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Thread: Which skaters have correct jumping technique?

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Melon View Post
    3Lz Yuna/Caro
    3F Caro/Yuna
    3Lo Caro/Mao
    3S Caro/Yuna
    3T Yuna

    I'll put Yuna for 3T since her 3T on her combination has a good height and flow. I can only imagine what her solo 3T would look like since, well, I can't even remember the last time she did a solo 3T, I know she had 3T+3T before, just can't recall. I've always wondered if Yuna was able to do a 4T
    3A Mao, as she's the only one currently doing it. Harding/Ito had bigger ones but Harding's was always funky in the air. As Mao has landed the 3A internationally for 9 seasons now, I put her above Harding.

    Yuna Kim's solo 3T

  2. #47
    Adiós Melon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jkun View Post
    I think for me, at least.. The best ladies lutz: Caro's 3Lz at the beginning of the Bolero at 2013 worlds was amazing. I think Yuna's 2013 Worlds Les mis, Flip is the best flip.
    I would also put Caro 1st too, but she telegraphs her jumps way too much

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarneAsada View Post
    LOL how did I miss this.......

  4. #49
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    As much as I absolutely adore Carolina and have always liked her jump technique its going to be a long time before I can forget BoP's 'ode to the single jump' post after the free skate. I can't even look at the protocols without laughing. Some got offended but I found it entertaining. To be able to get that score in her FS with jumps like that really speaks volumes about how good her technique really must be!

  5. #50
    🌸🐱❄🐱❄🐱🌸 jennyanydots's Avatar
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    Another vote for Caro. Great height, distance, flow. Perfect air position and extension on landings. All correct edges. On lutz and flip, she finishes the rotation way before landing. Only criticisms are telegraphing and inconsistency when she's nervous, tired or loses concentration.

    Yuna's jumps are also superb but she occasionally lips and of course doesn't do the loop anymore. To get nitpicky her landings aren't very well extended and her salchow is kind of swingy.

    Gracie's jumps may be huge but she doesn't get a lot of flow on the landings. On flip and lutz she jumps with her arms too much and it kind of takes away from the aesthetics of the jump. She also has a tendency to let her body get too far back in the air.

    As for flutzing, men do have the advantage of being stronger which helps in keeping the edge more stable plus they don't need to prerotate so much. I find that when I try too hard and muscle my lutz or don't have enough speed I always go over onto the inside edge. If I have adequate speed, a steady edge and controlled light pick on the take off I can keep it on an outside edge. Mule kicks and wobbly edges are not conductive to achieving a true lutz.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by jennyanydots View Post
    Another vote for Caro. Great height, distance, flow. Perfect air position and extension on landings. All correct edges. On lutz and flip, she finishes the rotation way before landing. Only criticisms are telegraphing and inconsistency when she's nervous, tired or loses concentration.
    To me, the landing position is what breaks the tie for me. The telegraphing doesn't bother me much because her technique is so good. I understand the long set-up isn't ideal under COP but if we're talking about the technique of the jump from take-off to landing, Caro is the best.

  7. #52
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    Definitely Carolina and Kim. Edge to Kim for less set up, but Kostner has wonderful speed and flow. Kim also tends to maintain her axis better than Kostner.

    As for the men, Hanyu has excellent technique and Chan (except for the axel) has it as well. Plushenko's jumping technique is also very solid (except for the occasional lutz or salchow). Yagudin and Stojko are examples of skaters in the past who also have good technique.

  8. #53
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    Chan's axel should take him out of this convo if a jump is that unreliable. Not a single clean axel from him in Sochi, not even the double.

    Yagudin and Plushenko really didn't have any weak jumps. If they ever missed a jump, it was usually just whatever was at the end of the program when they got tired/lost concentration. It usually changed from season to season as their jump layouts changed. Yagudin's 3flip was always a bit wonky in his 02 season cause it was at the end of his program but he never had issues with it in other seasons when it was earlier in the program. But then he would have issues with his salchow when it was at the end of his Broken Arrow LP.

    Kulik had amazing jump technique but was just very inconsistent.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by moviechick View Post
    Chan's axel should take him out of this convo if a jump is that unreliable.
    Should Hanyu's 4S take him out of the convo since his 4S is unreliable? And with his lip, does that take him out of it as well?

    How about Kostner's inconsistencies on her flip or salchow?

    I think we should consider not consistency but actual technique when the jump is properly executed. Chan has landed many axels this season (he was 5/8 or something like that prior to Sochi), but even his successful axels were poor technique compared to somebody like Hanyu.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by gmyers View Post
    Julia was not called for Flutz in sp. ice is slippery not only in falls but effects the edges if you are like Julia and wobble and while she can do clean lutz it's unstable so she was called Flutz only in lp and not sp because she was more stable in sp.

    Small is only really bad if it makes for constant and damaging urs. Julia is small and may have small jumps but she does not ur so her jumps aren't so small that they aren't rotated in the air! A lot of small girls jump small and don't rotate in the air. I beleieve Julia will grow and still know how to get lift to rotate in the air. If she didn't really know how to jump she would be underrotating her small jumps now. But her toe loop jump is a big jump. It's her biggest! All other jumps are smaller than her toe loop but totally rotated in the air. Her double axel needs work and that's obvious because it could start failing bad.
    She's been getting a bunch of << and < calls as of late. I'm aware that she can skate without < calls, but she's not devoid of them. A skater like Kim, however, usually rotates her jumps fully. The probably with Julia is she doesn't vault herself in her jumps... she relies on rotation, and that's poor technique, even if the jump is fully rotated. It's like saying Miyahara has good technique so her minimal height on her jumps is okay.

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Should Hanyu's 4S take him out of the convo since his 4S is unreliable? And with his lip, does that take him out of it as well?
    The 4S is still not a totally standard jump right now. Hanyu is doing it to challenge himself and cause he can get the points. The 3A has been a mainstay in men's FS since the 80s though and a lack of consistency on that jump usually points to a serious technical problem.

    Hanyu has a great 4T and 3A, but he does slip up on his lesser jumps so I wouldn't give him an A+ just yet either.

  12. #57
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    I also love Carolina's jumps when she lands them. However, I can never consider her a jump master with correct technique. Consistency is a big part of it. As far as I see, she has not mastered the technique. If your Ferrari breaks down every other month, would you consider it a good car? You still may want to keep it because it is beautiful but something must be wrong if it breaks down that often.

  13. #58
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    Like I said, this thread is about technique, not consistency.

    Ito, for example, has poor technique with her leg wrap, but good consistency. Lipnitskaia gets minimal height, but has solid consistency.

    i.e. just because a skater is consistently landing their jumps doesn't mean they have ideal technique. Just like somebody with excellent technique doesn't necessarily always land their jumps.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Symmetry View Post
    I also love Carolina's jumps when she lands them. However, I can never consider her a jump master with correct technique. Consistency is a big part of it. As far as I see, she has not mastered the technique. If your Ferrari breaks down every other month, would you consider it a good car? You still may want to keep it because it is beautiful but something must be wrong if it breaks down that often.
    I kind of agree but I will say that there's a difference between mental inconsistency and inconsistency based on poor technique. With Carolina, I think it's more mental. On the other hand, Chan and Lambiel's 3A issues a technical.

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Like I said, this thread is about technique, not consistency.

    Ito, for example, has poor technique with her leg wrap, but good consistency. Lipnitskaia gets minimal height, but has solid consistency.

    i.e. just because a skater is consistently landing their jumps doesn't mean they have ideal technique. Just like somebody with excellent technique doesn't necessarily always land their jumps.
    My point is Carolina must have good technique in her but has not mastered it. If anyone has masted poor technique, she/he will consistently jump in poor quality. That's why I cannot see Carolina being an exemplary skater with correct technique b/c it is still half-filled potential.

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