Free Dance - Notes & Results

I am of two minds about the state of Ice Dancing today. OTOH, I feel that the overall level is the highest it has ever been. In the previous years, I felt that may be top 3 were interesting, but did not like any others. Now, I enjoy may all of the top 10 to one degree or another. OTOH, I feel that none of the current teams are as great as some teams of yesteryear (Gretchuk & Platov, Klimova & Ponomarenko, even Krylova & Ovsyannikov). What's more, I don't see any up-and-coming teams that could achieve those levels.

I'm also of two minds about dance these days. There seems to be a tension right now between trying to jam in technical content and at the same time deliver an entertaining program.

Some of the time I have the distinct impression teams are trying to shove too much into their programs and it just ends up looking cluttered with constantly changing positions etc that may indeed be difficult but none are held/highlighted enough to make any real impact. And some are just ugly. Programs don't seem to really highlight music - or should I say choreography doesn't seem to really be to one piece of music in particular.

I do feel that technical content should be rewarded, but sometimes I just wish there was some kind of limit to be placed - as there is with singles on number of jumps allowed etc. It might lead to a more satisfied feeling of having watched a WHOLE program rather than something that is little bits thrown together. By the way, to be clear, this has nothing to do with how many/few pieces of music a team uses. It's about a coherent program.

Sometimes I actually enjoy watching the technically less superior skaters more for just this reason. Their programs are simpler, but sometimes IMO, actually in a way better, more watchable.

I don't know what the solution is. I just thought I'd throw my opinion out there for what it's worth.

The problem I've had with Dance the last several years is the fact that every free dance basically looked alike. Everyone was trying to imitate Anissina & Peizerat with the flowing around and the gliding and the 55 yards of fabric flapping everywhere, only they didn't have A/P's artistic vision. There are still quite a few programs in that vein floating around out there, but what I liked about this season was the dances were all so different from one another. Reminds me of the mid to late 80s post Torvill-and-Dean era when Dance was so much fun and you never knew what kind of stuff you would be seeing.

JonnyCoop said:

The problem I've had with Dance the last several years is the fact that every free dance basically looked alike. Everyone was trying to imitate Anissina & Peizerat with the flowing around and the gliding and the 55 yards of fabric flapping everywhere, only they didn't have A/P's artistic vision. There are still quite a few programs in that vein floating around out there, but what I liked about this season was the dances were all so different from one another. Reminds me of the mid to late 80s post Torvill-and-Dean era when Dance was so much fun and you never knew what kind of stuff you would be seeing.

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This is one of my problems with dance. I still see far too little individuality in the programs. Many look as if they could be skated to any piece of music that happened to be playing. I don't know that I would trace it back to Annissina and Peizerat though, as I think it has more to do with the teams trying to "pack" their programs with difficulty to the point where all the uniqueness is gone. eg. All of Torvill and Dean's programs would be inadequate in this day and age, no matter how charming they would have been deemed to easy. They took time in between their "highlights" so their highlights really were just that. They repeated movements to emphasize things - I often think now as I watch - gee that was an interesting move, I wish they'd do it again - but by then they're already about 10 moves onward in the program.

rain said:

They took time in between their "highlights" so their highlights really were just that. They repeated movements to emphasize things - I often think now as I watch - gee that was an interesting move, I wish they'd do it again - but by then they're already about 10 moves onward in the program.

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Exactly. As much of a fan as I was NOT of Gritshuk & Platov, I will say that that is one thing they often did right, repeating especially good movements. ITA agree with you about the music as well -- many of the dances we've seen the last several seasons could have been pretty much done to ANYTHING with no-one being any the wiser. It's like sometimes you get the feeling that the music is just on because they were told that they had to bring a tape....

JonnyCoop said:

Exactly. As much of a fan as I was NOT of Gritshuk & Platov, I will say that that is one thing they often did right, repeating especially good movements. ITA agree with you about the music as well -- many of the dances we've seen the last several seasons could have been pretty much done to ANYTHING with no-one being any the wiser. It's like sometimes you get the feeling that the music is just on because they were told that they had to bring a tape....

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Totally agree with you. Gritshuk and Platov were a team that made me grind my teeth more than once (couldn't stand them), but they DID do the repetition of particularly interesting moves which I appreciated. Seeing as how the ice dancers have the most choice of any discipline when it comes to music as they are allowed to use vocals, there's really no excuse for not properly choreographing to it. As a result of the bland choreography few teams have really distinguished themselves with a particular style. I'm hard-pressed to name a really memorable program from this year that I'd like to see again. I'm not sure that COP will improve the situation either with each footwork sequence, spin and lift categorized and given a number of points, teams will be under more pressure than ever to pack programs and change positions more and faster. Don't get me wrong, I do like COP and think it will be an improvement in most areas - dance has been crippled by name recognition judging for too many years and COP has some chance to correct this a bit - but there are still concerns from my watcher's perspective. Difficulty isn't always everything.

In future keep your eyes on Gregrory and Petukhov!!! they are Boune's pupils and it shows. They won their group round.

Also there was a Chinese team that showed great promise. We may be branching off from "Europe"s Sport" to other continents.

Joe

The problem with Gregory and Petuhkov is that they are also Morozov's pupils, and it shows. It's getting so you can spot his choreography a mile away. They would set themselves apart with different choreagraphy.

Joesitz said:

In future keep your eyes on Gregrory and Petukhov!!! they are Boune's pupils and it shows. They won their group round.

Also there was a Chinese team that showed great promise. We may be branching off from "Europe"s Sport" to other continents.

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Lets hope Gregory and Petukhov are NOT the future of Ice Dancing. Their very generic choregraphy is so derived, it's headache-inducing. I look at them, and I see a team trying to mimic L&T. This isn't unexpected since their choregrapher is Nikolai Morozov, the king of generic derived choreography. Their complete lack of transitional elements is also troublesome. This team has nothing to offer but tricks and crossovers. They need to get a real FD with real content if they want to be competative.

TV

thvudragon said:

Lets hope Gregory and Petukhov are NOT the future of Ice Dancing. Their very generic choregraphy is so derived, it's headache-inducing. I look at them, and I see a team trying to mimic L&T. This isn't expected since their choregrapher is Nikolai Morozov, the king of generic derived choreography. Their complete lack of transitional elements is also troublesome. This team has nothing to offer but tricks and crossovers. They need to get a real FD with real content if they want to be competative.

TV

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Now that I think of it, its true, they seem to try to mimic L&T. I hope they'll find their own style. SOON:sheesh:

thvudragon said:

Lets hope Gregory and Petukhov are NOT the future of Ice Dancing. Their very generic choregraphy is so derived, it's headache-inducing. I look at them, and I see a team trying to mimic L&T. This isn't unexpected since their choregrapher is Nikolai Morozov, the king of generic derived choreography. Their complete lack of transitional elements is also troublesome. This team has nothing to offer but tricks and crossovers. They need to get a real FD with real content if they want to be competative.

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ITA. My interest in ice dance will decline dramatically if those two are the future. They're my least favorite team in the top 15.

I think that the ice dancers have the least choice of music. Yes they can choose vocal music , which I think cheapens the sport but I did like Lohse and Winkler skating to German lyrics to a German crowd, however the music has to have a definite beat which eliminates a lot of classical music. I heard that they implemented that rule b/c so many dancers were doing off the beat stuff in competition that they actually had story lines to their programs (ie printed them out and handed them to everyone to get them in the loop). This was in 1992 for 1993 season and afterward the programs started getting generic.

My pet peeve is with all of the spins. I was watching the Ukrainian 4th place finishers (the one with the dove costume) and they did several "pairs" spins though they broke them up into little chunks? (I can't describe it but you know how a real pair spin is verses a choppy ice dance spin b/c dancers aren't supposed to spin?.

These dancers are doing all these spins and lifts and I wanna see the footwork! What I liked about Navka was that the majority of their program had dance holds, face to face dancing/foorwork, great unison and not that many crossovers. I hate that a lot of teams resort to doing side by side crossovers. That should be banned in dance.

Also what's the deal with getting rid of compulsory dances? It's bad enough that most of the top teams have no clue how to choreograph a dance with basic dance holds and steps and now they're talking about eliminating the only yardstick that judges have to determine who the best team is out there? Now I might be behind on this issue b/c it's been a while when they were talking about getting rid of compulsories (it's bad enough that they got rid of original set pattern) and they might have already but I thought I'd express my views (not that I've had trouble before).

Well, they're down to one cd. I'm sure eventually they drop that too. I hope they don't. It is great to be able to compare everyone, and it forces skaters to work on their technique.