It can go both ways. Joubert was definitely getting dumped by the end. (I understand he's out of medal contention anyway, but the scores were still too low). Kostner was helped at Worlds, but she was actually more competitive at the end of her run than in the beginning, so the judges didn't treat her as an oldie. (And I agree with her bronze medal despite the horrific free skate. Her short program was sublime)
And I acknowledged that Dai's jumps were failing him by 2014 (and sixth was the best he could do in Sochi). The question was why he was getting the low PCS back in 2012.
Looks like Japanese skaters took over Pchan. Is JSF behind this?
I think Dai was underscored in 2012, but for exactly which reason I don't know. May be it's true that the judges simple did not like his long program, or his jumps.
Yeah, but he did land all his jumps on that day, including a quad, if I recall? So that shouldn't have been an issue for that LP (2012 WC). They should mark what is there on the day, not reputation. That is what I cannot get my head around in this sport and what I find most frustrating, I think.
Regarding Dai, as terrible as it sounds, I hope you're right--that the judges just genuinely didn't like his program. I don't agree with them, but at least that means the judging was honest. And yes, his jumps were failing him by Sochi (and his quads weren't consistent even when he was at his best), but his jumps were solid in 2012 Worlds. I certainly see no reason to put him behind Hanyu in the free.
EDIT: TheGrandSophy beat me to it regarding Dai's jumps. I don't think Dai's finish in 2012 was necessarily due to reputation regarding his jump consistency, especially since we're talking about PCS. I think it was a combination of Yuzuru's breakout stealing the thunder (even if his skate wasn't perfect at all) and the judges nitpicking on Dai and being super lenient on Chan.
Just to steer the topic back to Patrick, if he comes back, what do you think would be a good potential jump layout for him? Assuming he wants to win, and not just medal (the latter should be a piece of cake assuming his skills don't rust after the break). Right now, I think it'll be an uphill battle to beat a clean Hanyu (of course, clean Hanyu rarely happens, but clean Patrick isn't a mainstay either).
Hard to stay. The main thing I think is that time for Hanyu is counting on + and for Chan on - at this point. If Hanyu will skate his current LP layout up to his best quality on all jumps he can make nearly 200 points in FS, and it is still to come and I think it will come sooner or later.
Can Chan progress still more technically ? Hard to say. I have feeling that this axels are just getting worse and worse for him.
If Hanyu will finally get consistent 4S it can be game over for others and if somewhere in future he will put 2nd quad in SP... huh.
But it would be more interesting in field with him if he would skate on top lvl, so maybe we could get some nice battles with him and Hanyu and Fernandez
^Yeah, pretty much agree with the two of you. I think it'll be difficult for Chan to increase his tech content at his point. And the one clean triple axel he did at the Olympics? That was in Vancouver when he was quadless.
If he comes back (unlikely, imo), I think he should concentrate on skating his current tech content squeaky clean. Hanyu's certainly capable of opening the door with mistakes. But Chan will need to fix that axel ASAP and accept that it'll be difficult to dominate the way he did before without taking advantage of others' mistakes. (Note: I am not saying he's a has-been. He's a shoe-in for a medal unless he bombs. He'll just have difficulty winning gold over Hanyu and Fernandez if they skate clean, and the problem is intensified by the fact that Chan isn't always clean himself.).
If he returned he should stick with his jump layout. After all, it still holds the world record score.
If Hanyu starts getting consistency on his 4S then Chan might be in trouble but really he should just continue doing what he is comfortable with and hope Hanyu doesn't deliver a clean competition (which Hanyu has yet to do anyways).
Yeah, but Chan needs to fix his own consistency. Getting a world record score is one thing. It's quite another to deliver a comparable (or close) skate on a regular basis. I feel like he needs to fix the triple axel, but at the same time I feel like it's a lost cause.
I know you love Chan, but he needs to be able to capitalize on Hanyu's mistakes going forward. He failed to do that in Sochi, on the Olympic stage, even with his own Olympic experience and how much room Hanyu left him.