Russian coach: The US will help us win team gold and pairs

Whitneyskates said:

I like how those who want to believe this is true completely ignores the question as to why a Russian official would out a scheme in which they're a part of, and if it were true, could get them in trouble as well, or the fact that this person also said they will support other countries as well, when there's only three medals available, yet support is apparently being given to five different countries.

I guess this is what some need to believe to make themselves feel better. Some ubers have said this for years, so I guess yay for you that you have it in print. Although it doesn't make any sense as to why the "whistle blower" would be part of the scheme, and why this person would want to tell the press that they're cheating to get a team gold, but whatever, no need for explanation, it's all fixed. :sarcasm:

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Whistle blowers by their very nature were once part of the scheme and then decide to blow the whistle.
There could be any number of reasons why they could out the situation. Because they were rejected or shunned like a woman scorned for a position. Because they felt things were going too far in the fix maybe at the highest levels as in watergate ....I could speculate on and on.

The fact is the fix has been blown into the open and I hope this is brought into the open and exposed just as Armstrong's deplorable situation was.

Support could be into the next quad for example and not immediate...

Even the athletes themselves would want this out in the open. Cannot believe that DW would want to win under these circumstances.

I have a question of those who know. What was Blumberg 's involvement ? Maybe the next expose would address this.

Blumberg? It is really quite irresponsible just to throw names out at random without a shed of anything except paranoia to back it up. What was David Dore's involement? Brian Orser's?

So you did your own investigation and came to the conclusion that this is true? Awesome!

Blumberg? It is really quite irresponsible just to throw names out at random without a shed of anything except paranoia to back it up.

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What do some V/M ubers have against Blumberg? Was it because she had the nerve to say that V/M were slow in a step sequence at 2011 worlds? Or do they believe she somehow helps them? Because she was on the panel at 2012 4cc's where they lost badly.

Some ubers' hatred for anyone they even think have something against V/M has gone from some what funny to downright frightening.

Mathman said:

Blumberg? It is really quite irresponsible just to throw names out at random without a shed of anything except paranoia to back it up. What was David Dore's involement? Brian Orser's?

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No idea about Dore or Orser's involvement at all but maybe you can enlighten me. I thought I read something on this thread about Blumberg so I am only asking the question.

No I am not paranoid at all. This is because the fix stories have been swirling in Lausanne and elsewhere for some time. After GPF I had accepted that however well VM do they would be second. Now a reputable paper exposes the deal which makes sense.

I know the French press has a strong nose for this sort of thing and I hope it comes into the open. A gold for DW would be tainted in this case and I am sure they being honourable people would want to win on their own merits.

It's not an "expose". It's one person mouthing off and sounding ridiculous in doing so. Apparently Russia is going to support half of the top ten teams there, which will accomplish absolutely nothing, unless they want a massive tie for bronze.

Whitneyskates said:

It's not an "expose". It's one person mouthing off and sounding ridiculous in doing so. Apparently Russia is going to support half of the top ten teams there, which will accomplish absolutely nothing, unless they want a massive tie for bronze.

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They have exposed a situation.....it's an expose.
Nixon said the same thing as did Lance Armstrong.....ie one person was mouthing off!

And of course you believe it's true because it involves D/W. I now want D/W to win even more than I already did.

emdee said:

No idea about Dore or Orser's involvement at all but maybe you can enlighten me.

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Only a thorough investigation can answer that question. I am sure they will protest their innocence.

Mathman said:

Only a thorough investigation can answer that question. I am sure they will protest their innocence.

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Absolutely I would want a thorough investigation . I am burdened by both a sense of honour and my middle class morality that differentiates between right or wrong so regardless who profits (friend or foe) I would always want to only be on the side of the right.

Whitneyskates said:

And of course you believe it's true because it involves D/W. I now want D/W to win even more than I already did.

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This is a ridiculous reason for wanting DW to win.

The only reason for wanting them to win is because they are the best on the night.

I would love patrick to win but if he is beaten fair and square by someone else that is what competition is all about.

I guess I am too straight laced and naive for your world!

I want D/W to win because I want them to have the skates of their lives, I want them to do everything right so that no one can question how or why they won. Of course that won't stop everyone from questioning because no matter how D/W skate they'll always be seen as inferior to V/M by some.

Whitneyskates said:

I want D/W to win because I want them to have the skates of their lives, I want them to do everything right so that no one can question how or why they won. Of course that won't stop everyone from questioning because no matter how D/W skate they're always inferior to V/M

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That is the best reason for wanting them to win. In fact it should be the only reason for anyone winning.
I thought you said that you wanted them to win more than ever because of this expose....

Your last comment about them being inferior is true.....ie they are inferior to VM!

I want them to skate better than they ever have in case these accusations blow up even more so no one can question it.

I will say one thing, though, if they do investigate this and nothing comes up (which I don't believe would) then I think the source should be revealed and disciplined in some way. These are accusations that could affect a lot of people and cause a lot of trouble.

Whitneyskates said:

And of course you believe it's true because it involves D/W. I now want D/W to win even more than I already did.

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How ridiculous.

Honestly, I don't know how this thread got so messy. Do we have reason to doubt this? Yes, nothing is confirmed. Is this unfair and damaging to the sport if true? YES. My disappointment comes from this thread basically turning into a fanwar. Stupid.

Whitneyskates said:

What do some V/M ubers have against Blumberg? Was it because she had the nerve to say that V/M were slow in a step sequence at 2011 worlds? Or do they believe she somehow helps them? Because she was on the panel at 2012 4cc's where they lost badly.

Some ubers' hatred for anyone they even think have something against V/M has gone from some what funny to downright frightening.

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uh...V/M actually won the 2012 4CC over D/W, in USA no less. But according to a poster with sky in the handle, Torino (2010 Worlds) was in Canada, Nice (2012 Worlds) was in Canada and apparently, Colorado Springs is also a Canadian city, hence their wins.

wallylutz, I think the snarky point is that V&M actually won at 4CC's 2012 with Judy Blumberg on the panel, so clearly she didn't have any bad effect on their results, particularly as it was D&W at that event that had a spin and their twizzle down leveled in the FD by the tech panel. If Judy were somehow able to fix results on a tech panel, you'd think she would have done something about that.
http://www.isuresults.com/results/fc2012/SEG007OF.HTM

Of course, she did have the temerity to report, as a commentator at an event that V&M were throwing up snow from their blades during the Golden Waltz part of the short dance (something Carol Lane also mentioned in the Toronto paper, noting that C&P did not do that), and that their step sequence was a hair slower than D&W's, which it was. So Judy was tough but accurate.

There is a lot of conflating of conspiracy theories about past dance results with the reported conspiracy for 2014 Sochi Olympics going on in this thread. The L'equipe article makes no mention of either Shawn Rettstatt or Judy Blumberg, and Judy is not on the Sochi panel in any case, and efforts to accuse either of cheating is pretty low, but especially Judy, since she isn't even here.

News flash: In any event, looking at any team's results, one judge will have that team lower than other judges. That's how arithmetic works. (Also 50% of doctors graduated in the bottom of their class.) Furthermore, since we have no way to tell which judge is low in any case, and cannot trace the judge's grades down through the protocols to know whether the low judge was low for every skater or was suspiciously high for Russia, or France, or Italy, or the USA, the smearing of Rettstatt as the low grading judge at the GPF is also unfounded.

That said, the ISU should investigate these charges, although it will be hard to do if the anonymous coach does not come forward and explain how he knows these things. My guess is that it is Morozov (I&K's coach), and given my opinion of Morozov, I might have a problem believing him. He would be the guy who might have a grudge at the Russian fed, since B&S are Russia's number one, and not his students I&K.

The other possibility would be Zhulin, B&S's coach, and it doesn't seem like his style, nor would it be to his advantage to trash the Russian fed.

But really, why would the federation officials notify any coaches of the cheating and/or politicking they plan to do? That is what puzzles me.

it's not like d/w need a fix to win. they're a damn fine team and if they skate like they did in us nats and v/m skate like they did in canadian nats, they deserve to win. but the teams are so closely matched that any funny business would tip the balanace and that would suck. idk why some people are so sure that these are the rantings of a madman and aren't to be believed in any case. are they true? WHO KNOWS. but as wallylutz observed, this is not a random rumor from the daily mail. it's written from a reputable sports paper which wouldn't stake its reputation based on something they made up from thin air.

Agreed, it would suck.

and i really dislike that d/w will have this hanging around their necks if they do give a superior performance and win gold. you know some people will never let it go