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Thread: Johnny Weir's court day for biting his husband Voronov

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by wingsofliberty View Post
    I kind of disagree, actually, but I think the biggest difference (aside from the coaching issue) is the field. Johnny was mega-talented and coasted by because no one challenged him for ages. He was told he was a genius and he acted like one. He reminds me of brilliant kids who coast by in grade school and find themselves in university with no idea how to study and no understanding of why they don't succeed and why no one is praising their abilities any longer. Those kids turn out to be very angry, often, and very unsure of themselves until they pull themselves together and realize that you can't just be smart--you have to work and improve yourself in order to get anywhere. Genius isn't a lifelong guarantee of success. It's a perk when you're young, but it can be a crutch when you get older. Johnny didn't take his training into his own hands. He didn't work at it. He didn't want to be better, stronger, faster, surer. He just wanted to win and be recognized as that kid who landed an axel after two hours of training. And that's tremendously different.

    The field these days wouldn't reward a 2003-2006 Johnny. Not even the junior field. Men are getting quads younger and younger, and COP has changed the way programs are structured by providing a serious benchmark to improvement--the more technique you can learn and execute, the more you will be rewarded. You can't coast anymore. You have to show serious improvement year after year. If you don't, someone else will. And you will be very quickly overtaken. Jason has been competing in the era of Patrick Chans and Yuzuru Hanyus. The field is overrun by young wunderkinds. His 2014 Nationals performance isn't enough, and he knows that. Ade knows that too. They wouldn't even have been enough had he won (which, of course, he didn't). But Johnny, I think, didn't realize that it frankly was not enough, and no one sat him down and told him. And so the 2003-2006 Johnny became the 2006-2010 Johnny, culminating in 6th at Vancouver and basically ending his career. I think Jason will be very different, and I think it's because he can see what a challenge the next quad will pose, and he can see, looking back, how the next crop of soon-to-be-seniors will shake it all up.

    Anyway! Sorry to derail this thread! And thanks for the warm welcome--these are my first posts on Goldenskate
    No, I'd rather talk about this than hear about domestic violence....and welcome to Golden Skate. You got the posting long part down.....so keep posting.

    Anyway, that's a really good point about Jason and his relative competition. Even though Jason was quite gifted artistically, he wasn't the only star in U.S. Figure Skating. Joshua Farris, for quite some time, had all the attention, namely because he had the more difficult content. When they were in Novice, Joshua had the 3-3 combination while Jason was URing on the triple loop. In juniors, Joshua was starting on the the 3A while Jason took 3.5 years to learn his.

    Jason has said many times the level of competition has forced him to find other ways to be competitive be it in his spins, his footwork or his flexibility. (And in fact, Joshua was the more flexible of the two when they were younger, which drove Jason to work on his flexibility with fervor and now Jason's the flexible one).

    And yes as a junior he had plenty of competition with Yan Han, Maxim Kovtun, even Boyang Jin beat him at the beginning of the 2011-2012 season.

  2. #32
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    Argh... drama indeed. When Johnny fell hard on a jump, he just quit his program and withdrew to the disapproval of Uncle Dick who just said you simply get up and continue.

    Too bad about the marriage.... argh... just frustrating to see.

    Mrs P, I feel kind of bad for Joshua. He was the one who pushed Jason to improve the most and they're also good friends. Joshua didn't do so well at Nationals and has fallen off the radar with the exception of some hardcore fans who follow the junior circuit. Joshua is a very refined, artistic skater.

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    Is it like a Vegas marriage? NJ legalized same-sex marriage less than a year ago.

  4. #34
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wingsofliberty View Post
    The field these days wouldn't reward a 2003-2006 Johnny.
    Eh, it's not about the field so much as it is the scoring system and the judging.

    Johnny had movement and musical interpretation that is better than anyone these days. He could do the best Triple Axels in the world. He could do difficult spin positions brilliantly. He had strong blade stroking. He even had some difficult jump entrances.

    The sport at the moment, though, is just demanding way too much technical content. There's not enough room to actually skate and perform.

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    Quote Originally Posted by usethis2 View Post
    Is it like a Vegas marriage? NJ legalized same-sex marriage less than a year ago.
    They married in NY. Not sure what getting divorced there would entail.

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    What a shock that he would make such a tacky comment about Ellen/Oprah, NOT (of course he deleted it after)..

    This is the same person who went on shopping sprees while begging his fans for "training money". You bet he will milk this for all that he can get.

    Edit: I'm reading the deluded comments from his fans in this thread and my mouth is agape. From the beginning Victor's past seemed suspicious, but that doesn't mean Johnny didn't bite or attack him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pointyourtoe View Post
    What a shock that he would make such a tacky comment about Ellen/Oprah, NOT (of course he deleted it after)..

    This is the same person who went on shopping sprees while begging his fans for "training money". You bet he will milk this for all that he can get.

    Edit: I'm reading the deluded comments from his fans in this thread and my mouth is agape. From the beginning Victor's past seemed suspicious, but that doesn't mean Johnny didn't bite or attack him.
    It doesn't. But making Victor the wronged angel is no better than the opposite.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    Eh, it's not about the field so much as it is the scoring system and the judging.

    Johnny had movement and musical interpretation that is better than anyone these days. He could do the best Triple Axels in the world. He could do difficult spin positions brilliantly. He had strong blade stroking. He even had some difficult jump entrances.

    The sport at the moment, though, is just demanding way too much technical content. There's not enough room to actually skate and perform.
    I mentioned this some time ago but I think it bears repeating. I saw Johnny last year in Dreams on Ice in Oakland and he was throwing triple axels like they were nothing! Everyone of them was landed cleanly with beautiful positions. I think it's pretty inane to say someone who was good under the 6.0 judging wouldn't bring their game up under the new system. And Johnny did bring his game up - unfortunately, I think his head got in the way!! I think Johnny is one of the most talented and most graceful men to ever take the ice. I think his problem was in leaving Priscilla Hill. Once he left her he started into the Russian stuff (for lack of a better term) skated to sometimes very obscure music, did weird things with his hair and wore outrageous costumes.....and Tarasova did nothing to make him more ice-friendly. I always wanted to see him in just all black with no bling or very little bling and skating to music that would help the audience connect to the program.

    I also remember watching a practice session in Portland before the Nats there. He was just skating around the rink lifting his feet, putting them down, hands on hips, etc. All of a sudden he did a 3-turn and literally everyone stopped to watch him. The smoothness, the grace, etc. was so pronounced and he was only skating backwards!!!

    I haven't read this whole entire thread, but are he and Voronov split up? That must have been some kind of a fight if biting was involved.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    Eh, it's not about the field so much as it is the scoring system and the judging.

    Johnny had movement and musical interpretation that is better than anyone these days. He could do the best Triple Axels in the world. He could do difficult spin positions brilliantly. He had strong blade stroking. He even had some difficult jump entrances.

    The sport at the moment, though, is just demanding way too much technical content. There's not enough room to actually skate and perform.
    I mentioned this some time ago but I think it bears repeating. I saw Johnny last year in Dreams on Ice in Oakland and he was throwing triple axels like they were nothing! Everyone of them was landed cleanly with beautiful positions. I think it's pretty inane to say someone who was good under the 6.0 judging wouldn't bring their game up under the new system. And Johnny did bring his game up - unfortunately, I think his head got in the way!! I think Johnny is one of the most talented and most graceful men to ever take the ice. I think his problem was in leaving Priscilla Hill. Once he left her he started into the Russian stuff (for lack of a better term) skated to sometimes very obscure music, did weird things with his hair and wore outrageous costumes.....and Tarasova did nothing to make him more ice-friendly. I always wanted to see him in just all black with no bling or very little bling and skating to music that would help the audience connect to the program.

    I also remember watching a practice session in Portland before the Nats there. He was just skating around the rink lifting his feet, putting them down, hands on hips, etc. All of a sudden he did a 3-turn and literally everyone stopped to watch him. The smoothness, the grace, etc. was so pronounced and he was only skating backwards!!!

    I haven't read this whole entire thread, but are he and Voronov split up? That must have been some kind of a fight if biting was involved. But I do know this - until you're actually one of of the parties in a marraige going bad you shouldn't judge either of them. I would bet they're both at fault.

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    It's always sad to see a couple break up. I hope for the best for both parties..

    I think it's both interesting and fair to compare Johnny and Jason. Johnny's artistry was light years ahead of the competition and would still challenge the youngsters under the COP today. That said, Jason has a charisma that better compares to Ryan Bradley. Johnny's programs were emotional and breathtaking. Whereas Jason's are captivating and enticing. It is unfortunate that Johnny never found the right team to give him the best chance at being competitive at the top, but like others have said, he could have done more on his part to make that happen. It's too bad we will never really know what could have been. With Jason it's a different story. He is young and has his entire career ahead of him with the right coaching team to give him the chances Johnny never really had. The difference between the two is that Johnny was sort of the red-headed step child and Jason is the prince (in the eyes of the USFSA).

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackPack View Post
    Mrs P, I feel kind of bad for Joshua. He was the one who pushed Jason to improve the most and they're also good friends. Joshua didn't do so well at Nationals and has fallen off the radar with the exception of some hardcore fans who follow the junior circuit. Joshua is a very refined, artistic skater.
    Don't worry, Joshua's not done forever. He just had a rough transition to Seniors. Schindler's List was an absolute masterpiece and I really liked his Libertango as well. His fifth at Skate Canada was pretty good (please note: he beat Jeremy Abbott there), the sprained ankle just came at all the wrong time and probably really affected his Nationals build-up (I think he was only back on the ice mid-December).

    Joshua and Jason have now shared the podium at every level of Nationals except Juvenile, which is a pretty amazing record, and they've also shared the podium at the Junior Grand Prix Final and twice at Junior Worlds. I can't wait til they share a podium at the GPF, 4CCs, even Worlds.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    Johnny had movement and musical interpretation that is better than anyone these days. He could do the best Triple Axels in the world.

    Best triple axel in the world. Best musical interpretation? Child, have a seat. Have several, and don't get up.

  13. #43
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    The best technique on the 3axel is Ilia Kulik's vertical, tight, fast revolutions, effortless landings, Uncle Dick said so

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlattFan View Post
    Best triple axel in the world. Best musical interpretation? Child, have a seat. Have several, and don't get up.

  15. #45
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    oh, c'mon. Johnny has always had a gorgeous 3A, and remember Uncle Dick saying he skated like liquid gold. OK, the guy doesn't like transitions too much. OK, so maybe he hasn't worked to his full potential, but haters, have you??????

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