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Thread: The 1 Loop Jump in a jump combo

  1. #31
    On the Ice
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    To be fair, Plushenko's amazing 3axel/half loop/3flip was really a 3axel/half loop/3LIP. Still impressive, nonetheless.

    In terms of ladies who I thought do half loop sequences/combinations well:
    Tara
    Sasha
    Midori
    Their half loops looked like actual jumps, done purposefully.

    Half Loops that look like mistakes, and are sometimes not fully rotated:
    Irina
    Maria
    Anna P.
    Elena R.

  2. #32
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GF2445 View Post
    I would like to see someone do a full loop in this combo instead of doing the half loop. That would be tricky.
    That's not physically possible as a loop lands on a back outside edge and the 1/2 Lo (+1Lo in Senior level combos) lands on a back inside edge

  3. #33
    Rinkside
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    Surya Bonaly's 3toe-half loop-3sal combo always looked good.
    Last edited by cmk; 03-04-2014 at 12:55 AM. Reason: spelling

  4. #34
    Custom Title BlackPack's Avatar
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    3t-half loop-3sal may not look aesthetically pleasing, but it does add more difficulty than if the 2 triples were executed separately. It gives skaters an opportunity for more choreography and other elements.

    3-3s are always exciting to watch, 4-3s are too scary. 4-3s have ruined too many hips.

  5. #35
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    I don't think I have ever seen this combo live on TV. Only saw a couple times on YouTube.

    Can you do this under COP?

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by usethis2 View Post
    I don't think I have ever seen this combo live on TV. Only saw a couple times on YouTube.

    Can you do this under COP?
    Of course. Max and Jason are just two of the Americans doing it now. Both do 3Lz-half loop-3S.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by karne View Post
    Shoosh. Don't tell Plushy.
    Uh, I don't think Plushy is the paradigm when it comes to maximizing points from his jumping passes, lol.

    I also agree that the 1/2 loop looks awkward, and Jason Brown and Chan are the only ones that pull it off.

    It's especially awkward when the women do it... especially some of them who have such a break into it.

    Every time I hear Scott Hamilton yelling "And a 3S WITH NO SPEED!!!!"

  8. #38
    Rinkside
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    I find it baffling from a logistical point of view because if you notice, a lot of these skaters who have a triple+1Lo+3S also perform a 2A on its own. They could conceivably train a triple+2Lo+2Lo like Mao Asada or Kanako Murakami do and do the salchow on its own, which is presumably much easier, and lose a mere 0.2 points. (2A+1Lo = 3.8 points; 2Lo+2Lo = 3.6 points; the 3S and random triple remains the same in both situations). Furthermore, the positive GOE that you'd get would increase from a factor of 0.7 for the triple+1Lo+3S and 0.5 for the solo 2A to 0.7 for both the triple+2Lo+2Lo and solo 3S.

    Tl;dr - it's smarter to do 2 double loops than train a half loop-salchow combination.

  9. #39
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    I think people use the harder triple - 1lo - 3Sal rather then the XX - 2 lo - 2 lo because it is harder - and helps with PCS scores etc. I wish they wouldn't consider it a 3 jump combo though, since the 1/2 loop is really only there to reset the take off edge for the sal or flip.

    Anyone know why it's called a 1/2 loop when it does have a full revolution?

    I do wish CoP would change the way it scores combos and sequences. Each should get it's own value, not just the total of the two jumps. A 3lz - 3T combo and a solo 3T should not be worth the same as a 3T x 3T and solo 3Lz

  10. #40
    Tripping on the Podium sowcow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moxiejan View Post
    It was actually done frequently and quite beautifully by Jill Trenary; should be on YouTube.
    For example, check out this beautiful (1-foot)A+3S opening jump combination by Jill Trenary (from her entertaining "These Boots are made for Walkin'" program).

  11. #41
    Tripping on the Podium
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    That would not be 'tricky', that would be impossible. All listed jumps land on the outside edge. If a skater want to have the last jump in the combination Salchow or flip, for those jumps the skater needs to be on the inside edge; that's why the skater does the half loop in between. Half look is a full revolution jump which lands on the inside edge, just ready to add the Salchow or flip. If someone did just whatever jump+ normal single loop, then the skater would exit the single loop on the outside edge and therefore would not be able to have the last jump in the combination Salchow or Flip, they would only be able to do loop or toe loop.


    Re: 3T+2A instead of the more talked about 2A+3T, why would anyone want to do 3T+2A when 2A+3T brings more points? If you do 3T, you end up on back outside edge, so get forward to do the 2A would need a hop between those two jumps, which means that it would be a jump sequence and not jump combination and it would have value of only 80% of the jump value base. Whereas 2A+3T is a combination so it has the full value.
    IS it possible then to do a lutz if u land on a outside edge in jumps?? I don't understand these at all...

  12. #42
    Tripping on the Podium sowcow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ivy View Post
    Anyone know why it's called a 1/2 loop when it does have a full revolution?
    Maybe it was mistakenly named the "½ loop" when it was actually meant to be the "1-2 loop" (short for "take off from foot #1, and land on foot #2 loop"). HeHe

    My (real) guess is they simply named it the ½-loop for reasons of brevity (... because despite being descriptively correct, "loop landed on the opposite foot" or "opposite landing foot loop" are waaaaay to unwieldy to use as the jump name!?!)


    Quote Originally Posted by ivy View Post
    I do wish CoP would change the way it scores combos and sequences. Each should get it's own value, not just the total of the two jumps. A 3lz - 3T combo and a solo 3T should not be worth the same as a 3T x 3T and solo 3Lz
    I agree! Some sort of point value 'bonus' for jump combinations (like a 10% or 20% bonus); with full (100%) point values awarded for jumps done in sequence (instead of the 80% value currently awarded to jump sequences).

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmk View Post
    Surya Bonaly's 3toe-half loop-3sal combo always looked good.
    Yes! She soared on the 1/2 loop, unlike Maria B who literally looked like she tripped out of hers.

  14. #44
    ISU, stop promoting 2-foot skating!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam-Skwantch View Post
    I'm hoping its just me and I'm searching for words of encouragement here. I try to stay positive about skating and find the best in it. However I find the 1Lo in the middle of a jump combination to be very disruptive and kind of ugly(like a bird with a broken wing). To me it's similar to a beautiful Christmas tree but a few lights are burnt out and my OCD takes over until I eventually find replacement bulbs and tidy it up. Maybe I'm over analyzing here but maybe some positive insight/words of encouragement could help me not when I see it and instead
    There is no other way to perform a salchow or a flip in combination.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by supsu View Post
    IS it possible then to do a lutz if u land on a outside edge in jumps?? I don't understand these at all...

    Although you land on the outside edge, you land on the other leg than the one you need to be for Lutz. So if you really, really wanted to add Lutz in combination (without extra steps/hops or turns between the jumps) it would be possible in theory, if you suddenly did the Lutz rotating the other direction than the previous jump. In reality I have never seen anyone doing it even with single jumps. Usually skaters rotate only in one direction. But it can't be impossible. Some skaters can spin in both directions, so why they couldn't learn jump in both directions if it was somehow appreciated with points?

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