promise.. if she can put more fire into it..

  15. #540
    Long live the Queen! YunaBliss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by os168 View Post

    ...Who does not compromise the integrity of her sport and arts to be popular, to be readily understood, to gain favours easily from the judges or the casual observers through familiarity and deliver what is expected. It seek beyond that. In more ways than one, SITC already proved Yuna Kim is fully capable to deliver the standard convention of what makes a classic lovely ladies program of the old worlds, but she chose not follow the same stance on her last program, why?

    Art at its purist in ideology and execution does not conform to any standards of conventions. Art is not a popularity contest vote by democracy, nor created for entertainment or commercial values. It is certainly free from any established standard of cultural identity, or institutional standard of believes other than the laws which it need to abide by in order to thrive. Rather, at its core essences, it is about peeling away the layers of banality to advance with purest intentions to discover new truths and merits that are valuable to the artists while they seek new standards of excellence, of transcendence.
    Great thoughts.

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