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Thread: Is Patrick a lock for gold still?

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    We know Sotnikova wont skate cleanly so are you saying they would put Sotnikova with even 1 mistake (likely more) above Yu Na with 1 or 2. Sorry I cant see them doing that, even in Russia. The idea of Sotnikova skating cleanly and Yu Na not skating cleanly in the same event, or Sotnikova making less mistakes than Kim in the same event (and that is the only way Sotnikova would beat Kim even with biased Russian based judging) is akin to winning a lottery ticket.

    Julia meanwhile is just too weak in many aspects of her skating to beat Kim without several mistakes, no matter what.
    No, I was saying that with bs Russian judging, Yu Na can't afford a major mistake against a clean Sot/Lip.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    The bookies (most accurate indicators of favorites) make it clear Yu Na is far more an overwhelming favorite to win than Patrick is.
    The reason is Yuzuru, who is a legit challenger. Kim doesn't have legit challengers and the gold is hers to lose, but I think there will be greater PCS bs with Kim's event. Although Plushenko is likely competing in men's so expect 95 points PCS again, lol.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    Also with a hard fall, he won over a clean Patrick - to use all Patrick nay-Sayers' standard which they have been using for years.
    So Hanyu is the heir apparent; the tide favours him. That's life; momentum changes so fast remember before it was Dai - and he barely made the Japanese team and even then it was hugely controversial (had it been in the US we would have a Mirai much a do about nothing scandal.).

  4. #34
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    To be fair, Patrick was clean in the GPF (i.e. he didn't fall), but he made many mistakes: in the SP he stepped out of his 3A, doubled his Lz, and ended after the music was over. He was better in the LP, but did botch a spin--Yuzuru got a little higher TES in the LP than Chan, but not much. If both skate perfectly, the men's competition in Sochi will be really, really exciting--and I for one would love it!

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matilda View Post
    Did you see the short programs of both skaters as well? Yuzuru had a massive lead over Patrick after the SP, and deservedly so, I think.

    Patrick: http://youtu.be/d3NVbORhgH4

    Yuzuru: http://youtu.be/eKAaHWjVgvM

    Thank you very much. I had a hard time finding Youtubes in English for this competition. I'm sure those Russian commentators said very insightful, helpful things, but unfortunately, I couldn't understand any of them. I love the British guys!

    Having seen all four skates by these two men, the only one that was outstanding was Hanyu's short program. He seems like a different skater in both programs, much stronger and more masculine in the short than the long. I think he may need a better free skate costume. He doesn't seem like Romeo as much as Japanese Johnny Weir.

    Is Patrick not as good as he once was? I never could stand him and I used to when he won with a mistake filled program, but there was always something compelling about him. You could see that his programs were excellent and would be outstanding if he could just execute all the moves cleanly.

    I'm not seeing that now. He's skating to dull, soft music in dull gray costumes and it's just blah. He got on my nerves sometimes, but he was never boring.

    So, guys, my advice:
    1. At least one new costume a piece
    2. Don't copy other skaters. Yuzuru, you don't work that half bride/groom suit as well as Johnny, and Patrick, you don't spin as well as Stephane Lambiel, so don't use the same music as he did. Go back to "Take 5" or "Phantom of the Opera" or that Spanish piece with the red shirt.

    Hope they listen!

  6. #36
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    He Poodlepal - I think it is a little late to make switches to programs. And Hanyu simply is wearing a Weir designed and influenced outfit while Patrick has made 4 seasons his own. Following your argument Lambiel shouldn't have done vivaldi's piece and left it to Usova and Zhulin or the many other great versions of it.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matilda View Post
    Did you see the short programs of both skaters as well? Yuzuru had a massive lead over Patrick after the SP, and deservedly so, I think.

    Patrick: http://youtu.be/d3NVbORhgH4

    Yuzuru: http://youtu.be/eKAaHWjVgvM
    Yup, Hanyu deserved the win based on his short program. He didn't deserve to win the FS though, although his high technical content allowed for it. If the GPF skates are the same at the Olympics, Hanyu should win but I can picture the viewers crying foul if they saw Chan skate clean and Hanyu fall, because casual skating viewers tend to dismiss the SP... Heck even fans who closely follow the sport forget about the SP and cry foul at wins/placements.

    Any casual fan watching the Euro pairs would be outraged that S/K lost.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    Regardless his spins, I think Patrick's Four Seasons is a lot better than Lambiel's Four Seasons.
    It is. At the time of Lambiel's 4 Seasons it was great but Chan's FS is way more intricate and ambitious in its choreo. As for interpretation that's a matter of preference, but anyone who suggests Lambiel's 4 seasons was somehow better choreographed or more difficult in general is just a diehard lambielfan deluding themselves, or a Chan hater, or both.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    Lambiels Four Season is way better. He feels the music with his soul and his skates to the music at all times with his body movements and facial expressions, which Patrick in no way does. Patricks Four Seasons is in fact quite boring, regardless of its scoring merit. Years from now nobody will go back on video and watch it again, which many still do for Lambiels better performances to that exquisite program.

    Usova & Zhulins Four Seasons is by far the best ever mind you.
    Hah, "in NO way". Never at all in his FS is Patrick skating with the music with his body movements. Well, I guess even the haters have their opinion, and will stick with it till the bitter end.

    I hope you can at least agree about Lambiel's atrociously garish and tacky outfit... it's one of the worst skating costumes - if not the worst - to appear in men's skating.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    It is. At the time of Lambiel's 4 Seasons it was great but Chan's FS is way more intricate and ambitious in its choreo. As for interpretation that's a matter of preference, but anyone who suggests Lambiel's 4 seasons was somehow better choreographed or more difficult in general is just a diehard lambielfan deluding themselves, or a Chan hater, or both.
    I don't like Patrick much, but I don't hate him. He was robbed in that long program!
    Anyway, I'm surprised that he would do a program that another male skater made famous not that long ago*. Usually, skaters try not to do that, or at least they used to until fairly recently. And I liked Stephane's costume, with its dead leaves. It matched the theme of the four seasons, or at least fall.

    * Of course the exception to this rule is "Carmen." Any skater can do that any time, and in fact, I believe it's written somewhere in the Code of Points that it is mandatory to do at least once.

  11. #41
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    Best Four Seasons: Patrick's version four years ago.

  12. #42
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    Have to change my post. Stephane was wearing a zebra vest and blue sleeves, not dead leaves.
    Stephane seemed happier than Patrick, but stood and posed quite a bit. Don't remember Patrick's from 4 years ago, I'll have to check it out.

  13. #43
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    Here it is. (Correction -- it was six years ago )

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9d9LSJIzuQU

    By the way, Lambiel said afterward that he was portraying a zebra who was seeing snow for the first time. (I mean, you gotta give props for that, right? )

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Here it is. (Correction -- it was six years ago )

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9d9LSJIzuQU

    By the way, Lambiel said afterward that he was portraying a zebra who was seeing snow for the first time. (I mean, you gotta give props for that, right? )
    I love the Swiss.

  15. #45
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    I still think he's a lock IF he's clean, or even near-clean. That's a big if though ... so no he's not a lock in the general sense.

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