Skaters who revolutionized/made an impact in Figure Skating | Page 4 | Golden Skate

Skaters who revolutionized/made an impact in Figure Skating

anyanka

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 8, 2011
Tonya Harding & Nicole Bobeck... bad girls? yes. Impactful? absolutely. why? 3 axel and spiral.

Harding certainly helped raised media attention in the sport to a fever pitch. I would argue that Ito had a bigger impact re: 3A, although both Tonya's and Nicole's were also fantastic.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
I don't think Davis and White or Hanyu revolutionalized skating - in fact Chan or Dai really started the complete skater or even Lambiel or Buttle. Hanyu was a follower of Chan - technical and skating skills and his skills aren't of the magnificient level of Lambiel, Buttle or chan who probably had the best skating skills and transitions for men. G and G had it all so maybe they "revolutionized skating. Gary Beacom did some amazing tricks never seen. Hydroblading by Bourne and Kraatz. I think D and W did no more for skating than V and M. Neither team really had the magic of Torvill and Dean or Klimova and Pomarenko. Shen and /zhou maybe revolutionized skating for China but not world - the Russians were doing big lifts and throws already. Duhamel and radford really pushing the envelope for big individual jumps in pairs. I agree Ito pushed the jumps and then maybe ugly and criticized as they would be under COP Surya Bonaly. Baiul maybe was the start of the youth movement - Hughes, Lipinski, Lipnskaya, Sotnikova, Gold, Nagasu, Mao, Radinova, Tuk. Brian Orser really pushed the technical elements then fire was fueled by Boitano.
 

WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
@WeakAnkles
I understand what you're saying. Attempts at recreating magic with only the base elements often results in tediousness. I may not be an expert in ice dance, but it's the same in any art or performance. Just look at novels, movies, TV, storytelling in general...

I meant the question more like--even if I/K were competing under 6.0, wouldn't their routines be equally tedious to you? And they'll probably win more, which will create more drama! skates, which will probably make ice dance even more annoying for you. :) It seems like you simply prefer COP ice dance over 6.0 ice dance. (Apologies if I'm reading you wrong though). Of course, I'm one of those people who doesn't think the best COP-points-getter is necessary the best skate; if that were true, we wouldn't have tweaks to the judging system all the time.

I'm with CSG--I think COP has done wonders for ice dancing, much more so than for any other discipline. Of course it has drawbacks--any judging system will. But the benefits, for me at least, have far outweighed the problems. And a new judging system is going to make you look at skating from a new perspective. Under 6.0, because there were single scores for the athletic (technical) and the artistic, I tended to look at programs as whole entities. But because COP looks at every single component and scores it individually, I now look at things like how difficult and how well-performed each individual component is. And that's when I noticed that, under all of I/K's dramatic balletic flourishes, the tech content was pretty watered-down compared to the other top teams. I think gkelly said it: he takes her hand and she turns, she takes his hand and he turns. Lather. Rinse. Repeat.

Ziggy, who really knows his stuff about ID, also said something I found very interesting: that you'll find more interesting programs from lower ranked teams because they are trying to make an impression on the judges. And I think that's true. Look at Hurtado and Diaz, for instance, or Gilles and Poirier. Two of the best FDs last year. So I agree that the best-COP-point-generating programs aren't always necessarily the best. But COP has made Ice Dancing at least, much more interesting and, for all the judging controversies, much more fair than it ever was under 6.0, where you pretty much knew where every couple would place before their blades hit the ice.

But I think for me ALL of figure skating is a sport first. It may be as artsy-fartsy as all get out, but it is still primarily a sport. And I've seen too many teams over the years that try to cover their athletic shortcomings with big dollops of Drama (yes Fusar-Poli and Margaglio, I'm looking at you). And the periods where this is rewarded by the judges tend to be the periods where I simply am not as engaged or interested as a fan. But YMMV, of course.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
WEll I guess Chan started the push for tech excellency and skating skills and Hanyu took it to the next step - but that is debatable I think we can say Hanyu better technicain but skating skill wise Chan wold or should win on most days. I sense Sky fly for some reason the posts tend to put down Canadian skaters = that is just an observatin as skyfly tend sto like Hanyu over Chan and Davis and White over v and m and has had several negative posts about Osmond. I am not say skyflyy is anticanadian but that is just an observation of skyflys prefernces. And we should respect they are sky fly's preferences:) still I see spikydurian's perspective too and I tend to agree more but really I think a lot of these posts are because we miss competitive skating lol. What's next whose hairstyle we like best. Which skater has the cutest pet?
 

el henry

Go have some cake. And come back with jollity.
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Country
United-States
I don't want to get into an argument over specific choices, but this thread is a great way to think of skaters, and I like that you go back practically to the start of competitive skating rather than concentrating just on the recent past. Definitely Toller Cranston and Janet Lynn need to be on this list, because though they never won an international gold medal, they helped to usher in the era of more expressive skating. Cranston shares that distinction with his almost exact contemporary, John Curry, and Lynn probably can be thought of in conjunction with Peggy Fleming.

For the ice dancers, I'll leave it to better informed people (or just more emphatic people!) to argue, except to say that Torvill and Dean most assuredly do belong on this list.

Absolutely right to those who have mentioned these three. Many of the skaters argued about here simply have not been skating long enough to "revolutionize the sport". That needs the long view.

Janet Lynn: how many of you have watched skaters tracing figure eights on the rink as part of Olympic competition? You haven't? I have, and you have Janet Lynn to thank for the fact that you do not. *That* is revolutionary, not a step sequence or a spin or a jump. Changing the way we watch figure skating.

Toller Cranston: every male figure skater who has skated since owes a debt to Cranston. Either they incorporated (or tried) artistry and wonder and innovation into their skating, or, as a backlash, they tried athleticism. Cranston was a skater who made you watch, and not because he was going to do a jump with a bunch of letters and initials. He was compelling.

Torvill and Dean: Also compelling. They tried a new concept, and they succeeded. Almost entirely due to Torvill and Dean, ice dancing became respected.

There is no way to say that about skaters who are still skating. They may revolutionize; they may not, time will tell. But if you don't know about Lynn, Cranston or Torvill and Dean, I am afraid to say you probably don't know enough to say.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Weakankles/skaterboy, that's a perfect assessment. Buttle without a quad started a push for all around skating and utilizing the system that way. Then Chan with his quads did the same and blew everyone out of the water and dominated. And now Hanyu has followed suit and is in the process of taking it to a new level. I'd say Fernandez is also to be commended for his 3 quad skates that still sell a program and incorporate intricate content and character, while still being technically ambitious.
 

WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
Absolutely right to those who have mentioned these three. Many of the skaters argued about here simply have not been skating long enough to "revolutionize the sport". That needs the long view.

Janet Lynn: how many of you have watched skaters tracing figure eights on the rink as part of Olympic competition? You haven't? I have, and you have Janet Lynn to thank for the fact that you do not. *That* is revolutionary, not a step sequence or a spin or a jump. Changing the way we watch figure skating.

Toller Cranston: every male figure skater who has skated since owes a debt to Cranston. Either they incorporated (or tried) artistry and wonder and innovation into their skating, or, as a backlash, they tried athleticism. Cranston was a skater who made you watch, and not because he was going to do a jump with a bunch of letters and initials. He was compelling.

Torvill and Dean: Also compelling. They tried a new concept, and they succeeded. Almost entirely due to Torvill and Dean, ice dancing became respected.

There is no way to say that about skaters who are still skating. They may revolutionize; they may not, time will tell. But if you don't know about Lynn, Cranston or Torvill and Dean, I am afraid to say you probably don't know enough to say.

:clap:

I was thinking of pairs and frankly, there really hasn't been any team that could be called revolutionary since the Protopopovs. I mention them because you didn't cover Pairs. But otherwise, spot on.
 

pointyourtoe

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 11, 2013
Michelle Kwan is one of the first Asian-American female athletes to be truly embraced by the American public (in a time when Asian-American media and cultural representation was far worse than it is today, and it's still severely lacking), and remains one of the most iconic female minority athletes in US history..she carried the torch that was passed on to her from Kristi Yamaguchi, and to a lesser extent, Tiffany Chin.
Ultimately, she became beloved by the skating community and general public in a way that her 2 predecessors never had been (although I think she definitely benefited from the inroads they made).

It speaks volumes that a woman of minority descent became the face of her sport (and during its golden age), especially when skating has had a distinguished legacy in the US going back almost a century.
 

Sabrina

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
I don't know, but I loved Anisina/Peizerat for wonderful innovations and Philipe Candeloro for bringing theatre on ice...They may not be the best but, I really miss them.
 

Kwanford Wife

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 29, 2004

touché, pussycat

Michelle Kwan is one of the first Asian-American female athletes to be truly embraced by the American public (in a time when Asian-American media and cultural representation was far worse than it is today, and it's still severely lacking), and remains one of the most iconic female minority athletes in US history..she carried the torch that was passed on to her from Kristi Yamaguchi, and to a lesser extent, Tiffany Chin.
Ultimately, she became beloved by the skating community and general public in a way that her 2 predecessors never had been (although I think she definitely benefited from the inroads they made).

It speaks volumes that a woman of minority descent became the face of her sport (and during its golden age), especially when skating has had a distinguished legacy in the US going back almost a century.

I would agree with this and then add Debbie Thomas to the conversation. As a 12 year old, I remember when my coach told my mom that my body had outgrown the sport and that body type was why we'd never have a black female skating champion. Three years later, Debbie Thomas hit the scene and for this black girl that was way impactful... I know she went on to having a great life outside of skating, but I always think what could've been if she'd stayed around another quad...
 

pharmtech1

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 20, 2012
Absolutely right to those who have mentioned these three. Many of the skaters argued about here simply have not been skating long enough to "revolutionize the sport". That needs the long view.

Janet Lynn: how many of you have watched skaters tracing figure eights on the rink as part of Olympic competition? You haven't? I have, and you have Janet Lynn to thank for the fact that you do not. *That* is revolutionary, not a step sequence or a spin or a jump. Changing the way we watch figure skating.

Toller Cranston: every male figure skater who has skated since owes a debt to Cranston. Either they incorporated (or tried) artistry and wonder and innovation into their skating, or, as a backlash, they tried athleticism. Cranston was a skater who made you watch, and not because he was going to do a jump with a bunch of letters and initials. He was compelling.

Torvill and Dean: Also compelling. They tried a new concept, and they succeeded. Almost entirely due to Torvill and Dean, ice dancing became respected.

There is no way to say that about skaters who are still skating. They may revolutionize; they may not, time will tell. But if you don't know about Lynn, Cranston or Torvill and Dean, I am afraid to say you probably don't know enough to say.
Well said and add Tai and Randy !
 

blue_idealist

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 25, 2006
That's right! She was the first skater ever to pose nude! And that is a HUGE historical breakthrough! lol
Nobody did it before and very very few after. Tanja Szewczenko was one of them. Actually she might be the only one...

I read in a skating book that Maria Butyrskaya was in Playboy, although I don't recall if she was nude. She may not have been since I don't think they explicitly said she was, or I'd probably remember.
 

WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
I am sad Virtue & Moir are gone as no matter how much of a douche Scott Moir is they are one of the most beautiful and breathtaking teams ever, and I will miss them terribly. However I am thrilled with Davis & White's retirement. They are great and probably deserved their titles (were visibly overmarked compared to V&M at times the last 2 years but am not interested in getting into that) but they too were taking ice dance in a new direciton and not a good one IMO. They were turning it into an acrobatic circus act, more like a mini pairs routine. They were also taking away it from finesse and polish, which were never apparent in their dancing. I hope their style of dancing really does not have much or any influence on others in the years to come.

Yadda yadda yadda. I've heard this "but they're practically PAIR SKATERS!" nonsense before. I just laugh. The rules for lifts in ID are so strict that about the closest you'll get to a pairs lift is Marlie's opening lift entrance in the LD. Hardly the same as a throw triple sal or side by side triple lutzes or a reverse lasso lift. Don't remember any death spirals either. But oooh, Charlie swung Meryl up to his shoulder. Get that rule book out. Pfft. Such nonsense.

Finesse and polish? If anything Marlie was so polished you could accuse them of lacking spontaneity. That's a more valid argument in my book. But YMMV and all that.

And yes, Marlie's influence can already been seen--and not just in ice dancing. Which pair did Phantom this year--and wore costumes that were such close copies of Marlie's from Vancouver their costume designer should sue? And I definitely saw a marked Marlie influence in the FD by Yanovskaya & Mozgov. Go and see it again yourself and tell me they haven't watched Marlie's programs and gone through them with a fine tooth comb.

Both Marlie AND Voir upped the technical difficulty for ice dancing. And in the process they've made it something it very very rarely was before: interesting to the general public. Don't recall anyone saying either of their programs were the punch line to the inevitable "but how is ice dancing a sport" criticism. They're not innovators in the same sense as Torvill & Dean, but influential? You betcha.
 

hurrah

Medalist
Joined
Aug 8, 2009
In Japan, it would be Midori Ito because she got alot of media attention for her jumps. Shizuka also got a great deal of attention but really, only after she won OGM.

Before Shizu won the gold medal, Mao was already the darling of Japan and she has done so much for Japanese figure skating. She was almost single-handedly the reason for Chukyo University building two ice skating rinks for athletes to practice on. Mao's star power has provided the majority of the financing of Japanese skating fed for the past 10 years or so. And it's because of Mao that skating is so popular in Japan as a spectator sports right now.

I somehow think that Mao has also had a huge impact on the formation of CoP which seemed to target all her weak points so that she really had to work hard to improve them. If the 6.0 era had continued, she would likely have been unbeatable.
 

Franklin99

Medalist
Joined
Nov 11, 2013
Harding wasnt really impactful for her 3axel as Ito was doing it years earlier and did about 10 times as many. Harding was mostly seen splatting on her 3axel in big competitions, which she did 9 times out of 10 she tried it, and she lost countless medals by it while winning very few because of it, so she was more of a precautionary tale if anything (in more ways than one it turned out). No American since has landed a real 3axel (Meissner's one was a joke and shouldnt have even been ratified) so I wouldnt say she had any impact on American ladies by her 3axel either.

And yet mao's beautiful 3axel is overly scrutinized. And Harding had one of the most ugliest and choppiest 3axel ever. Her jumps were never on an axel, but straight up and down while she's up in the air. Case in point: http://youtu.be/29SMYaEwGyM
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
To be honest, it's pretty lame and rude to call any female skater trying quads and triple axels "a joke". They are attempting elements that men have difficulty mastering and they should be lauded for pushing the technical envelope, not ridiculed for it or being unable to measure up to the great Ito.

Harding was no sweetheart and was very unrefined but her lutzes were huge and her axel was a feat of athleticism that no American woman has even come close to achieving, even Meissner.
 
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