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Thread: The art, the flow, the grace is gone

  1. #1
    D*mn Idiot KwanIsALegand's Avatar
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    The art, the flow, the grace is gone

    I am sorry but Adelina over Yuna just proves that what most of us cherish and love about figure skating is over. Done. It is all about racking up points. You do not have to be particular graceful, artistic or have great edges. You just have to do ridiculous spins and jumps and boom, you won the gold.

    The group I watched skating with tonight COULD NOT BELIEVE Adelina won. They were laughing at how ridiculous it was. She has zero polish, zero grace and absolutely no flow over the ice. It is as if she just went out and did her chores for the day, very workmanlike and rough.
    For that to beat Yuna or Carolina is disgusting and sad.
    This is a very bleak road that this beautiful sport is taking.

  2. #2
    Rinkside
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    I totally agree ... To give de OGM to a girl with such low level of rafinament who waves his hand to the public as she was doing spirals ....I mean Russian inflation and all ... but this is all gone to far IMO.

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    l want you remind you sore losers this is Olympics. And Olympics is not about shmartistry, but about sports, athleticism and energy. Please, fund your own Artistic Games and you will be rewarding grace and art. But not here.

  4. #4
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CezarMart View Post
    l want you remind you sore losers this is Olympics. And Olympics is not about shmartistry, but about sports, athleticism and energy. Please, fund your own Artistic Games and you will be rewarding grace and art. But not here.
    Part of judging figure skating is choreography and interpretation. If you have a problem with that then petition for it to be removed as an Olympic sport.

    Moreover, the original poster also was talking about edge quality. Skating is also about blade control and it's most definitely an athletic aspect. After having analyzed the performances as much as possible, I've got to say the judging of the step sequences was crap. Sotnikova's step sequence had rough edges all the way through it and I saw nothing wrong in Yu-Na Kim's LP footwork sequence that should drop it to a Level 3. In the SP, yes, she made some edge mistakes that deservedly dropped the level, but in the LP her sequence hit the requirements and was executed FAR better than Sotnikova's.

    Combine that with bad PCS judging and Sotnikova not being called for underrotation on her 3Lutz+3Toe< combo (Sotnikova has NEVER done this combo fully rotated in her entire career; she's always had a technique issue on the toeloop off the landing of the lutz and tried to do 3Lutz+3Loop in the past instead) and I'm officially upset with this result. It definitely still should have been pretty close, but she was massively held up and Yu-Na deserved it in the end; if Yu-Na's PCS were even just 2.5 points higher than Sotnikova's, that would be enough in my book. The fact that Yu-Na only got 0.09 more in PCS is an outrage.

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    Riveted vegarin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    Part of judging figure skating is choreography and interpretation. If you have a problem with that then petition for it to be removed as an Olympic sport.

    Moreover, the original poster also was talking about edge quality. Skating is also about blade control and it's most definitely an athletic aspect. After having analyzed the performances as much as possible, I've got to say the judging of the step sequences was crap. Sotnikova's step sequence had rough edges all the way through it and I saw nothing wrong in Yu-Na Kim's LP footwork sequence that should drop it to a Level 3. In the SP, yes, she made some edge mistakes that deservedly dropped the level, but in the LP her sequence hit the requirements and was executed FAR better than Sotnikova's.

    Combine that with bad PCS judging and Sotnikova not being called for underrotation on her 3Lutz+3Toe< combo (Sotnikova has NEVER done this combo fully rotated in her entire career; she's always had a technique issue on the toeloop off the landing of the lutz and tried to do 3Lutz+3Loop in the past instead) and I'm officially upset with this result. It definitely still should have been pretty close, but she was massively held up and Yu-Na deserved it in the end; if Yu-Na's PCS were even just 2.5 points higher than Sotnikova's, that would be enough in my book. The fact that Yu-Na only got 0.09 more in PCS is an outrage.
    Wow, and I know you're not a big fan of Yuna, so this actually helps a lot and carries a lot of objectivity. Thanks for your input.

  6. #6
    Gotta Have Music iluvtodd's Avatar
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    Thankfully, two mature ladies with the whole package made the podium!

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    Quote Originally Posted by KwanIsALegand View Post
    I am sorry but Adelina over Yuna just proves that what most of us cherish and love about figure skating is over. Done. It is all about racking up points. You do not have to be particular graceful, artistic or have great edges. You just have to do ridiculous spins and jumps and boom, you won the gold.

    The group I watched skating with tonight COULD NOT BELIEVE Adelina won. They were laughing at how ridiculous it was. She has zero polish, zero grace and absolutely no flow over the ice. It is as if she just went out and did her chores for the day, very workmanlike and rough.
    For that to beat Yuna or Carolina is disgusting and sad.
    This is a very bleak road that this beautiful sport is taking.
    Well, frankly this is not exactly new. Given the current system, I do not have a problem with this result. And as a staunch supporter of 6.0, I really don't think the result would have been different. Tara over Michelle anyone? I'm not seeing this big conspiracy, and I favor Yuna style skating.

  8. #8
    Custom Title FSGMT's Avatar
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    No, I don't think that "the art, the flow and the grace is gone": we got to watch three incredibly beautiful programs from three incredibly mature and refined skaters (Mao, Caro and Yu-Na) yesterday, the only thing that is really "gone" (well, it didn't exist even before yesterday ) is the correct evaluation of that strange and misterious thing called "PCS"
    (And, one thing that I have to say in favor of Adelina: I have seen her live twice, and her SS and ice coverage are really wonderful, but her CH and IN are nowhere near Caro's and Yu-Na's)

  9. #9
    Rinkside
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    Quote Originally Posted by FSGMT View Post
    No, I don't think that "the art, the flow and the grace is gone": we got to watch three incredibly beautiful programs from three incredibly mature and refined skaters (Mao, Caro and Yu-Na) yesterday, the only thing that is really "gone" (well, it didn't exist even before yesterday ) is the correct evaluation of that strange and misterious thing called "PCS"
    (And, one thing that I have to say in favor of Adelina: I have seen her live twice, and her SS and ice coverage are really wonderful, but her CH and IN are nowhere near Caro's and Yu-Na's)
    I definitely agree with FSGMT. The artistry of figure skating is not gone. The real issue is how to evaluation the PCS marks. Even under the old 6.0 system, there wasn't a correct way of evaluating artistry.

    One thing fans must remember is that artistry is highly subjective, and I am glad that it is. This allows skaters of different styles to be different and still have a chance of winning. I am one who does not want all figure skating champions to be the same cookie-cutter graceful, ballerina type. For example, I love Midori Ito; however, she would have never been a champion if she had to fit into the mold. She was a jumper and was allowed to be one and still become a champion.

    Last thing... I finally realized after this Olympics that PCS are not really judging artistry. They are placement marks. Just like the old 6.0 system, the artistic mark was used to rank the skaters based on who the judge thought did the best. So if you thought Yuna did better than Carolina, then you gave Yuna higher marks even if she didn't have better artistry/choreography.

    This has carried over to the new system. And the reason it has to be this way because it would become too difficult and time consuming to objectively evaluate the edge quality of every single step and stroke on the ice or the placement of every arm/leg/head movement. Now, I realize why they had the compulsory figures before the 90s. It was a way to evaluate the quality of a skaters edging. Maybe we should go back to having that a part of the competition.

  10. #10
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    Let's be honest here. The artistry of figure skating is NOT gone. Adelina was given gold and Julia given 5th by virtue of it being the Olympics in Russia.

    Now that this farce of a Russian-biased figure skating competition is over, the scores will come back down to earth (hopefully), and Worlds and the ensuing quadrennial - save for Rostelecom Cup events - will be a much fairer fight.

  11. #11
    Mashimaro on Ice
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    Well, back in 1998 Tara won over Michelle, who had two of the best skating programs in history. So how is this new?

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    Quote Originally Posted by miki88 View Post
    Well, back in 1998 Tara won over Michelle, who had two of the best skating programs in history. So how is this new?
    Not really comparable.

    1) Tara made no mistakes. Adelina did.

    2) Tara had a lovely Sandra Beszic FP and a passable outfit. Adelina skated in off-coloured flesh gloves to a muzak version of a classic violin piece.

    3) Tara was a world champion. Adelina has never won anything of significance at the senior international level. No Euros, No Worlds, not even a single grand prix event.

    4) Adelina is Russian. There have been no judging scandals in this sport that haven't involved Russians. Russians cheat and they don't effing care who knows it.

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    Mashimaro on Ice
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    Quote Originally Posted by MalloryArcher View Post
    Not really comparable.

    1) Tara made no mistakes. Adelina did.

    2) Tara had a lovely Sandra Beszic FP and a passable outfit. Adelina skated in off-coloured flesh gloves to a muzak version of a classic violin piece.

    3) Tara was a world champion. Adelina has never won anything of significance at the senior international level. No Euros, No Worlds, not even a single grand prix event.

    4) Adelina is Russian. There have been no judging scandals in this sport that haven't involved Russians. Russians cheat and they don't effing care who knows it.
    Um costumes count in the scores? Adelina does have much bigger jumps and comparable skating skills. She also did have lots of energy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by miki88 View Post
    Um costumes count in the scores? Adelina does have much bigger jumps and comparable skating skills. She also did have lots of energy.
    Uh what??? Her choreography was silly and tacky, and she should have lost points for THAT. The costumes just added insult to injury.

    Do you know what skating skills are? They probably aren't what you think they are if you think Adelina's are better than Yuna or Carolina. And energy, hahaha well why don't we give her the gold for having the nicest smile?

  15. #15
    Mashimaro on Ice
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    Quote Originally Posted by MalloryArcher View Post
    Uh what??? Her choreography was silly and tacky, and she should have lost points for THAT. The costumes just added insult to injury.

    Do you know what skating skills are? They probably aren't what you think they are if you think Adelina's are better than Yuna or Carolina. And energy, hahaha well why don't we give her the gold for having the nicest smile?
    Did I say Adelina was better than them? All I said was I don't think Adelina is that much different from Tara in 1998. And that the judges do have a history of awarding performances that weren't the most artistic or refined. Tara did not have better skating skills, artistry, refinement, or even jump quality (her jumps were really small) than Michelle but she managed to win because she had more difficult technical content and was really on her A game that night. I've heard some fans defend Tara 's win because Michelle was cautious, not as inspired. In my opinion, Michelle appeared far more inspired (esp in the short) than Kim. The most inspiring and artistic performances of the medalists was Carolina and my pick for the winner.

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