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Thread: Most popular boots/blades

  1. #16
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    My daughter is skating senior ladies this year. She has been wearing Edea Concertos for the last 3 years with Jackson Elite Freestyle blades She has 2. Sets of boots and blades and we are replacing one pair of boots every 6 months. Her last pair of Jacksons before the Edea boots only lasted 3 months.

  2. #17
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    I competed Sr. Ladies for years. I started out in Riedell Gold Star with MK Gold Star Revolution blades, those kept breaking down and I never really liked the feel so I switched to Graf Edmonton Special (V)'s and I love them, I wear a John Wilson Gold Seal Revolution blade on them.

    Many skaters I work with now are wearing Edea boots (the ice fly are popular with my ladies skaters) with the blade of their liking and skill set.

  3. #18
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    We have a lot of Jackson's in my area.This is possibly because an influential and popular fitter is in the area and he's a Jackson rep. (He's not hard over on Jackson's, he recently fitted me into Harlicks X-line). For blades Pattern 99 and Gold Seal are popular for the upper level skaters, and MK Pros and legacy for the lower level. (I've been told that for the Russian skaters the Gold Seal is the predominant blade, but I have no proof)

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    I've been told that for the Russian skaters the Gold Seal is the predominant blade, but I have no proof

    Very interesting. I know that all the Russian coaches at my rink recommend Gold Seal blade for their skaters - regardless of the level. My daughter has been using them since she was 6.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by FS.Addict View Post
    Yes i think that makes a big difference. Like i said i absolutely LOVED these boots. If i had 700$ to spend every six months (or new boots given me every 6 months) i'd be really happy :D But i don't, so... My next boots probably won't be Edea.

    On Instagram i saw a picture of Patrick Chan with four pairs of skates. Yeah... I think he probably gets new skates every few months hahaha :P
    Chan seems to have worn Edea Concerto rather than Fly recently (Hanyu in those?) http://cdn3.volusion.com/zarbv.ethpz...jpg?1384070403 .
    Would guess he rotates the 4 (or however many) pairs throughout his season rather than wears one until destruction then hops into a brand new pair, so as not to feel much of a switch between one pair & the next.
    Figure skating seems a bit out of step with modern boot technology, having people flying around with their poor little feet incased in pounds of leather while hockey, speed & various inline skating disciplines have long since moved on to using newer materials.
    Maybe alos it's sometimes more the skaters feet (or something else anatomical, their tretment of boots etc) rather than boot or brand itself. Heard Reynolds (must be others?) had boot problems this season, what brand was that in?

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarpic2 View Post
    Chan seems to have worn Edea Concerto rather than Fly recently (Hanyu in those?) http://cdn3.volusion.com/zarbv.ethpz...jpg?1384070403 .

    Figure skating seems a bit out of step with modern boot technology, having people flying around with their poor little feet incased in pounds of leather while hockey, speed & various inline skating disciplines have long since moved on to using newer materials.
    This may be because figure skating involves a great deal of angular momentum which the other sports you mentioned don't have. If the boots are not high enough on the leg (speed skates) then there's not enough support, and if they're too bulky (hockey skates) then it's hard to get the crossed leg position, and if they're too stiff (inline) then you run into issues of spiral fracturing the ankle and leg up on landing.
    You'll note that roller, which has angular momentum issues as well, also sticks to figure skate style boots.
    Just a theory.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarpic2 View Post
    Maybe alos it's sometimes more the skaters feet (or something else anatomical, their tretment of boots etc) rather than boot or brand itself. Heard Reynolds (must be others?) had boot problems this season, what brand was that in?
    Skaters have boot problems all the time in this sport, some worse than others. Goebel's exit from this sport was hastened by some ill-fitting boots. Kwan spent a season in a bad-for-her brand of boot which caused her problems. I've had a pair that never broke in right (and I've been in the same brand for YEARS).

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Babbette1 View Post
    This may be because figure skating involves a great deal of angular momentum which the other sports you mentioned don't have. If the boots are not high enough on the leg (speed skates) then there's not enough support, and if they're too bulky (hockey skates) then it's hard to get the crossed leg position, and if they're too stiff (inline) then you run into issues of spiral fracturing the ankle and leg up on landing.
    You'll note that roller, which has angular momentum issues as well, also sticks to figure skate style boots.
    Just a theory.
    Right, plainly factual rather than just a theory though perhaps? Was wondering if non leather/ unnatural etc boots that aren't rendered useless by those negatives are make-able, genuinely curious.
    Edea seem to be made of non-traditional materials, comments along lines of them loosening too quickly/ being OK for Chan & other elite skaters (in roller too I note) were made. So one brand that seems a little less traditional has done fairly well, would think there's plenty of room for improvement.

    I guess some changes in sports footwear are merely gimmicks, cost cutting techniques or just changes that can become detrimental to users.
    Football boots are much lighter these days, apparently players suffer metatarsal injuries more frequently, basketball boots look quite different to me now than 15-20years ago, maybe that's just an external thing, maybe they're better to play in.

    As a total layman leather figure skates seem fairly unchanged, can't help thinking that cultural preferences hold back figure boot development.
    This thread interested me as people are posting suggestions of their own & that have been made to them, I've heard Gold seals recommended for all skaters as mentioned earlier in the thread & have thought I spied international skaters on MK Pro's.
    If new equipment was more readily adopted would different manufacturers have boots out that better support (or help strengthen) ankles while not interfering with foot placement or control like hockey & aggressive boots or containing lbs of cow, elk, pig or whatever by now?

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarpic2 View Post
    As a total layman leather figure skates seem fairly unchanged, can't help thinking that cultural preferences hold back figure boot development.
    This thread interested me as people are posting suggestions of their own & that have been made to them, I've heard Gold seals recommended for all skaters as mentioned earlier in the thread & have thought I spied international skaters on MK Pro's.
    If new equipment was more readily adopted would different manufacturers have boots out that better support (or help strengthen) ankles while not interfering with foot placement or control like hockey & aggressive boots or containing lbs of cow, elk, pig or whatever by now?
    I think I see where you're headed here.

    I know it seems that figure skating has not advanced a lot, but it really has. Boots used to go halfway up the calf, and then when doubles became the norm, they got shorter and stiffer. Then when heat molding was introduced that made boots heavier and stiffer, but made them easier to fit. Coplanar boots and blade were introduced what? about 10-15 years ago? They never took off, maybe because they didn't work as well as the traditionally styled boots or maybe because they didn't have a big enough advantage over regular boots to make them worth the effort. Then there have been a couple of new blade and toepicks developments. I won't include parabolic blades as 'new', they were invented in the late 1800s then fell out of favor. And don't forget, the straight pick wasn't invented until the late 40's by Gustave Lussi.

    And behind the scenes there's been a lot of improvement in ice resurfacing. I doubt that you could do Quads on pond ice, so quality ice with a consistent surface helped with that. Skaters in old movies, skating on ponds seem slow because the ice wasn't consistent (and filled with twigs and leaves).

    To get back to boots, it may turn out that there's what's called 'sufficiency' in figure skating. The leather boots are 'sufficiently' good enough, for skaters not to want to bother about trying some new technology, when they have something that works. Say a skater takes a risk and tries something new, then spends months only to find that the 'new technology' boot doesn't work out. That's an investment not only in boot cost, but ice time, maybe delayed skill development, testing and comps. In my business, that's called a risk assessment. I think a lot of people stay with a tried and true technology because it's good enough and reliable enough, and predictable enough. Although I personally think that new materials to replace leather is possible, and the microfiber boots are nice, there's still a lot to recommend in leather.

    Why yes, I am an engineer.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Babbette1 View Post
    Why yes, I am an engineer.


    Also, there were the hinge boots which fixed some things and hurt others. Another technology that never really took off...

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Babbette1 View Post
    Then when heat molding was introduced that made boots heavier and stiffer, but made them easier to fit. Coplanar boots and blade were introduced what? about 10-15 years ago? They never took off, maybe because they didn't work as well as the traditionally styled boots or maybe because they didn't have a big enough advantage over regular boots to make them worth the effort.
    To get back to boots, it may turn out that there's what's called 'sufficiency' in figure skating. The leather boots are 'sufficiently' good enough, for skaters not to want to bother about trying some new technology, when they have something that works. Say a skater takes a risk and tries something new, then spends months only to find that the 'new technology' boot doesn't work out. That's an investment not only in boot cost, but ice time, maybe delayed skill development, testing and comps. In my business, that's called a risk assessment. I think a lot of people stay with a tried and true technology because it's good enough and reliable enough, and predictable enough. Although I personally think that new materials to replace leather is possible, and the microfibre boots are nice, there's still a lot to recommend in leather.
    It's not a huge market I know & something as sudden & different seeming within the figureskating as clap blades in speed skating couldn't appear & become the norm.
    I've heard people in hockey skates say they've found new carbon fibre models 'too responsive', so damned if you do & damned if you don't for makers sometimes.
    Never seen coplanars, hinged boots were those Jackson (Robocop) things right? Maybe if they'd both been taken up & improved upon for a decade+ current boots could be further ahead.

    I'm familiar with heatmouldable boots & have been shown a top of the range pair from 30 years ago which seemed like wood carvings with zero anatomical sympathy towards a human foot in comparison, but still the rate of progress seems a bit relaxed. Maybe if/ when most brands have a top range microfibre boot with plastic moulded soles on the market things will have to move on a bit quicker?
    Maybe not enough skaters experience boot problems (or are so conditioned to having messed up feet & joints that only extremely serious problems draw much attention) that change seems worthwhile.

    Sure a non elite coach has no incentive to suggest a kids parent buy some crazy new boots they've never taught anyone to pass a test/ land an axel in before, sticking to the 'get Riedels/ Gams, add Gold seals' approach seems logical.
    Hearing that Kwan, Goebel, Reynolds + whoever else have had such problems from boots sounds like madness though. Like (not literally..) a tennis player soldiering on with their trusty (wooden) racket having been half crippled by it.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarpic2 View Post
    Right, plainly factual rather than just a theory though perhaps? Was wondering if non leather/ unnatural etc boots that aren't rendered useless by those negatives are make-able, genuinely curious.
    Edea seem to be made of non-traditional materials, comments along lines of them loosening too quickly/ being OK for Chan & other elite skaters (in roller too I note) were made. So one brand that seems a little less traditional has done fairly well, would think there's plenty of room for improvement.

    I guess some changes in sports footwear are merely gimmicks, cost cutting techniques or just changes that can become detrimental to users.
    Football boots are much lighter these days, apparently players suffer metatarsal injuries more frequently, basketball boots look quite different to me now than 15-20years ago, maybe that's just an external thing, maybe they're better to play in.

    As a total layman leather figure skates seem fairly unchanged, can't help thinking that cultural preferences hold back figure boot development.
    This thread interested me as people are posting suggestions of their own & that have been made to them, I've heard Gold seals recommended for all skaters as mentioned earlier in the thread & have thought I spied international skaters on MK Pro's.
    If new equipment was more readily adopted would different manufacturers have boots out that better support (or help strengthen) ankles while not interfering with foot placement or control like hockey & aggressive boots or containing lbs of cow, elk, pig or whatever by now?
    That's actually not true. I had lovely white figure skating boots that I wore when I was 13/14 years old (my feet remained the same size since then). When I started skating as an adult in my thirties, I thought they would be usable (that's why I kept them all those years and skated on them perhaps once or twice a year - low level of recreational skating - just stroking around the rink.) I was in shock when on my first lesson my coach stared at my boots, asked me to skate to the barrier and lift my leg, then he started touching it and then he sent me to change to the rental blue rubbery skates! He stated that the rental skates are bad, but mine are actually even worse and that he had never seen anything like that. For my next lesson I bought good beginner level boots and realized that my skating actually improved a lot by changing the boots. My old one were slightly higher and only one layer of leather. They were soft, they were easily bendable at the ankle (that was not because they were broken down. That was done like that by design.) So somewhere within the last 20-30 years someone realized that the boots need to be tougher and can be slightly lower. So I wouldn't say that the boots are not developing.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    That's actually not true. I had lovely white figure skating boots that I wore when I was 13/14 years old (my feet remained the same size since then). When I started skating as an adult in my thirties, I thought they would be usable (that's why I kept them all those years and skated on them perhaps once or twice a year - low level of recreational skating - just stroking around the rink.) I was in shock when on my first lesson my coach stared at my boots, asked me to skate to the barrier and lift my leg, then he started touching it and then he sent me to change to the rental blue rubbery skates! He stated that the rental skates are bad, but mine are actually even worse and that he had never seen anything like that. For my next lesson I bought good beginner level boots and realized that my skating actually improved a lot by changing the boots. My old one were slightly higher and only one layer of leather. They were soft, they were easily bendable at the ankle (that was not because they were broken down. That was done like that by design.) So somewhere within the last 20-30 years someone realized that the boots need to be tougher and can be slightly lower. So I wouldn't say that the boots are not developing.
    Hi yes - haha, blue rentals were a step up in the world? Your old boots must have been in a right state - out of interest have you had any difficulties with modern boots since (whether your 'fault' or that of the boot)?

    Posted lazily but did say 'fairly unchanged' rather than 'figure skates are unchanged...' etc, wasn't making an absolute statement.
    I mentioned heatmoulding & a top of the range pair from 30 years ago, which were a model worn by T&D apparently, rock hard, tough boots were available in '84-'94! (& steps taken since to reduce the break in/ need to have a cobbler on call)

    Sure boots are developing, I posted re someone's comment on Edeas, just seems a bit slow & conservative to me.
    Taking into account 'sufficiency' as someone pointed out + I'd guess manufacturers probably not being very inclined to say anything that could sound like needing to re-think their product beyond small advances (lighter heels, breathable tongue, flex notch whatever - mainly still a lump of leather on peoples feet) to better avoid the negative outcomes many skaters experience I can understand why boots could mostly remain as they are & will shut up about it, have bored myself typing this, god help other members!

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarpic2 View Post
    Hi yes - haha, blue rentals were a step up in the world? Your old boots must have been in a right state - out of interest have you had any difficulties with modern boots since (whether your 'fault' or that of the boot)?

    Posted lazily but did say 'fairly unchanged' rather than 'figure skates are unchanged...' etc, wasn't making an absolute statement.
    I mentioned heatmoulding & a top of the range pair from 30 years ago, which were a model worn by T&D apparently, rock hard, tough boots were available in '84-'94! (& steps taken since to reduce the break in/ need to have a cobbler on call)

    Sure boots are developing, I posted re someone's comment on Edeas, just seems a bit slow & conservative to me.
    Taking into account 'sufficiency' as someone pointed out + I'd guess manufacturers probably not being very inclined to say anything that could sound like needing to re-think their product beyond small advances (lighter heels, breathable tongue, flex notch whatever - mainly still a lump of leather on peoples feet) to better avoid the negative outcomes many skaters experience I can understand why boots could mostly remain as they are & will shut up about it, have bored myself typing this, god help other members!
    But most boots aren't made of leather anymore. The sole may be, but the skate itself tends not to be leather. Sure there are exceptions, but over the past 5 pairs of skates my daughrer has had, the every time we get her skates, the old model no longer exists. They changes might not be noticeable but heels went from one material to cork, one pair had much lower backs for added movement. The Aria is gorgeous and the first I've seen lined with soft leather (kangaroo). It is beautiful.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarpic2 View Post
    Hi yes - haha, blue rentals were a step up in the world? Your old boots must have been in a right state - out of interest have you had any difficulties with modern boots since (whether your 'fault' or that of the boot)?
    Depends what you consider 'problems with boots'. Like anyone else, I had problem with finding which brand matches to the shape of my foot. I tried Edea and they did not go with me and I grew a huge bunions on my joint just under my little toe. With mu current Klingbeils I don't have any problems.

    But the problem I had with the original old boots was that there was no support for ankle. So it was like skating in trainers. My ankles would keep breaking in and my soles were not flat horizontal - it was like if I was skating on two inside edges. I really have no idea how they could skate on that in the past, whether they had to develop more strength in their ankles or whether they bandaged the ankles under the boots to give them more stability and support.

    It is like with skiing. When I was a child, we used to have a very soft skiing boots, and then suddenly this current modern plastic (hard and much higher) boots started being used. I am not sure why the manufactures in the past thought it is a good idea to skate or ski in soft boots, but luckily someone later realised that it is actually not such a great idea.

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