Tatiana Volosozhar & Maxim Trankov

V/T are back home. http://instagram.com/p/rhuILZOVa5/?modal=true
I find it lovely that he tweets "I'm home" while the picture shows Tanya's adress..

kinoriH said:

V/T are back home. http://instagram.com/p/rhuILZOVa5/?modal=true
I find it lovely that he tweets "I'm home" while the picture shows Tanya's adress..

Click to expand...

They live in the same building, I actually think it's his)

I find it lovely that he tweets "I'm home" while the picture shows Tanya's adress.

Click to expand...

Well they live in the same building. so address is the same, just different apartmen number( well it was like that in the begining of relationship, as far as i know)

kinoriH said:

haha omg Nessie, you serious? I think their Godfather program is a masterpiece. All of us have such different opinions!

As I see it, every year they have a weak program and a strong one. Usually they're pretty strong in the short, with the exception of the 2011-12 season. I still think that Black Swan is their best LP to this day.

Click to expand...

Okay, well, I'll look at the program again to be sure. It's the music, or rather the VERSION of the music, that was so bad. But let me look again at the choreography and try to assess it that way. I'm happy to review my opinions, and we certainly do often differ. But we all agree on the brilliance of V&T so our foundation for chattering together is pretty solid.

Since Godfather SP was brought up:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XcrySDA1Wek
You guy surely have seen it already, but I have to watch it again and again since IMO it's actually one of their best ones Preferences are a funny thing indeed!
You gotta admire those Eurosport guys(it's them right?)
"Is this part of the routine? Not suuuure " Hahaha
I actually liked their chemistry there a lot. Yes, like they're saying, it's on the edge but not over it.


The one program I really didn't like was Violine Muse. .. it was so monotonous IMPO

Alba –You’re right. In JCSS, V&T, standing in the middle of the rink, doing nothing for a second or two and rolling their heads, was a bit odd. But I forgave it and accepted it as a kind of transitional moment in both the music and the choreography.

But I thought I was the only one who noticed that Tanya was checking the state of her hair!

Skating scores have always been a bit subjective – some skaters are anointed at the top because it’s their “time.” I think that was something of a factor with V&T. A few lapses or lackluster moments are forgiven. But they MUST be minor. Falling twice and falling badly (S and S) cannot of course be ignored.

Interpretation, skating skills, timing, performance, choreo. Transitions were really good but, as I said before, I would've given more to D&R on the transitions, only.

Click to expand...

Transitions are in choreography. I didn't ask to mention how the components are called, I know it, I want to know why the hell S/K were better.

Skating skills: S/K have mainly crossovers in choreography, their "linking footwork" is poor, their "linking elements" are non-existent, how then they got so much in this element? There is no mastery in doing crossovers, they don't verify cleanness and sureness of edges, or precision of foot placement. Their footwork: http://youtu.be/92JRCvthz9A?t=57s to 1:04 and http://youtu.be/92JRCvthz9A?t=1m16s to 1:26. They are away from each other, what makes it easier - they don't have to be in a perfect unison.
Meagan and Eric's footwork (only footwork): http://youtu.be/zjybUQyneIQ?t=1m4s to 1:14, http://youtu.be/zjybUQyneIQ?t=1m29s to 1:35 (lift almost from steps), http://youtu.be/zjybUQyneIQ?t=1m48s to 1:52, http://youtu.be/zjybUQyneIQ?t=2m25s to 2:28 (transition from lutz to a step sequence). They are in close holds (unison), they change directions (precision and maintaining speed).

Transitions/Linking Footwork - my question is, why S/K have so much for this...

Performance/Execution... and for this. Eric's composition isn't the most difficult piece of music to interpret I have ever heard but Canadians' interpratation shows their involvement, style and individuality, allows them to use a varied tempo, movement shapes. Russians' interpratation is secondary, good-looking but secondary, Nuovo flamenco is a great music style but their interpration consist only of hands' movements and some Ksenia's "sexy looks" at judges. It looks good though ;P
Ksenia and Fedor use mainly arms while Meagan and Eric use whole upper body, different moves, different directions, different shapes on ice...

Choreography - ekhem... maybe what I wrote upper is not clear enough.

I don't mention a beginning because every pair uses it to speed up

S/K's SP: After twist, Ksenia and Fedor are coming through the ice rink with crossovers and doing toeloops. Then, they are making steps and other skating elements (spread eagle) for a very short time on very small area of ice rink, stop it, coming into crossovers again and making 3F, after that - shortly steps. Next element - a lift is preceded by crossovers going through half of ice rink - it is how much of speed they lost in this short time. More crossovers and death spiral with usual entry, pair spin straightly after it. Then, they are coming to end if ice rink and stopping to begin a step sequence. Stopping makes this element much easier as they have enough time to make sure that they are in unison. The step sequence is average, no change holds.

D/R's SP: After twist, Meagan and Eric are changing the direction couple of times, going AROUND the ice rink, making steps and crossovers, doing their lutzes. Then they are making steps and crossovers, changing directions again, fluently coming into the lift (fluently means not: steps then crossovers, but steps and crossovers), he's skating with Meagan in his arms through whole ice rink, then a creative coming out. Meagan and Eric need only a moment, really short moment of crossovers to gain speed and they are covering much more ice rink with this element than Ksenia and Fedor. After a few elements they are making pair spin (straightly from lift). After pair spin they are coming in a really creative way to 3Lz with nice connecting elements (Ksenia and Fedor has no connecting elements), then fluently into step sequence (no stopping) with many changes of holds, after that a superb entry into a death spiral.

Interpretation/Timing - I'm sorry, what timing in Ksenia and Fedor's program? Where?

On twist?
Ksenia and Fedor
Meagan and Eric

On sbs jumps?
S/K
D/R

Or maybe on throw jump?
S/K
D/R

Yeah, clearly better timing in S/K program, no doubt about it.

Again, the Canadians were placed in 7 place with their LP, but somehow you have a problem with SK who placed second for beating them?!
Their teammates, M&M-T were better than D&R by almost 3 points on the components.

Click to expand...

At worlds? They were 3rd and 4th with their FS. I don't love that program and "Addams Family" is obviously very good routine. At the Olympics they had really bad program and they are not Carolina Kostner to get uncountable number points in PCS and still be at the podium despite technically terrible routine.
And I'm not talking about their FS because I can understand why S/K were better than D/R in that part of competition. They have really good FS, made with an old coach (thay had really interesting programs, for example brilliant Bolero). I'm talking mainly about SP where S/K are tremendously overscored while D/R are constantly underscored. I think they should have had a second best SP of season, second only to V/T and got more than 80 for it. Including 10 for the choreography.

I agree on both accounts. I don't like the indian music, and eastern in general myself, but I do think that D&W program was very good.
Maybe because it was an Original Dance, so it suits better to the purpose.

Click to expand...

I'm happy that they want to go for something different. They have won everything right now, they can experiment.

I agree. I think their "Godfather" version of music was mediocre, at best.

Click to expand...

I think that main reason to create such a program was to do the only thing Savchenko and Szolkowy weren't able to do: passion on ice. S/S are splendid skaters but in cases of showing any feelings they lost not only with V/T, but also Pang/Tong or Shen/Zhao. In season 2011/2012 they were winning everything, skated well (GP Final) or not (Worlds). But they were winning by tenths od points, Tania and Max might have thought that they have to show something what make judges sure that Germans' programs are rough, emotionless. And they did it, what was even easier as S/S had terrible programs to seasons ago

Alba –You’re right. In JCSS, V&T, standing in the middle of the rink, doing nothing for a second or two and rolling their heads, was a bit odd. But I forgave it and accepted it as a kind of transitional moment in both the music and the choreography.

Click to expand...

There is no such a thing like minus points for standing in one place. They did it in Black Swan routine - here , they did in Violin Muse routine - here , and in Romeo and Juliet - here . It's just Morozov Oh, how I'd like them to change the choreographer

But I thought I was the only one who noticed that Tanya was checking the state of her hair!

Click to expand...

I'm not surprised If any of hair decoration fell down to ice, they would lose a point. Like Elena and Nikita at the Team Event.

Skating scores have always been a bit subjective – some skaters are anointed at the top because it’s their “time.” I think that was something of a factor with V&T. A few lapses or lackluster moments are forgiven. But they MUST be minor. Falling twice and falling badly (S and S) cannot of course be ignored.

Click to expand...

I don't think Tania and Max were much overscored - their elements are on such a level that minor mistakes can be forgiven. In fact, they are making erfect elemnts ith small flaws and all of their errors were these ones for which final GOE doesn;t heve to be in the minuses.

kinoriH said:

V/T are back home. http://instagram.com/p/rhuILZOVa5/?modal=true
I find it lovely that he tweets "I'm home" while the picture shows Tanya's adress..

Click to expand...

So Maxim is going to have some treatment about his shoulder. I thought, all was sorted in NJ. I agree with some posters about maxim having apartment in the same building as Tanya, but I remember readng i one of Russian papers about V/T admitting living together without their direct words.

It's probably a similar mystery to the "Are they just great partners? f
Friends? Friends who like to kiss from time to time and to spend all their free time together? Dating? " I still have no idea

Stupid and unimportant question: What's Tanyas natural hair color? Cause I've seen pictures in which her hair was black in others brown and now blond

starlight97 said:

It's probably a similar mystery to the "Are they just great partners? f
Friends? Friends who like to kiss from time to time and to spend all their free time together? Dating? " I still have no idea

Stupid and unimportant question: What's Tanyas natural hair color? Cause I've seen pictures in which her hair was black in others brown and now blond

Click to expand...

I believe Tanya's real hair color is dark brown, not black.

kinoriH said:

I believe Tanya's real hair color is dark brown, not black.

Click to expand...

it's not a stupid question. But strangely, I thought she looked like a real blonde. I was surprised when I saw that she was a brunette some years ago. Many blondes have kind of golden skin and Tanya has that exquisite skin so I thought she was naturally blonde! Anyway, she SHOULD have been born blonde because it suits her perfectly.

I don’t mean to suggest that V&T were overscored, but that they were clearly the team to beat and the Gold medal was theirs to LOSE. But no one came even remotely close to their execution of their elements and the power and passion of their communication, so there was hardly a contest. If anyone was perhaps overscored, it was S&S.

I have to disagree on the Addams family music. Moser surely wanted a program for S/K that would separate them 100% from V&T but the music was a little TOO lightweight for the Olympics. S/K skated wonderfully though Feodor’s costume was an embarrassment. For a guy who has thighs the size of Pelé, you don’t dress him like a clown at the circus!

But now I have to study some of the comments here – I think it’s going to take a week to do the research, but I appreciate the technical expertise expressed here as well as the well-argued cases!

Oh,and Alba, I think your friend overstepped himself to film them praticing.

LittleLotte29 said:

Transitions are in choreography.

Click to expand...

Everything is part of the Choreography. Even the tech elements like jumps, throws, twist etc., are part of the layout, but transitions/linking footwork and movement are scored separately in the PCS section, along with the rest, and they have various and different criteria.

Transitions/ Linking Footwork and Movement
The varied and/or intricate footwork, positions, movements, and holds that link all elements. In singles, pairs, and synchronized skating this also includes the entrances and exits of technical elements. Transitions can be short or long, including the use of blade, body, head, arms, legs as dictated by the music.
(Minimum use of cross-cuts). Includes:

Variety
Difficulty
Intricacy
Quality (including unison in Pair Skating and Ice Dancing)
Balance of workload between partners (Pair Skating and Ice Dancing)
Variety of Dance holds (not excessive side by side and hand in hand – Ice Dancing)

Choreography/Composition
An intentional, developed, and/or original arrangement of all movements according to the principles of proportion, unity, space, pattern, structure, and phrasing. Includes:

Purpose: (Idea, concept, vision, mood): To reward the intentional and quality design of a program.
Proportion (equal weight of all parts): Each part and section has equal weight in achieving the aesthetic pursuit of the composition.
Unity: Purposeful threading of all movements: A program achieves unity when: every step, movement, and element is motivated by the music. As well, all its parts, big or small, seem necessary to the whole, and there is an underlying vision or symbolic meaning that threads together the entire composition.
Pattern and Ice Coverage: Movement phrases are designed using an interesting and meaningful variety of patterns and directions of travel.
Phrasing and Form (movement and parts are structured to match the phrasing of the music): A phrase is a unit of movement marked by an impulse of energy that grows, builds,finds a conclusion, and then flows easily and naturally into the next movement phrase. Form is the presentation of an idea, the development of the idea, and its conclusion presented in a specific number of parts and a specific order for design.
Originality of Purpose, Movement, and Design: An individual perspective of movement and design in pursuit of a creative composition as inspired by the music and the underlying vision.
Utilization of Personal and Public Space: Movement phrases are distributed in such a way they communicate from every angle in a 360 degree skater-viewer relationship.

I didn't ask to mention how the components are called, I know it, I want to know why the hell S/K were better.

Click to expand...

Good for you, but you asked me tell you one reason S/K deserved more in PCS. I gave 5 of the PCS section (with many reasons described) where I think they were better, and deserved to beat them in the SP as well as in the LP.
I didn't thought you wanted me to write a thesis on the subject. :sarcasm:

And I'm not talking about their FS because I can understand why S/K were better than D/R in that part of competition. They have really good FS, made with an old coach (thay had really interesting programs, for example brilliant Bolero). I'm talking mainly about SP where S/K are tremendously overscored while D/R are constantly underscored. I think they should have had a second best SP of season, second only to V/T and got more than 80 for it. Including 10 for the choreography.

Click to expand...

You're convinced that D&R were robbed by S&K, and possibly S&K sucks as well.
The judges and many other people - who think otherwise - can't change what you think/see, and viceversa.
So who am I to even think I can do better here?!

Nessie said:

Alba –You’re right. In JCSS, V&T, standing in the middle of the rink, doing nothing for a second or two and rolling their heads, was a bit odd. But I forgave it and accepted it as a kind of transitional moment in both the music and the choreography.

Click to expand...

It's the idea that Morozov has about music and choreography. He keeps doing that in all of their programs. :scowl:
It's not an accident that their gorgeous SP was Alla Kapranova's idea.
I remember someone on FSU saying: "V&T Masquerade Waltz has more Dance holds than Elena&Nikita's Swan Lake.

These things goes under the choreo: Purpose: (Idea, concept, vision, mood). To reward the intentional and quality design of a program, Phrasing and Form (movement and parts are structured to match the phrasing of the music), Originality of Purpose, Movement, and Design.
Under interpretation: Expression of the music’s style, character, and rhythm: Maintaining the character and style of the music throughout the entire program.

So the point is, you do not deserve loads of 10's for that.
It's not their fault of course. They work and give the best out of what they have. Even more, they make it look better than what it is actually because they are excellent skaters.

But I thought I was the only one who noticed that Tanya was checking the state of her hair!

Click to expand...

No, you and I were not alone to notice. It was discussed here as well during the competition.
You remember that she had a low bun when she started, but part of her hair moved when she did the 3S.
So until she did the SbS combination spin she was going on but then she had to check. Maybe because she felt uncomfortable, or she was afraid that the elastic or the hair grip (whatever she was using to hold the bun) would fall.

Skating scores have always been a bit subjective – some skaters are anointed at the top because it’s their “time.” I think that was something of a factor with V&T. A few lapses or lackluster moments are forgiven. But they MUST be minor. Falling twice and falling badly (S and S) cannot of course be ignored.

Click to expand...

I totally agree, and to tell you the truth, I really don't care. As long as it does not effect the placement.
But when people are so picky with those they don't like, but fails to see (or try to justify) the mistakes - and the scores they receive for those mistakes - of their favorite skaters, then, they're just biased and it's pointless to discuss.

starlight97 said:

It's probably a similar mystery to the "Are they just great partners? f
Friends? Friends who like to kiss from time to time and to spend all their free time together? Dating? " I still have no idea

Click to expand...

In the training rink, in Italy, there was a blond lady with Tania's dog (?) or the same kind of dog anyway. Maxim at certain point called her "mam". :think:

starlight97 said:

It's probably a similar mystery to the "Are they just great partners? f
Friends? Friends who like to kiss from time to time and to spend all their free time together? Dating? " I still have no idea

Stupid and unimportant question: What's Tanyas natural hair color? Cause I've seen pictures in which her hair was black in others brown and now blond

Click to expand...

I don't know about mistery, but it says on Tanya's facebook page, that she's been in relationshiop since 2012. V/Tboth said, they spent 24 hours,Maxim added 25 ,in one of the interviews, together. I cannot see Tanya dating somebody else.

Alba said:

In the training rink, in Italy, there was a blond lady with Tania's dog (?) or the same kind of dog anyway. Maxim at certain point called her "mam". :think:

Click to expand...

"mam" as in mother or madam? maybe his mom was babysitting dexter, she's blonde. tati's mom is also blonde, but he wouldn't call her mom.

Hello everyone, nice to meet you! I've been reading this page for some time before starting to give comments by myself. It's always nice to learn something about T&M, as I just fell in love with this pair when i saw them for the 1st time, and mostly because of their chemistry, for the grace that Tanya has (It seems to me that Tanya has exquisite grace and manner of dance), for Max's passion and for their devotion to each other. But does anybody know what is happening with them now? During the last show they seemed to be almost avoiding each other, and on their insta pictures of the two of them are missing((( In 2013 they looked absolutely charmed by each other. And now Maxim seems to be doing his best to contest the image of a couple. I was never sure that they had relationships as they never confirmed, and i am not a fan of discussing private life, but I would just love to know that they didn't have any serious quarrel. It is so lovely when people are so comfortable with each other, i wish them to keep this feeling! This is not the right thing to lose!!!

@Sofiya

the olympics happened, more media happened which maked them more reserved. i did not see they avoided each other in china, that's news to me. i do see photos of them on instagram

http://websta.me/p/773000708541207956_10808668

http://websta.me/p/780150740314838671_10808668
http://websta.me/p/775039371282306563_10808668
http://websta.me/p/767299484403717719_10808668
http://websta.me/p/773630359812176399_13861021
http://websta.me/p/762428735844514575_13861021

their private life is theirs though

their private life is theirs though[/QUOTE]

Saray,
For sure! I just don' want anyone's feelings hurt, i love them both too much) When i start to cheer for a sportsman i can't help wishing him/her the best in life as well (not the best approach, i believe but that's the way it goes)
I hope that you are right and that was just my imagination. I hope that the reason was just that they were tired of silly comments to their pics