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Thread: Plushenko:" Kovtun is a good average skater "

  1. #241
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    @LRK

    re: photo

  2. #242
    Love popcorn, hate horrendous costumes. Meoima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    It is beyond desperate Plushenko hateorade to think that even if Plushenko were the veangeful and vindicative type (which as proven he clearly isnt), he would even care that much about losing one small event as a 31 year old which he skated horribly at to lose. CSG seem to have formed a fantasy Kovtun beat a 23 yer old Plushenko for the Olympic Gold.
    I am curious, if they skated the same program, could Kovtun beat a 19 year old Plushenko? Just assume that they are same age in my fantasy.

  3. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meoima View Post
    I am curious, if they skated the same program, could Kovtun beat a 19 year old Plushenko? Just assume that they are same age in my fantasy.
    A 19 year old Plushenko would never skate poorly enough to lose to Kovtun. Heck I am not sure if Kovtun could have ever beaten even a 16 year old Plushenko, although maybe on a really off day (even then clean to clean Plushy wins easily, and Plushy at 16 was already more consistent and a better competitor than Kovtun is now at 18).

    This is a glimpse of what Plushenko at only 15 was capable of btw:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AXhDgkKDfw
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tG2xni-N470

    Had Russia had a 3rd spot for the Olympics or Yagudin WD earlier with his flu he would have likely won silver at the Olympics behind Kulik that year, at only 15.

  4. #244
    Love popcorn, hate horrendous costumes. Meoima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    A 19 year old Plushenko would never skate poorly enough to lose to Kovtun. Heck I am not sure if Kovtun could have ever beaten even a 16 year old Plushenko, although maybe on a really off day (even then clean to clean Plushy wins easily, and Plushy at 16 was already more consistent and a better competitor than Kovtun is now at 18).
    I know, just saying so, but since CSG said age comparison is stupid. I respect Tarasova for all of her achievements, but admit it, her best student so far is Yagudin, whose foundation was built by his former coach, Mishin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Meoima View Post
    I know, just saying so, but since CSG said age comparison is stupid. I respect Tarasova for all of her achievements, but admit it, her best student so far is Yagudin, whose foundation was built by his former coach, Mishin.
    Mishin is unquestionably the best jump coach in the world. Yagudin, Plushenko, Urmanov, all mastered their renowned jump technique under Mishin. Choreography and the whole package, not as much. Urmanov was considered such an artistic skater only since he had such natural line and grace, not because of Mishin's choreography. So for the artistic side of hig skating to fully blossom it was very important for Yagudin to go to Tarasova. Especialy as he doesnt have the natural charisma or dancy quality on ice that Plushenko does to carry off Mishin's bad choreography as effectively.

    As great as Plushenko is, I do wonder how much better he could have been working with someone who could have given him some real choreography.

  6. #246
    Love popcorn, hate horrendous costumes. Meoima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    So for the artistic side of hig skating to fully blossom it was very important for Yagudin to go to Tarasova. Especialy as he doesnt have the natural charisma or dancy quality on ice that Plushenko does to carry off Mishin's bad choreography as effectively.
    I know. I am just thinking, if Yagudin didn't have the foundation that Mishin had packaged for him in the first place, or just had half of it, no matter how much effort Tarasova put in him, he could he have had such achievement?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Meoima View Post
    I know. I am just thinking, if Yagudin didn't have the foundation that Mishin had packaged for him in the first place, or just had half of it, no matter how much effort Tarasova put in him, he could he have had such achievement?
    You are right. Mishin deserves alot of credit, even though I undestand why Yagudin wouldnt want to give it to him (and Mishin was trying to rain in on the parade some in SLC which wasnt really appropriate anyway). However grudingly I am sure Yagudin knows deep down it was the combined effort of Mishin and Tarasova that made him the champion he became.

    Tarasova meanwhile is the master of taking over students others developed, winning with them and taking all the glory. Did it with Klimova & Ponomarenko who were coached by Dubova their whole careers, and only by Tarasova in their last amateur season for the Olympics (though she kept working with them as pros). Did it with Gritschuk & Platov who had been brought up by Dubova and then Linichuk. Did it with Kulik. Then Yagudin. Although atleast with Yagudin she worked with him the entire quad, and during his entire period of dominance, so of all her students she probably molded him the most.

  8. #248
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LRK View Post
    Plushy and Menshov :

    http://evgeni-plushenko.com/forum/vi...art=100#p76958

    (It's a cute photo, okay? What other reason do I need to post it? )
    No further reason is required

    Quote Originally Posted by Meoima View Post
    I respect Tarasova for all of her achievements, but admit it, her best student so far is Yagudin, whose foundation was built by his former coach, Mishin.
    Tarasova is not a developmental coach. Skaters went (and still go) to her for the some reasons skaters now go to to Brian Orser: artistic polish, support, and political reasons. Yagudin got a solid foundation from Mishin, as did Hanyu from Nanami Abe, but there was still room for improvement on that foundation.

  9. #249
    Custom Title plushyfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post

    Had Russia had a 3rd spot for the Olympics or Yagudin WD earlier with his flu he would have likely won silver at the Olympics behind Kulik that year, at only 15.
    The Russian Fed wanted to send Plushenko to Nagano. Mishin said Yagudin is the next skater on the list..

  10. #250
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    Quote Originally Posted by LRK View Post
    Funny that no one started a NEWS! thread about this... ? I wonder why that was... ? Or, in fact, any POSITIVE comment that Plushy ever made - and there are lots of them - lots. Any thoughts on why that is... ? No? Oh, well then.
    This also deserves a thread...what do you think volk?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqKmVumc0b4 Plushy gives advices to Yuzuru.

    ""Dear, Yuzuru, today, you're the champion, more over your are the top athlet in the world. Not only in Olympic Sochi, from now on, I want you to take more medal. Your talent has been confirmed, you have what others dont. But, the most important thing is your health, it's my wish. NOW I'M YOUR FAN. Thank you."

    Plushy on Yagudin:

    "You know, I had only one real "enemy" on ice, but not off ice, my ex-rival and an oustanding athlete Alexei Yagudin. By the way, yesterday it was his birthday, so I want to use the moment and congratulate him: "Lyosha, happy bithday!"

  11. #251
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    Quote Originally Posted by plushyfan View Post

    ""Dear, Yuzuru, today, you're the champion, more over your are the top athlet in the world. Not only in Olympic Sochi, from now on, I want you to take more medal. Your talent has been confirmed, you have what others dont. But, the most important thing is your health, it's my wish. NOW I'M YOUR FAN. Thank you."
    2 living legends for sure

  12. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by plushyfan View Post
    This also deserves a thread...what do you think volk?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqKmVumc0b4 Plushy gives advices to Yuzuru.

    ""Dear, Yuzuru, today, you're the champion, more over your are the top athlet in the world. Not only in Olympic Sochi, from now on, I want you to take more medal. Your talent has been confirmed, you have what others dont. But, the most important thing is your health, it's my wish. NOW I'M YOUR FAN. Thank you."
    Very nice! Yuzu admires Plushenko a lot so I'm sure it means a lot for him that such a great champion sent him this message.
    But of course, we tend to focus on the negative parts.

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