Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 42

Thread: Newsweek article: 'The Frozen Closet'

  1. #1
    On the Ice
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    26

    News Newsweek article: 'The Frozen Closet'

    http://mag.newsweek.com/2014/01/31/o...sexuality.html

    TSL posted a link on their Facebook page to this Newsweek article, which discusses homophobia and gender normativity in the world of figure skating. It is an interesting and well-researched article.

  2. #2
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    361
    This really is a pretty good article. It does, however, still completely ignore the fact that the closet may include lesbians as well as gays. It does discuss the image of figure skating as an "effeminate sport", note that women are called "ladies", and that women have only recently been allowed to wear pants, but that's it. Even Jen Kirk's comment is: "We have to be Ken and Barbie, but the reality is that Ken is dating Ken and Barbie doesn't always want to look like Barbie, or at least act like Barbie." Hello, Barbie may also be dating Barbie! My guess is that the situation is much the same as with gay men in the sport: as long as you fit the gender stereotype, it's ok. This further underscores the heteronormativity of much of the official side of figure skating in the USA. The individuals who break the gender stereotypes are the ones who get scorned and face discrimination.

  3. #3
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    1,819
    I think this article is well researched. In some of Hanyu threads earlier in the season, I expressed these same points as well. There is no other skater who is more effeminate than Hanyu right now and being perceived as having a connection with Johnny Weir really doesn't help. PCS doesn't just jump by 12+points within a span of 3 weeks. JSF may have "sponsored" the GPF, it remains to be seen if that can be sustained.

  4. #4
    Medalist
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Helsinki, Finland
    Posts
    89
    There's a similar article out now on Buzzfeed too.

  5. #5
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Left field
    Posts
    3,428
    I thought it was a very interesting article, though it is obviously focused on the situation in North America. I'm not sure skating is perceived the same way, or run the same way, in other countries. I thought Jenny Kirk made a good point in that the expectations are constraining not just for men, who get to pick between athletic and artistic (what, you can't be both?) but also for the ladies, who are often pushed into an ice princess persona whether it fits them or not. Although at the top level internationally, I do see skaters who have managed to break away from this.

    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    I think this article is well researched. In some of Hanyu threads earlier in the season, I expressed these same points as well. There is no other skater who is more effeminate than Hanyu right now and being perceived as having a connection with Johnny Weir really doesn't help. PCS doesn't just jump by 12+points within a span of 3 weeks. JSF may have "sponsored" the GPF, it remains to be seen if that can be sustained.
    It can, however, go up 17 points in just over one month, if the performance merits it. Hanyu may have enjoyed some home ice bonus, but he's hardly the only skater to ever benefit from this, or to get a boost for consistently delivering strong performances, some of which garnered higher PCS than the TEB one.

    There's nothing wrong with a man choosing to perform in the style(s) that Hanyu or Weir have. The suggestion that it is wrong or distasteful reflects poorly and the person making it, not on the skaters themselves.

    I can't say I'm surprised that you'd take a completely unrelated thread as yet another opportunity to bash Hanyu. If Chan breaks Hanyu's record again, will you stop?

  6. #6
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    852
    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    I think this article is well researched. In some of Hanyu threads earlier in the season, I expressed these same points as well. There is no other skater who is more effeminate than Hanyu right now and being perceived as having a connection with Johnny Weir really doesn't help. PCS doesn't just jump by 12+points within a span of 3 weeks. JSF may have "sponsored" the GPF, it remains to be seen if that can be sustained.
    Despite your insinuations to the contrary, Hanyu won over Patrick because he skated better.

  7. #7
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    5,066
    Quote Originally Posted by chloepoco View Post
    Despite your insinuations to the contrary, Hanyu won over Patrick because he skated better.
    Thoroughly agreed, particularly taking the SP into consideration. But he won the FS due to home ice PCS, and certainly would not be receiving 92.5 PCS for the same skate in Sochi.

  8. #8
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Left field
    Posts
    3,428
    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Thoroughly agreed, particularly taking the SP into consideration. But he won the FS due to home ice PCS, and certainly would not be receiving 92.5 PCS for the same skate in Sochi.
    I think almost every elite skater has benefited from generous PCS at one time or another. Some more than once.

    If Hanyu skates well in Sochi, I expect him to get a score in the neighborhood of his GPF one. Olympic inflation should ensure some nice scores and a few PBs for those who do a good job.

  9. #9
    On the Ice
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    26
    Thanks for the heads-up about the BuzzFeed article, MalloryArcher and Bluebonnet. It was a really good (albeit lengthy) read as well!

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/blairbraverm...-in-the-closet

  10. #10
    Rinkside
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    1
    Only men are gay? No lesbians in figure skating? That's what we'd be given to believe in this article! No mention of what it might be like to be a queer woman trying to get ahead in figure skating, in any country, not just the US.

  11. #11
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    3,637
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttercup View Post
    There's nothing wrong with a man choosing to perform in the style(s) that Hanyu or Weir have. The suggestion that it is wrong or distasteful reflects poorly and the person making it, not on the skaters themselves.
    There is nothing wrong with it, but I have to admit sometimes I don't enjoy programs as much when the men are overly feminine in their presentation. As a judge I wouldn't mark them down. However, as a fan of dance I do prefer watching a strong male presence on the ice, rather than a man who skates like a woman but with better jumps.

  12. #12
    Custom Title skateluvr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,592
    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    I think this article is well researched. In some of Hanyu threads earlier in the season, I expressed these same points as well. There is no other skater who is more effeminate than Hanyu right now and being perceived as having a connection with Johnny Weir really doesn't help. PCS doesn't just jump by 12+points within a span of 3 weeks. JSF may have "sponsored" the GPF, it remains to be seen if that can be sustained.
    I think Machida comes close with that firebird outfit, but que sera sera. It has always been thus in dance and FS and will not change. It does seem tho, the judges would rather hand the gold to Patrick Chan, who people assume to be hetero.

  13. #13
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    9,495
    Quote Originally Posted by flipsydoodle View Post
    Only men are gay? No lesbians in figure skating? That's what we'd be given to believe in this article! No mention of what it might be like to be a queer woman trying to get ahead in figure skating, in any country, not just the US.
    I think skating tends to emphasize the issue of men who are gay because skating is perceived (by some silly people) as a "sissy" sport. Whether a girl is a lesbian or not doesn't affect that perception. I suspect that female athletes have more problems in some of the supposedly more aggressive sports, such as soccer, ice hockey, or heptathlon, for a parallel reason: for many years, a lot of (silly) people thought that any girl who was muscular and aggressive had to be gay, because those are seen as male characteristics.

  14. #14
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    616
    It's so funny that certain someone attempt to bash and drag Yuzuru costume style in every threat, saying the same point over and over again, I really don't see any valid reason to do this kind of thing apart from being pathetic or obsession with what he/she perceived as masculinity.

    Anyhow, It should be noted that masculinity/ femininity is various by culture, what one perceived as feminine in one own view might be average masculine from other point of view. Although there is absolutely nothing wrong either if men want to display femininity or vice versa.

  15. #15
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    3,637
    Quote Originally Posted by treeloving View Post
    Anyhow, It should be noted that masculinity/ femininity is various by culture, what one perceived as feminine in one own view might be average masculine from other point of view. Although there is absolutely nothing wrong either if men want to display femininity or vice versa.
    I agree, but fans are not at fault if they have personal preferences either. When your break the mold you have to be willing to accept that some people will love it and some people will hate it. People who don't like watching feminine male programs aren't "haters". Boitano proved you can be gay but also have a powerful masculine presence on the ice.

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •