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Thread: Pre-Euros Media and introduction of skaters

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGothicEme View Post
    Also, do you have any information at all about Volosozhar/Trankov? Is there a P&G about them?
    I was looking for news even today, but I didn't find any new interview with them just that video which I already posted.
    No, they don't have P&G contract, as I know.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frenchie View Post
    I'd like to point out a regrettable misunderstanding that's caused by the language barrier:
    Thanks for precise translation, your English is much better than mine, I see it in every your post. As to aggressive notes to my person it is nice to know that not everything was meant how I understood and felt it. Please, could you continue in translating things precisely and prove me that those peaple are not offending me with this kind of words…

    Your writing style shows sort of desperation (by hanca)
    this pile of mud slinging for what it is…
    Sisinka's attitude toward the pair is clearly toxic…
    It just comes across as vindictive and cruel… (everything by Bramweld)



    Quote Originally Posted by Frenchie View Post
    Also, this whole chapter you wrote about haters...Hanca never said that.
    As to haters question – probably Hanca should confirm herself that she didn’t think that I would be a hater. And sure she will if you are right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frenchie View Post
    You obviously have deep knowledge about Ice Dance, and that's why I'm so curious about you:
    I am a person connected to figure skating and music for a long time, but I am also connected to some other things…

  3. #33
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    So why stop here? Tell us everything, clearly you had every intention of doing so, am I not correct? Why go to such lengths about ONLY one pair. No one looks that good up close. They are a developing pair like many others. How long did it take B/S to achieve the notoriety they achieved last season? Wasn't it not after working together for some 14 years?

    All we're saying is if you're going to target one pair to expose all their perceived failings, while brushing aside anything positive as insignificant, this creates a negative atmosphere around them ONLY needlessly. Why have you not done the same for B/S, S/Z, S/B and R/T? Can I take a guess as to your motivation? Is it because the inordinate amount of praise that they've received this year is unsettling? So they are not your cup of tea, why not discuss those pairs who are? Why do you need to provide this much perspective? Why can't we just be allowed to like each pair as we'd like? Why this need to throw cold water on them at every opportunity?

    You are connected so I'm sure you can do a similar expose on all our Russian pairs. But is it that this is not your agenda for reasons only you understand. Why not talk about the fact that B/S didn't exit the EC to work on their programs but to rather get last years FD ready for the Olympics? This was recently posted in the media today right? Why aren't we talking about that?

  4. #34
    Tripping on the Podium TheGothicEme's Avatar
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    Sisinka did not talk about Bobrova/Soloviev because this is a threat of Pre ECh Media, and BS won't go to ECh. And other things also concerns BS she said are in other the thread, like the Russsian Nationals. And the amout of IK information is bigger than other skaters, that's why she got into it. I said this before, and I said this again, reread her posts, I saw none of personal hate toward IK, she only translated the Russian media, and throw in her analyses - which are logic and right. If you don't agree, prove them wrong (like why is the choreo makes sense to you, or why their step sequences and edges are better than sisinka thought, or how their footwork are good? Such thing) don't just jump in and call her hater or pile of mud or insult her like that. The one behaved wrong is not sisinka, she create this thread to talk about Pre ECh Media, she did good job to share her point of view, in a polite way. But you, bramweld, are the one who did not.
    and this is off topic, but if BS reuse their last year's fd, what's wrong about it? If they skate it good, it is good.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by bramweld View Post
    Sisinka's attitude toward the pair is clearly toxic but is it really necessary to go to such lengths to convince others of this?
    You are not catching the point, Bramweld. I have my opinions and if someone tries to say that it is not true (or starts to be offensive), then I simply explain why I have these opinions – this is a sense of all discussions. And once you start to prove something and give an examples – the post is longer then when you just say: “I know it!“ or “It is exactly like that!“ Hanca and Bramweld try to put me into position of someone who has some personal problems with the couple or with Morozov, completely ignoring that many of my opinions can be supported with objective things (what you see at videos, what is written in rules). Usually technical ability and choreo’s difficulty can be judged quite objectively by viewer. Good dancer / not good dancer is a little more difficult question and probably less objective but even there you can work with dynamics of movements (comparing it to dynamics of music), keeping the rhythm, body posture / hands position…and some other helping criteria to see what dancing qualities are.

    While I was writing about skating and dancing and when I doubted about some of your opinions about I&K…you started to write about me, not about skating.

    Try to understand it, first you said something what I didn’t agree with, secondly I started to say why I don’t agree and why I think something else, thirdly you started to write offensive or impolite things about my person, fourthly I again proved why I think those things and that I can really support it with some facts (in contrast to you who didn’t come with anything objective, just Frenchiecame with marks, but from different competitions), fifthly you again started to be impolite (like Bramweld’s and Hanca’s words above), sixthly I again wrote why I think so…it is like neverending story…but on the beginning there were your words making I&K a perfect dance couple – perfect in both skating and dancing, and long posts were made because of your permanent attempt to achieve that goal, but I didn’t agree that they would have such qualities. I also wrote to GPF thread about other skaters…and nobody started pushing me like you did.

    I agree with Alex D on 100%, I am not against discussions but I would love to see a respect to all people no matter if they have the same or different opinions. I am not against I&K (which I start to be tired of you as well when you are so much pushing me to a position of someone who doesn’t like them), I am not against anyone who support this couple, but I don’t agree with your opinions about their qualities which they don’t have yet.
    If I took I&K like average couple who are happy to make top 10 at European Championships I would say OK, let’s skate how you can. But as I know the couple wants to reach the highest goals in their career. So in this case they should show much more than what they are showing now. There should be a technical difficulty (which can reach at least top world 5 couples, if they want to medal at World Championships as well), great edges (they have), great presentation where it is obvious that they express the music or story, keeping the rhythm and the dances should be without mistakes (at least without big mistakes), and if the couple would fight to the end of program without giving up after first problem it would be appreciated also – it is champion’s character never to give up.

  6. #36
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    You confirm my point. I was not the one to call her a hater. You were the one that implied that I did. I did say her (I don't know if I am correct here) comments seemed prejudiced. Now its up to her to balance her approach. And I reiterate there is currently loads of press on many athletes not just I/K. Why are they the only ones being discussed with such fervour? That is and remains my question. Also if sisinka has discussed other pairs similarly in previous threads just add the links here. I have no problems with eating crow if someone can back up their words.

    I just have a problem with so many persons seeming preoccupation to paint them in as worst a light as possible without valid reason. Or at least it baffles me as to why persons need to do this. This in essence is my point. Why create a thread, in fact one of many on different boards, with the sole purpose of pointing out their deficiencies? Why the need to single them out for all this attention and there are so many other equally good if not better teams out there that could be admired? This is where I'm at in a nutshell.

  7. #37
    Tripping on the Podium TheGothicEme's Avatar
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    And sisinka, could u please give your thought on Cappellini/Lanotte? I love their fd, well, first time saw a Rosina on ice, Anna is so good at portraying and interpreting classical pieces (just like last year with Carmen), I really love Rossini's opera, especially Rossina. But Lanotte is somehow... weird (?), well, maybe because of his innjuries. Care to enlighten me, sisinka?

  8. #38
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    Because they are what you all assume that will be next ECh Champion, (with PB and BS out), she think that it is wrong, they are not there yet. Like she said, if IK is just trying to just stay on top 10, then she thinks they are quite good, but if they try to win a medal (especially silver or gold), then no, that's the point, that's what makes her analyses about them more detail.

  9. #39
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    My dear as Charlie White said some time ago, dance ceased to be a bout dance a long time ago. This has become a technical sport. It may be best to rename it ice figures because it is all about edges and obtaining levels. In fact being too artistic is actually a disadvantage. It is better that you be more technically gifted. Artistry is seemingly closely knit with how well you achieve these objectives within the COP, as well as just the composition of the dance itself. I/K would have done well in the 6.0 system. So though I would be happy for them if they won, trust me it is not a forgone conclusion. They have great difficulty in merging these too aspects of the COP system (TES and PCS) and Nikita is a nervous competitor. Zhulin refered to them as these "artistic types" quite unflattteringly because of it. It would be easier to say that C/L have this one. The only problem is though their dances are good they are not as impactful as their latin short dance and their la strada FD two seasons ago. IMHO, the FD just seems too one note. But in the end it will not matter if their edges and levels are good. This is what makes it exciting for me. Which of the two pairs will pull it together.

    Also I am excited to see the C/P, S/Z, C/B, C/J, R/T match up. It looks to be tight to me.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by bramweld View Post
    This is a media thread right? Why don't we get back to that? Case in point; http://news.sportbox.ru/Vidy_sporta/...e-bolelischiki
    Elena Ilinykh's article (13th of January):

    To free dance at World Championships: “We analyse all mistakes, which we made, we changed a systém of preparation and we came to Olympic season in different way.“

    To a reason for that unsuccessful skate in past years: “I think that we missed many things – a little bit of time, good specialists and physical conditioning also. With Nikita we are a young couple, it was not easy for us to make, for example, a difficult lifts. We worked seriously on lifts this summer and now everybody it telling us that we improved a lot in it.“

    To mistake before lift at Russian Nationals: “A technical vacillation – it is a rarity. I promise that we will not repeat it. But we were rejoice that a program was emotional. “

    To a program of Swan Lake which is almost called the best program of this season internationally: “Morozov kept that program for us, we agree immediately – we fell with the program on 100%. It is totally “our“ music. I like all – idea, images..We were successful to feel this dance fully. And because of it, this program is liked by both spectators and specialists.“

    If she ever skated to same music which she didn’t like: “No. Even I can call last years free dance a successful experiment. We didn’t get high place at World Championships, but we revealed that image and tell a story. We are both with Nikita – a very universal people, we want to try everything.“

    The most favourite programs: “I like a lot both short and free dance in this season. And of course The Schindler List“

    How many years do you skate with Nikita?: “Nikita’s mom offered to skate with Nikita. In the beginning I was cold to it – I thought that without jumps it is not serious. But I liked Nikita and it played a role. To him – to the end of world (smiling). The beginning was hard…“

    If they support each other: “Of yourse. It is important to have a support of close people. My mom sends me such message before a competition, that I simply fly. And I have a ritual (if I have time before a start) to sleep and to wash my hair, then I feel more sure. “
    To TEB: “In Paris there was everything in one: a good preparation and good mood and a success. I reached to control all technical nuances, even those which are not seen by spectators. But there is still work in front of us. Mainly in choreography.“

    To ballet dancer: “Because of training schedule we didn’t work with Diana Visnevska. But a person from Bolshoi Teatr came to us and concerned about our choreography. I think that thanks to it we improved.“

    If Olympics in home-country will help: “I think that fans will support. I feel the support of public very much. If a spectators take support warmly, than you want to disillusionize him, to make everything on 100% to show what were you working on for so long. But it is hard to say – I never skated at Olympics and all people around says that there is another atmosphere and another mood there.“

    About rivals: “I am watching attentively all performances and I can say that this season all couples in top 10 are ready greatly. But the most important that they all have their unrepeatable style which you can’t forget. The fight will be serious.“

    To Pantene, if it take away from preparation: “On the contrary. I am proud of being the ambassador of beauty, firstly I use these products in life. I understand that hair – it is a daily treatment. Beside, haircut – it is inseparable part of image in figure skating. Secondly, it is interesting and useful for me – I meet new people, I learn to work in front of camera, I learn nuances for making haircut and I take advises of Pantene stylist.“

    About being actress after skating: “Yes. When you skate, you touch theatrical world closely. We are going to theatre, we watch many musicals. And it is always interesting. When you dance on the ice, we have many technical limits, and no every image can be revealed fully. On the screen it is different. Because of it I would like to be actress. Yet it is a dream only, in close future time my life is connected to sport“

  11. #41
    Tripping on the Podium TheGothicEme's Avatar
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    So this is your reason to prove that sisinka is wrong and IK are really that good (as good as top 3 ECh or Russian Champs?
    And actually, Zhulin said this " Our sport is ice dancing, not gymnastics on ice. Come on, let’s add the valnut and the parallel bars! I think some sort of change is needed. If there were some sort of ISU conferences I’d say the pairs to look up to are Virtue/Moir and Weaver/Poje.You get goosebumps when watching their dance. It’s cool! This is what we should inspire for." That's it

  12. #42
    Tripping on the Podium TheGothicEme's Avatar
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    So, bramweld, if dance is about technique & edge work now, why don't you prove us that IK have deep egde work & good step sequences or better speed or nicer dance hold? Come on then? Or actually you can't and they do not?

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by bramweld View Post
    You confirm my point. I was not the one to call her a hater. You were the one that implied that I did. I did say her (I don't know if I am correct here) comments seemed prejudiced. Now its up to her to balance her approach. And I reiterate there is currently loads of press on many athletes not just I/K. Why are they the only ones being discussed with such fervour? That is and remains my question. Also if sisinka has discussed other pairs similarly in previous threads just add the links here. I have no problems with eating crow if someone can back up their words. .
    A hater thing was to Hanca, not to you. If I wrote it that it looked like a question to you, I am sorry. You wrote many other things, I wrote about it.

    Still not catching the point. I am appreciating all skaters for their hard work (partly because I really know how they are feeling). If you would read more carefully - I wrote more than once that long essays about my opinion to I&K are written because you and some others are trying to make a bad person from me because of my opinions, so I explain I am not a bad one who wants to destroy I&K - but it leads to talking more and more about things which I don't count like great things looking at the couple. Other skater's fans are polite enough not to try to destroy everybody who has some technical/presentation/rhythm issues about their favourite couple.

    Quote Originally Posted by bramweld View Post
    I just have a problem with so many persons seeming preoccupation to paint them in as worst a light as possible without valid reason. Or at least it baffles me as to why persons need to do this. This in essence is my point. Why create a thread, in fact one of many on different boards, with the sole purpose of pointing out their deficiencies? Why the need to single them out for all this attention and there are so many other equally good if not better teams out there that could be admired? This is where I'm at in a nutshell.
    I also have problems when somebody forced a couple to split (it is not just I&K, but also many other athletes), I don't like this approach. And I never wrote a word about it, and I already wrote that those things shouldn't be discussed at Goldenskate Forum (and I wrote it to you Bramweld, when you already tried to put me to that cathegory). I am not responsible for people who write such things about splitting. You shouldn't be aggressive to me just because you don't like those disrespectful people. I also don't like them, but it doesn't lead me to be disrespectful to you.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGothicEme View Post
    So this is your reason to prove that sisinka is wrong and IK are really that good (as good as top 3 ECh or Russian Champs?
    And actually, Zhulin said this " Our sport is ice dancing, not gymnastics on ice. Come on, let’s add the valnut and the parallel bars! I think some sort of change is needed. If there were some sort of ISU conferences I’d say the pairs to look up to are Virtue/Moir and Weaver/Poje.You get goosebumps when watching their dance. It’s cool! This is what we should inspire for." That's it
    Actually I'm not interested in proving her right or wrong. I sort of just move on very quickly where disagreements are concerned or I would like to think so. It was just an opinion. In fact, given I/K consistency issues, making a prediction with respect to them doesn't interest me. In fact I am not one to make predictions I don't think I ever have on any forum. I like I/K when they're on but I also admire other pairs and I'm not adverse to discussing them as well.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by bramweld View Post
    Why can't we just be allowed to like each pair as we'd like? Why this need to throw cold water on them at every opportunity?
    I wrote in every second post that I respect everybody's decision about favourite couple, I wrote it many times. But I also wrote that if those fans starts to put a couple in the Hall of fame in moment when a couple is not reaching the level of this, I don't agree. You are allowed to like anybody and I already wrote it many times.

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