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Thread: Did Yuna Kim Really Try?

  1. #76
    Riveted vegarin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    I am wondering what will you say in the next Olympics in Korea.
    Unless they drag Yuna out of retirement, I don't think Korea would be ready with anyone who can be a real podium threat, so that's a moot point.

    Or not. I suppose Korea can put a puppet on ice and twirl it and give it inflated PCS and GOE and declare it a winner, and I don't think it'll be that different from Sochi.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by vegarin View Post
    Unless they drag Yuna out of retirement, I don't think Korea would be ready with anyone who can be a real podium threat, so that's a moot point.

    Or not. I suppose Korea can put a puppet on ice and twirl it and give it inflated PCS and GOE and declare it a winner, and I don't think it'll be that different from Sochi.
    Basically.

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlattFan View Post
    Absolutely not. That freeskate was beaten hard! Mao was flawless and they dumped a bucket of ice water on her.
    I can't believe Mao's absolute best LP lost to a hunchback troll on an imaginary ship by 7 points.
    That's just the thing. It wasn't just Yuna. Both Mao and Caro got dumped at the same time. Our three most decorated, most admired, go-down-history-as-the-best skaters in contemporary time laid down the best possible short (-Mao) and free possible. They all brought their A game and pulled through and laid down everything they've got, everything unique to them, everything that makes them them. Mao laid down all her jumps. Caro her pure artistry accompanying a rare clean skate, and Yuna, her steel nerves and poise that let her lay down a clean skate while skating last in her last Olympic while facing the audience that would rather see her fall.

    And after all that, the judges told them, Nah, you guys are not good enough to beat Adelina with a mistake.

    All three of them. At the same time.

    They were all defeated by Adelina at the same time.

    How am I supposed to take figure skating seriously now? How? How the heck can the ISU be OKAY with this?

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by vegarin View Post
    I have no words. That's exactly what's happening with half of the newspapers right now. The other half are claiming that it was an outrage, but the other keep saying, Nah, her technical score wasn't high enough compared to Adelina.

    Oh my gawd. Screw these people. Except that those technical scores they keep quoting included GOEs, given by the judges. At the BV, combined SP and FP, the difference between Yuna and Adelina were less than 4 points. Adelina's TES, including the 3 GOEs, makes it look like she did so much more, but the base difference was like 4. Plus her botched landing should have knocked it off to around 3.

    And Yuna should've been more than easily able to cross that 3 points. If Yuna has gotten the GOEs from just last year, that would've been more than enough to overtake Adelina. If they gave her and Adelina exactly same amount of GOE (which is already outrageous), all Yuna had to do was score 3 points higher in PCS, which she more than deserves.

    But the generic public have no idea. The half of the newspapers are saying this is totally okay and the judging was totally correct, insisting that while Yuna looks so much better on ice, Adelina has just so much tech score on Yuna so she totally deserves to win. Plus, hey, they gave Yuna a bit more PCS, right? So we're totally recognizing that Yuna is a better skater. Right, you gave her 0.08. more. But they don't mention that at all. They keep harping on how much connection Adelina had with the general public, and how much tech scores she has against Yuna.

    And Yuna was flat. She wasn't the same as 2010. She didn't connect with the crowd. So it's all her damn fault for not attacking the program right.

    Even last night I didn't realize this was how they were going to spin the story. I was an idiot. I can't believe it. Just reading some of these uninformed opinions disguising as experts make my blood boil.
    Thank you, you echo my sentiments exactly.
    I think I was relieved right along with Yuna who was simply glad that it was over. It was a grueling journey for her, and even her coach expressed that she was one of the ones to push Yuna, but after seeing the results, just regretting about pushing her to compete again. I was ready to accept the "silver" for her--because it honestly did not matter what medal she got. She showed us through her performances that she's a great athlete, a great skater.

    But yes, it makes me EXTREMELY angry that ex-figure skaters, "analysts", and who-for-god-sakes-knows-fake-journalists devaluing her performance, saying that she didn't bring it or try hard enough. PLEASE. Those are the most asinine excuses for why they would give Yuna the silver medal and give the gold medal to simply someone who "wanted" it more. Heck, maybe if I "want" a gold bad enough, I could skate in the next Olympics too.

    AND there's news coming out that Yuna was still getting treatment for a slight fracture in her right foot up until the Games, and was on painkillers the whole time. I should've known when she was wincing throughout practices, and for both the SP and FS when she bent over like it was too much.

    INCREDIBLE WOMAN.

    And Tara Lipinski should know better. She's a one-hit-wonder. Have some dignity, woman.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vegarin View Post
    All three of them. At the same time.
    No kidding.
    Mao's absolute best LP in her career
    Carolina's absolute best LP in her career
    Kim's almost absolute best LP (only one lutz is tight, but with good sped, good height, true lutz, still +1 to +2 GOE)

    I feel like all three of them got tricked into participating in this charade to crown a Russian girl. Make her win more legit. Johnny and Tara, these two disgusting individuals, kept on saying Yuna only had 6 triples vs. Adelina's 7 triples. What about Mao's 8 triples? What about Carolina's 7 triples?

    Line, carriage, speed, choreography, interpretation, all 3 should beat Adelina by at least 2 points in each component.

  6. #81
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    I'm just disgusted. Adelina will never be remembered as the great legend or anything. She's a girl who managed to beat the sport's greatest 3 by crooked judging & home cooking.

    Seriously... Yuna, Caro & Mao deserved better.

    (I imagine that if Mao had been in the final group & skated the LP she'd skated, her 3A would've received < to ensure she can't beat Adelina w/ TES alone.)

    Another note -- Who remembers Tara as one of the greatest skaters ever? Anybody? I only remember her as the girl who got lucky and managed to beat Michelle in Nagano but ran real fast afterward b/c she was too scared to face Michelle again b/c we all know who the true champion is!

  7. #82
    Riveted vegarin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlattFan View Post
    No kidding.
    I feel like all three of them got tricked into participating in this charade to crown a Russian girl. Make her win more legit. Johnny and Tara, these two disgusting individuals, kept on saying Yuna only had 6 triples vs. Adelina's 7 triples. What about Mao's 8 triples? What about Carolina's 7 triples?
    It's one thing if Adelina is just that good to beat all of three of them. I didn't know if such a fearsome creature can exist, but apparently they're telling us she is. She isn't. Anyone who knows anything about FS and who has eyes can see it. She/Julia are completely manufactured so that she can become a bankable asset they can capitalize on in the future.

    So, in order to do that, ISU basically went and crapped on their best skaters they had for the last decade. Is that how they reward their best and brightest that they capitalized on for years to increase popularity? Because they'll all soon be retiring and they are no longer useful?

    Oh god. They really are disgusting.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadia01 View Post
    I'm just disgusted. Adelina will never be remembered as the great legend or anything. She's a girl who managed to beat the sport's greatest 3 by crooked judging & home cooking.

    Seriously... Yuna, Caro & Mao deserved better.

    (I imagine that if Mao had been in the final group & skated the LP she'd skated, her 3A would've received < to ensure she can't beat Adelina w/ TES alone.)

    Another note -- Who remembers Tara as one of the greatest skaters ever? Anybody? I only remember her as the girl who got lucky and managed to beat Michelle in Nagano but ran real fast afterward b/c she was too scared to face Michelle again b/c we all know who the true champion is!
    So, what does this mean?
    The Olympic gold medal is not all that. I think it has become too blown up, I am happy it is is just once very four years. Gimme a skater who can win nationals and worlds repeatedly, that is what great skaters are made of.

  9. #84
    Custom Title Nadia01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KwanIsALegand View Post
    So, what does this mean?
    The Olympic gold medal is not all that. I think it has become too blown up, I am happy it is is just once very four years. Gimme a skater who can win nationals and worlds repeatedly, that is what great skaters are made of.
    It is and it isn't.

    It is a nice cherry on top if the skater has the other titles and so on already that complete her competitive skating career.

    It's sort of a *** if the skater doesn't have anything EXCEPT that. It's like a grungy homeless guy with a giant ostentatious bling-bling around his neck.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by vegarin View Post
    That's just the thing. It wasn't just Yuna. Both Mao and Caro got dumped at the same time. Our three most decorated, most admired, go-down-history-as-the-best skaters in contemporary time laid down the best possible short (-Mao) and free possible. They all brought their A game and pulled through and laid down everything they've got, everything unique to them, everything that makes them them. Mao laid down all her jumps. Caro her pure artistry accompanying a rare clean skate, and Yuna, her steel nerves and poise that let her lay down a clean skate while skating last in her last Olympic while facing the audience that would rather see her fall.

    And after all that, the judges told them, Nah, you guys are not good enough to beat Adelina with a mistake.

    All three of them. At the same time.

    They were all defeated by Adelina at the same time.

    How am I supposed to take figure skating seriously now? How? How the heck can the ISU be OKAY with this?
    Sad thing. It could've been the best ladies event but due to some people's greediness, it has been tarnished.

  11. #86
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    Article from Japan Times.

    Scandalous outcome: Skating judges steal Kim’s title, hand it to Sotnikova

    SOCHI, RUSSIA – Yuna Kim got robbed on Thursday night. Plain and simple.

    What happened to her at the Sochi Games was a complete and utter disgrace. Another black eye for figure skating.

    The elegant and magnetic South Korean superstar gave a wonderful performance in very difficult circumstances, not making a single mistake, yet came away with only a silver medal in what can only be deemed a scandalous result.

    Russian gold medalist Adelina Sotnikova was impressive in her free skate, but was she five points better than Kim?

    No way. How over the top was Sotnikova’s score in the free skate? Sixteen points better than her previous personal best.
    Give me a break. What should have been a glorious moment for Russian skating was taking on a decidedly different tone the morning after, with some very disturbing information emerging.

    I spoke with several journalists in the Main Press Center on Friday morning and it was nearly unanimous — they almost all thought that Kim had beaten home favorite Sotnikova.

    Before I even made it back to my hotel after the competition, the debate was already beginning to rage.

    With the arrival of Kim and Mao Asada many years ago, skating in Asia has been enjoying a boom. But the sad reality is that in many other places it has been languishing. The results in women’s singles here will only make promoting it harder. Every time something like this occurs it does exponential damage.

    Millions of people around the world are watching and presuming it is all legitimate. Skating is a great sport — one that teaches important values to youngsters about dedication, hard work and sportsmanship — and to see it besmirched again is very disturbing.

    What are the young skaters and fans who watched the free skate supposed to think?

    What bothers me most is that here was this great champion, an incredible symbol for skating, giving it her all one more time. Kim is a millionaire many times over and certainly didn’t need to compete. She is set for life.

    But she knew she was still young enough to give it another go and wanted her fans to have another chance to see her on the greatest stage. She put her legacy on the line in a bid to become only the third woman ever to retain the Olympic title (after Norway’s Sonja Henie and Germany’s Katarina Witt). It was a gutsy move.

    Brennan, the author of the highly acclaimed skating book “Inside Edge,” didn’t mince any words in her analysis of the free skate, telling it exactly like it was.
    “What happened tonight in the women’s figure skating competition was worse than the 2002 Salt Lake City pairs judging scandal because, this time, we’ll never find out who might have done what because all the judges’ scores are now anonymous,” she wrote.
    Brennan also quoted Joseph Inman, an American international skating judge as saying, “I was surprised with the result.”
    Kim nailed both of her programs and should have retained her title. That is the bottom line.

    Three-time U.S. champion Michael Weiss sensed something amiss with this Twitter comment on Thursday. “Yuna — two clean skates as defending Olympic champ wins gold, right?”

    That’s the way it is supposed to be. Legendary American skater Dick Button, a two-time Olympic champion (1948, 1952), has been an analyst now for decades. The messages he tweeted said it all. “At one point, I had doubts regarding Yuna Kim — not after today. She was superb, elegant, charming. Never a wilt.” His feelings about the gold medalist were different. “Sotnikova was energetic, strong, commendable, but not a complete skater.”

    What folks need to understand is that Sotnikova didn’t just emerge from oblivion. She has been around for a few years. She is a four-time Russian champion and the 2011 world junior champion. But in her three seasons skating on the senior circuit, she has never even won a Grand Prix event, much less medaled at a major international competition. She has qualified just once for the world championships as a senior, finishing ninth in 2013.

    Did she suddenly become great overnight? Good enough to beat Kim in the Olympics? Your common sense will tell you no. Once you arrive there, the rest is not difficult to deduce.

    Kim showed her true class with her comments after the free skate. She could have stirred up controversy, but was magnanimous in defeat. “The score is given by the judges,” she said. “I’m not in the right position to comment on it. And my words can change nothing.”

    The reality is the trap for Kim was set on Wednesday night with the unfairly high score that Sotnikova received in the short program.
    Kim was fabulous skating to “Send in the Clowns” and should have had a lead of at least four points heading into the free skate.

    Instead, both Lipnitskaia and Sotnikova received inflated marks and the former was less than half a point behind Kim in second place. It was as if once it became apparent that Lipnitskaia wasn’t going to be a contender for the gold, the impetus swung to push Sotnikova. There is nothing that damages sports more than predictability, the preordained result. That’s what you saw on Thursday night.

    Kim could not have gotten out of the Iceberg Skating Palace with the gold medal if she had left with it in an armored car.
    I almost felt as if I were watching a play where Kim was going to be brought out and sacrificed as the final act.
    That would have gone along with the story line, but Kim would have none of it. She displayed the heart and courage of a true champion in an amazing effort.

    What happened next was a damn shame.


    http://www.japantimes.co.jp/sports/2.../#.UwiwcWJ_tjM

  12. #87
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    I tend to feel that something squirrelly went on with the judging. And at moments I'm angry about it. But I'm far angrier when someone says that YuNa Kim didn't "try hard enough." That is insulting in the extreme. Didn't try hard enough? Someone who has done nothing but excel for at least SEVEN YEARS, and who has carried the entire burden of her country's skating program solely on her back, didn't try hard enough? When the men flopped about like beached dolphins in their final, while the ladies stood up to the challenge of their final, and when YuNa herself put together two clean programs, this statement is thoughtless, clueless, and entirely without merit. Is Tara Lipinski one of the ones who said or implied this? Shame on her, if that is accurate.

    I'm not angry as a YuNa fan. I'm angry as a fan of skating. Those ladies ripped their hearts out on the world's largest public stage, and it is discourteous and unsportsmanlike to make such a remark about any of them. If this had been said about Julia Lipnitskaia, I would be just as angry. Fair is fair.

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    I tend to feel that something squirrelly went on with the judging. And at moments I'm angry about it. But I'm far angrier when someone says that YuNa Kim didn't "try hard enough." That is insulting in the extreme. Didn't try hard enough? Someone who has done nothing but excel for at least SEVEN YEARS, and who has carried the entire burden of her country's skating program solely on her back, didn't try hard enough? When the men flopped about like beached dolphins in their final, while the ladies stood up to the challenge of their final, and when YuNa herself put together two clean programs, this statement is thoughtless, clueless, and entirely without merit. Is Tara Lipinski one of the ones who said or implied this? Shame on her, if that is accurate.

    I'm not angry as a YuNa fan. I'm angry as a fan of skating. Those ladies ripped their hearts out on the world's largest public stage, and it is discourteous and unsportsmanlike to make such a remark about any of them. If this had been said about Julia Lipnitskaia, I would be just as angry. Fair is fair.
    Thank you Olympia. The amount of disrespect for skaters reeking in here is disgusting and disheartening.

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    I am the original poster and please let me clarify.

    I admit the title was misleading. I wanted to convey the fact and send a message to some people out there who report as if Yuna is sad that she didn't win gold. Yuna herself doesn't seem to have a problem with anything and is just glad to put an end to her career which always has been marred by questionable judging, injury, and conspiracy.

    It would be marring her reputation and her champion personality, noble humility, to say that Yuna wanted just gold.

    What I meant to say is that Yuna didn't try for gold per se, she just tried her best. And if this was a fair world, Yuna would have gotten gold for her best.

    AS OPPOSED TO the Russia who JUST wanted gold, no decency or reputation or justice to the sport or beauty.

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    I'm not a conspiracy theorist in general, but I do think that Yuna understood before she left Korea that she was unlikely to medal unless both Russian skaters had seriously flawed programs. Her statements ahead of time, her demeanor at the games and after her scores were read leads me to believe this.

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