Senior Ladies SP | Page 19 | Golden Skate

Senior Ladies SP

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
Gracie clearly wins Mirai in Transitions, Skating Skills, Choreography and even Performance/Execution...

There is no basis for scoring Nagasu over Gold in PCS. Maybe last year, but not with what Gold put out this go-around.

Nagasu uses more crossovers, has less transitions, skates slower, has worse ice coverage, her program is not choreographed as well and was not as well-performed as Gold's. Again, your opinion is fairly baseless. Look at the criteria for PCS. Gracie's program isn't just better, but smartly constructed. This probably would have scored that high internationally, if her old one couldn't I 69+. It actually wasn't that much off.

I think Ashley gets a PCS boost and she has some of the weakest footwork (technically speaking) of the top contenders. Lots of flat turns and switching edges before turns, etc. (She has actually admitted to this in interview, which makes it even MORE noticeable to me now... :'( ). Her jumps looked pretty weak. O probably would have had her a couple points down.

Polina's score was in line with what other Juniors are scoring with similar programs on the Senior circuit, like Radionova. Not sure what the fuss is about. She had huge jumps and high difficulty, and these girls pop up with great IJS spins and decent footwork these days. The score was not that far off. I think she should go to set her up for the future off she skates well in the free skate...

Gracie's Lutz was one of the biggest I've ever seen.

People calling U.S. Nationals the most inflated must have missed Japanese Nationals or not seen what Yuna Kim scored at her Nationals in the SP (80+). Seriously...

As I said, I was left a bit cold in-person at the arena. And but that's just me and others who shared my opinion. However, others I talked to, really loved it and thought her score was well deserved.

Actually the best reflection of this is that she was about 50/50 as far as a standing ovation. It was interesting, people either really responded to it or didn't.

Mirai, on the other hand, had pretty much the whole audience behind her. From where I sit (Sec. 14, ha!) she had pretty good ice coverage as well. I would say she isn't as fast as Gracie's but I wouldn't say she's a total slowpoke either.

Obviously thinking about it further. I can understand logically how they got that score, but as my husband said, it was because it was a much more utilitarian, point-getting program. But that's the point (no pun intended), I suppose. You can't judge by the audience reaction, obviously. Again, I can logically understand why she's in first now, but I guess the heart doesn't quite agree. And of course, the judges shouldn't judge on heart.

IN any case, I'm a bit surprised by my reaction as someone that likes Gracie's skating in general and someone that wasn't particularly that enamored with Mirai. But that is where I'm at right now. Talk to me a few days, perhaps when I watch the videos again and the initial emotion/reaction disappears I might have a different opinion.
 

Nater

Match Penalty
Joined
Jan 10, 2014
Obviously thinking about it further. I can understand logically how they got that score, but as my husband said, it was because it was a much more utilitarian, point-getting program. But that's the point (no pun intended), I suppose. You can't judge by the audience reaction, obviously. Again, I can logically understand why she's in first now, but I guess the heart doesn't quite agree.

That's being disingenuous imo. Its simply a better program. Better choreography and construction. I'm more surprised at how well she performed it than how high the score was. I was not expecting that.

Mirai is a very popular skater with publicized issues so it does notbsurpruse anyone that the crowd reacts that way when she hits a program.
 

Jaana

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 27, 2003
Country
Finland
All that said, if Ashley doesn't make the Olympic team or is sent in third place, that's NOT helping your team reach the podium, USFS.

The third place does not hinder a skater´s podium success in any way. Don´t you remember that Evan was 3rd at the Nationals and WON the Olympic gold medal??? Besides, I think that Ashley will fare better in the freeskate.
 

Frenchie

I'm gonna customize the CRAP out of this title!
Medalist
Joined
May 4, 2013
I was genuinely happy for Mirai, but I'm a bit perplexed at the judge detail scores:
Good for her if the technical specialists deemed her 3T-3T wasn't 3T<-3T<, but it must have been a really close call, esp for the second one.
The judges are supposed to take lack of rotation into account for their GOEs, even if it wasn't enough to get a <.
Mirai got GOE +1.1 for her 3T-3T combination. Christina Gao's 3T-3T was textbook perfect in every sense of the word (Nagasu's was a 2,7T-2,7T in comparison!), and she got GOE +1.5.
A difference of only 0.4 points is not OK in my opinion.

It's one thing to boost everyone's scores because that's the cool thing to do at Nationals. But to look the other way at underrotated jumps is distorting the results, since they have to be aware that those underrotated jumps would get crucified at Sochi!

By the way, now that I finally got to see Christina Gao's SP and her "step sequence/stumble/step sequence/stumble/step sequence: :bang:
 

Jammers

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Country
United-States
I just want to see Gracie embrace this moment and not have that face of fear that we've seen so often from our top Ladies in the last 7 years of so meaning Alissa and Mirai. You could tell from the looks on their faces how they were going to skate and the same is true of Gracie. This could be her moment to break out she needs to grab it and not let go. I expect Ashley to come out fighting like she always does when she's behind so i don't see her not on the team. Mirai could surprise but polina is the wildcard. If she lands all her jumps it's going to be hard to keep her from the top 3.
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
I was in the arena, in the second row. The problem with Mirai PCS-wise is that she skates with NO expression on her face whatsoever. She's been doing the skating robot act for several years now, and both US and ISU judges have been giving her low PCS scores because of it. She just doesn't seem to be personally invested in her performance.

Gracie, Polina and Ashley all show appropriate emotions showing their relationship with their music and/or the character in the music. Mirai shows nothing. The crowd was far more enthusiastic about Mirai's performance than Mirai was. Perhaps the crowd was remembering a different, younger, joyful Mirai, who skated with youthful exuberance and couldn't stop smiling. But we haven't seen that Mirai for more than four years. The Mirai we have now is nothing like the one we used to love. I guess the hope that she will return never dies.

I saw Mirai's FS practice yesterday, and it was more of the same: James Bond girl with deadpan expression. Meanwhile, Gracie was a smiling, regal princess, Polina joyful, Ashley heartbroken. Don't expect a massive upturn in PCS for Mirai if that's the way she does her FS.
 

astronaut

Rinkside
Joined
Nov 7, 2013
I think Gold is better than Suzuki and Kostner. If Gracie can skate lights out tomorrow and at the Olympics, she can win bronze.

I agree with you. I had a feeling that Gracie G would be in peak condition for big Nationals. I'm actually watching the short programmes now. :cool:



Mike
 

smarts1

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 10, 2014
As I said, I was left a bit cold in-person at the arena. And but that's just me and others who shared my opinion. However, others I talked to, really loved it and thought her score was well deserved.

Actually the best reflection of this is that she was about 50/50 as far as a standing ovation. It was interesting, people either really responded to it or didn't.

Mirai, on the other hand, had pretty much the whole audience behind her. From where I sit (Sec. 14, ha!) she had pretty good ice coverage as well. I would say she isn't as fast as Gracie's but I wouldn't say she's a total slowpoke either.

Obviously thinking about it further. I can understand logically how they got that score, but as my husband said, it was because it was a much more utilitarian, point-getting program. But that's the point (no pun intended), I suppose. You can't judge by the audience reaction, obviously. Again, I can logically understand why she's in first now, but I guess the heart doesn't quite agree. And of course, the judges shouldn't judge on heart.

IN any case, I'm a bit surprised by my reaction as someone that likes Gracie's skating in general and someone that wasn't particularly that enamored with Mirai. But that is where I'm at right now. Talk to me a few days, perhaps when I watch the videos again and the initial emotion/reaction disappears I might have a different opinion.

After Gracie skated, I thought she would get about a 68-69ish for her program and was shocked when she got a 72. Oh and I made an account just for these Nationals! Some of you should recognize me from FSU. :)
 

ks777

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 15, 2003
I think Gracie can challenge Yuna for Gold only if she can land all of her jumps.
 

Matilda

Medalist
Joined
Dec 19, 2012
The third place does not hinder a skater´s podium success in any way. Don´t you remember that Evan was 3rd at the Nationals and WON the Olympic gold medal??? Besides, I think that Ashley will fare better in the freeskate.

Evan was second, not third in the Nationals going to Vancouver. He also had the most support from USFSA, and the politicking of Frank Carroll behind him--much like Gracie has now. This is precisely my problem with USFSA: they have clear favorites, and they tend to be of the Barbie Girl and Ken mold. Not saying favoritism is unique to USFSA either (e.g. how Akiko has been treated for a long time--and this is not being negative of Mao--I love her skating.). However, this is partly what is killing the sport in the US: a system open to manipulation, favoritism leading to judging the audience cannot understand, and champions with little to no personality.
 

Florentina

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 28, 2012
However, this is partly what is killing the sport in the US: a system open to manipulation, favoritism leading to judging the audience cannot understand, and champions with little to no personality.

Well the first two are up to debate but how can you say champions with little to no personality. You may not like their skating, their performance, their choreography or any other aspect(or maybe all aspects). There is however a very big chance that there are other out there who like that particular skater. And seriously, even if there was a former champion that no one liked (I highly doubt it), that person would still have personality. Some may be better at bringing it across and showing it to the audience, but they definitely all had it in the past and have it now!
 

bixby

Final Flight
Joined
Nov 12, 2012
I think Gracie can challenge Yuna for Gold only if she can land all of her jumps.

Oh, I think so too... People have been talking about the race for bronze as if Yuna and Mao are locked in for sure. Heck, they both have to skate just like everyone else. History, stats, or what have you goes out the window if they made mistakes and other skaters like Gold delivered a magical skate and created their own Olympic moment. Reputation I'm afraid won't be able to cover it all up if they messed up. Gold could steal their thunder that night... Who knows!
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
I really want to see Ashley Wagner in the Olympics.. and it's hard to think that if she doesnt finish top 3 she wont be named to the team.... Although I also remember about Nationals 2010, when Sasha wasnt chosen even if she was one of the few Americans who had a chance to medal at olympics.

Sasha had NO chance to medal at the Olympics in 2010 and she probably would have placed lower than both Nagasu and Flatt did. Wagner's international status is way beyond any U.S lady besides maybe Gold (and even probably Gold). She still is a long shot for a medal but is far likely to place highly than Nagasu or Edmunds would.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
I think Gracie can challenge Yuna for Gold only if she can land all of her jumps.

Yu Na and Mao would both need to make major mistakes to even be challenged be a perfect Gold, and Gold is more inconsistent than they are. TBH in Russia Lipnitskaia and Sotnikova would beat her if they skate like Russian Nationals too (undeservedly IMO but home country boost) and Suzuki skating like Japanese Nationals probably would beat anything Gold could put out too.
 

aftertherain

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 15, 2010
I think Gracie can challenge Yuna for Gold only if she can land all of her jumps.

I would hope not.

Tara Lipinski, for her age and technical arsenal, at least had exuberance on the ice that made up for lack of mature artistry.

Gracie Gold has none. With all her lovely arm movements, she still skates at the music. I would not want to see a stiff skater as Olympic champion again.

Maybe when she develops true artistry, sure.
 

Matilda

Medalist
Joined
Dec 19, 2012
Sorry, meant this as a reply to Florentina.

It's not so much about liking or disliking a skater--I dislike very few skaters, and appreciate the work of every skater. Of course they all have personality of some sort, but I'm talking about the public persona they project on ice and in interviews. These are where the casual audience get an opportunity to relate to the skater outside of what they put on the ice. The federation seems to often favor skaters who tend to come across rehearsed and bland in interviews over those with strong personalities--like Ashley, who is spunky and not afraid to speak her mind--and I think that is a shame. As much as I love the skating of Meryl and Charlie, for example, they are incredibly boring interviewees. If I hadn't seen them goofing around in the Shibsibs videos, I'd think they really are bland and boring outside the rink...
 

ingofan1

Rinkside
Joined
Feb 16, 2011
Mirai best days are behind her..She has not done anything in 4 years.i want Gracie,Ashley to go for sure they earned that 3rd spot for the Olympics.If Mirai is the 3rd person that is ok by me I just do not want to be placed over Gracie or Ashley.Mirai use to be my favorite skater and it sad that her time has passed.
 
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