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Thread: Imagining alternative partners in pairs/dance

  1. #106
    Custom Title BlackPack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan O View Post
    Perhaps BlackPack is referring to your comment about C&P hating each other. It sounds a bit extreme, and at odds with generally established history. According to most observers (and from what I could tell myself) Crone & Poirier had a very close friendship with each other up until their final season. I've never heard that they disliked each other - quite the contrary. Something went wrong towards the end, but it's unlikely they stayed together for 10 years and got as far as they did if they hated each other.

    As for Chock & Bates, they are not necessarily the undisputed #1 in the U.S. They usually only place a spot or so ahead of The Shibutanis, so they don't have the lock on their position the way D&W did. And if H&D keep improving, they can close the gap too. So I think American ice dance will have several competitive dance teams. You are right that the same situation exists in Canada. But we don't know how long W&P will stay yet, and I don't see any evidence that P&I are V&M clones considering that it's taken them until this month just to get to their first World Championship! Islam is 2 years older than Poirier and this is his 1st Worlds whereas this is Poirier's 5th. P&I are going to need to move a bit faster if they want to be the next V&M. V&M were already Olympic gold medalists by the time they were P&I's ages.
    Yes, you are very perceptive While I enjoy the majority of hyperinflation's posts which I find quirky and funny, there are times when his/her views are extreme. We've all been there and have voiced opinions that some people strongly disapprove of but are sometimes also supported by others.

    Based on the the vast knowledge and memory of the members here and their ability to list skating facts and trivia, it does appear that couples in the skating world do seem to reflect the mainstream world of marriage statistics? 50/50 divorce rate?

  2. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackPack View Post
    Yes, you are very perceptive While I enjoy the majority of hyperinflation's posts which I find quirky and funny, there are times when his/her views are extreme. We've all been there and have voiced opinions that some people strongly disapprove of but are sometimes also supported by others.

    Based on the the vast knowledge and memory of the members here and their ability to list skating facts and trivia, it does appear that couples in the skating world do seem to reflect the mainstream world of marriage statistics? 50/50 divorce rate?
    1. I'm amazed at how intense & controversial these debates about skating partnerships become! Afterall, we're only talking about a skating partnership between athletes, not international alliances between countries that will have an effect on the stability of world peace!

    2. There's certainly a high rate of dissolution in skating partnerships. Only a small number last multiple Olympic cycles or go on for over a decade the way Virtue/Moir and Davis/White have. Some only last for a few years. Some only last a few months! As you know, every year there are skating threads listing all the partnership changes. Crone/Poirier were together for 10 years, which is longer than many skating partnerships or marriages last. So although some people were unhappy when they parted, considering they were only 19 & 20, I think they handled it better than many adults twice their age!

    3. Partnership changes are more frequent today than in the past according to those who have been in the sport for several decades. Tracy Wilson said on t.v. a few years ago that when she was skating in the 1980's, it was much more common to begin and end your career with the same partner, but that it is much less common today. Almost all the current top 5 dance/pairs teams in Canada and the U.S. have had other partners except for V&M and D&W (and maybe The Shibs)? W&P, G&P, P&I, O&W, D&R, M-T&M, H&D, C&B, etc. all had other partners.

  3. #108
    Custom Title BlackPack's Avatar
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    Yes, Ryan O. Although I was only commenting on skating marriages - it seems like less than 50% survive. Skating partnerships are even harder I suppose. Voir and Marlie are definitely exceptions. Brother and sister teams last quite a while, although Sinead Kerr skated with 2 different brothers.

    I think the worst is still Natalia M's situation of unrequited love. Terrible. It's amazing they accomplished as much as they did. Other partnerships may be troubled because of issues of temperament, difference in goals, work ethic, inequality of skills, etc., but they're still not as troubling as skating with someone who doesn't love you back.

  4. #109
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    I think the worst is still Natalia M's situation of unrequited love. Terrible. It's amazing they accomplished as much as they did. Other partnerships may be troubled because of issues of temperament, difference in goals, work ethic, inequality of skills, etc., but they're still not as troubling as skating with someone who doesn't love you back.
    i've never heard about this, what was the dealio

    i love when figure skating turns into a soap opera

  5. #110
    Custom Title figuristka's Avatar
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    Vera Bazarov /Eric Radford both are a little miss matched with their present partners physically, though great pairs. Would look nice together.

  6. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackPack View Post
    I think the worst is still Natalia M's situation of unrequited love.
    Who is Natalia M?

  7. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by wolkenschloss View Post
    Who is Natalia M?
    Natalia Mishkutenok of Mishkutenok/Dimitriev, I guess.

  8. #113
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    Thanks bartlebooth! I thought they parted away because Natalia had health issues. About romantic relationship between her and Arthur D. I never heard. Their Liebestraum was so amazing.
    Apropo does anyone know about her life after Splitting?

  9. #114
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    You're welcome!
    Take a look at this old thread: http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sho...g-remarried%29
    So basically, she married, divorced, remarried and had a baby.

  10. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by hyperinflation View Post
    i've never heard about this, what was the dealio

    i love when figure skating turns into a soap opera
    They had quite a few fluff pieces regarding this scenario, even the commentators back then talked about Natalia's unrequited love. I'm rusty on my memory regarding this FYI so you may have to double-check everything I say. Natalia was in love with Artur. She didn't want to continue amateur skating after winning in 1992 and after sustaining a serious injury. Artur told a reporter he may want to continue competing with a new partner right in in front of her, and she said she didn't know about this and broke down. She struggled with her weight as well. Artur, being one of the strongest, if not the strongest, male pairs skater who ever lived, was still able to lift her and do all the same tricks. He lifted Peter Carruthers and spinned him around with no problem. Around the same time, he married a gymnast and had a son with her (now divorced). Double whammy. She suffered from nerves, weight gain, and depression. She couldn't land a double axel for a long time. But somehow they managed to come back in 1994 and challenge G&G, 3-6 split in Lillehammer. If I were in the same situation, I wouldn't be able to pull this off for sure. Later on, Natalia was married to Craig Shephard whom she dragged into competing professionally (the madness), and they were also divorced later. There rumors on the boards that people saw a fluff piece which I didn't see where Natalia had photos of her and Artur framed, but Artur's head was cut out and replaced with her then husband's head. She is now remarried, has a daughter, and coaches in Texas, I believe. It was also said that she and Artur still keep in touch and talk on the phone frequently.

  11. #116
    EZETTIE LATUASV IVAKMHA CaroLiza_fan's Avatar
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    There are a couple of direct partner swaps I would like to try out in Ice Dance… but just as an experiment to see what the resulting partnerships were like.

    The first direct swap is between our current Olympic Gold and Silver Medallists, Davis/White and Virtue/Moir. I have often wondered what Tessa and Charlie would be like together. And, by extension, Meryl and Scott.

    I know that the Americans and Canadians have totally different styles (which is probably why I always tend not to like D/W’s programmes, but do always tend to like V/M’s programmes). But it would be interesting to see what styles would emerge if you did a direct swap between the 2 couples.

    Would we see the emergence of a compromise style? Would both new couples end up using a compromise style, or just one of them? And if we do see both new couples using a compromise style, would the two compromise styles be the same?

    Would we see one, or both, of the new couples adopting the style brought along by one of the skaters? Which skater’s style will be the dominant one? And will this be an indication of who was the driving force in the previous partnerships?

    I accept that we will never see these swapped partnerships competing together in real life. Apart from the fact that it looks like both couples are retiring from competitive skating, it would take too long to sort out the different nationalities involved.

    But, I suppose they could try it in exhibitions if they really wanted. And, given that both couples are under the same coaches, then it might not be too difficult to arrange.


    My second direct swap might actually be possible.

    A lot of people have been suggesting recently that the Shibs need to be separated and given different partners. They are saying that (understandably) you can’t get the full couple-in-love impression from a sibling partnership. And, because of this, they are not scoring as much in the Interpretation as they might with different partners that they are not related to.

    Well, why not kill two birds with one stone and have a swap between 2 sets of siblings? Have a direct swap between the Shibutanis and the Reeds!

    Although the 2 couples involved are currently representing different countries, they are all Japanese-Americans. So, in theory, it might be easier for some of them to switch to the nationality that they are currently not representing. In practice, though, it might be a totally different matter…!

    Sure, if this swap was to take place, the two couples would not be allowed to compete for 2 years because of switching countries. But, it will take a while for the skaters involved to get their head around the fact that they are not skating with their sibling any more. So, this embargo might be a good thing. But, once they do get used to their new partners, we might get to see that chemistry that is currently lacking in both partnerships.

    And, of course, if the swapped partnerships don’t work, they can always go back to their sibling and pick off where they left off. Let’s face it, the skaters would know if it was working long before the embargo was lifted! So, they could reverse the swap and go back to competing straight away!

    CaroLiza_fan

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