Page 2 of 6 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 86

Thread: ISU Communication 1861: Updated Rules for Singles and Pairs Skating

  1. #16
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Istanbul
    Posts
    1,028
    Quote Originally Posted by CarneAsada View Post
    I hope she tries 4Lz! That way, if she gets 'e' (which of course she will) and < (which is not guaranteed), she will still have 6.8 BV, 0.8 more than a 3Lz! I can just see the posts now... "Yes 4Lz is very impressive, but a 4Lz< 'e' is not impressive and is just a cheating way to make up for lack of 3Lz! Dirty cheating Russian money, can you please stop to tell a lie A?"
    4T is quad toe loop which have 10.3 base value (with a fall 7.3 points) and even 7,2 base value with a underrotation. Better than 4,2 wrong edge lutz.

  2. #17
    Custard Title
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,023
    Quote Originally Posted by elif View Post
    4T is quad toe loop which have 10.3 base value (with a fall 7.3) and even 7,2 base value with a underrotation. Better than 4,2 wrong edge lutz.
    It's ok, she might still be able to do her 3Lz with no edge calls at Cup of Russia.

    Quote Originally Posted by jkun View Post
    I think Adelina's flutz.. I mean it looks like she tries a little to get the correct edge. Also she does difficult transitions in front of the lutz so I guess it's a little less harsh. Mao's flutz.. she's not even trying to get the correct edge, it is very severe inside edge. I think it is furthered by her flip technique which also utilizes and almost extreme inside edge (to the point where it's not really aesthetically pleasing).
    She doesn't have difficult transitions in front of the Lutz any more than Mao does. Her edge is not as severe as Mao's but it's worse than Lipnitskaya's, enough for an 'e' probably.

  3. #18
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    3,965
    Quote Originally Posted by CarneAsada View Post
    I hope she tries 4Lz! That way, if she gets 'e' (which of course she will) and < (which is not guaranteed),"
    Oh, I think at least < and more likely << would be guaranteed on any attempt at 4Lz, especially by a woman. Not even men have been able to rotate that jump.

  4. #19
    Missing D&G GF2445's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    1,865
    Another big change! They are honing in on those who do not meet the jumping requirements. In junior and senior levels, jumps that are less that 1.5 are not counted. Jumps that do not meet the requirement of the short program or free program in terms of number of revolutions will nit get counted. If a skater does a double double combo, the jump with the lesser value is not counted. If you dont deliver your jumps, you pay!

  5. #20
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    3,801
    Quote Originally Posted by jkun View Post
    I think Adelina's flutz.. I mean it looks like she tries a little to get the correct edge.
    I agree. Adelina flutzes but she usually does roll over on the inside edge until right before take-off. Mao is on a deeper inside edge much earlier.

  6. #21
    Rinkside
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    8
    I understand the flutz and lip regulations. But not counting elements that doesn't satisfy the SP requirements?! That is CRAZY. If this comes into action, even quad-single or triple-single would get zero mark. Then who would risk a quad-triple? Fewer and fewer skater would attempt the 3-3, because if you screw up one jump than you can just say goodbye to your podium. I'm really smelling regression.

  7. #22
    Custard Title
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,023
    Quote Originally Posted by DDepardieu View Post
    I understand the flutz and lip regulations. But not counting elements that doesn't satisfy the SP requirements?! That is CRAZY. If this comes into action, even quad-single or triple-single would get zero mark. Then who would risk a quad-triple? Fewer and fewer skater would attempt the 3-3, because if you screw up one jump than you can just say goodbye to your podium. I'm really smelling regression.
    That's something else I don't get. There's still the mandatory -3 GOE listed for "SP: One or more rev. less than required" yet now they also say in the SP jumps that have the wrong number of revolutions have no value? What's going on here? Another thing that I see is "jumps with less than 1.5 revs in the SP/FP will have no value" - so popped jumps or doubles that are << are also worthless now?

  8. #23
    Rinkside
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by CarneAsada View Post
    That's something else I don't get. There's still the mandatory -3 GOE listed for "SP: One or more rev. less than required" yet now they also say in the SP jumps that have the wrong number of revolutions have no value? What's going on here? Another thing that I see is "jumps with less than 1.5 revs in the SP/FP will have no value" - so popped jumps or doubles that are << are also worthless now?
    I guess that's what's gonna happen. Oh boy is this really a certain thing.

  9. #24
    Rinkside
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    19
    Mao can replace 3Lz with 2A, so I think this is not that big problem for her. She has still got five kinds of triples.

    BTW, what will happen to combo like 3Lz-1lo-3S if jumps with less than 1.5 revs will have no value?

  10. #25
    Rinkside
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by urara View Post
    Mao can replace 3Lz with 2A, so I think this is not that big problem for her. She has still got five kinds of triples.

    BTW, what will happen to combo like 3Lz-1lo-3S if jumps with less than 1.5 revs will have no value?
    I guess the 1Lo would get nothing. But then are those 3lz and 3s going to be treated as single elements?

  11. #26
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    1,063
    They specify jumps of "wrong number of revs" will have no value. So for example the BV of a 3Lz-1T is dropped from 6.4 to 6.0 (treated as a 3Lz+combo). It still counts for something.

  12. #27
    Medalist
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    99
    Quote Originally Posted by DDepardieu View Post
    I understand the flutz and lip regulations. But not counting elements that doesn't satisfy the SP requirements?! That is CRAZY. If this comes into action, even quad-single or triple-single would get zero mark. Then who would risk a quad-triple? Fewer and fewer skater would attempt the 3-3, because if you screw up one jump than you can just say goodbye to your podium. I'm really smelling regression.
    "In Short Program jumps which do not satisfy the requirements (wrong number of revolutions) will have no value; if a combination of two double jumps is not allowed (senior men and ladies, junior men), jump with a lesser value will not be counted."

    Hmmm, because they used the example of a double-double rather than a triple-something or a quad-something, it's not completely clear whether "jump with a lesser value" refers to the double in relation to the intended triple, or the two doubles in relation to each other. My interpretation of the wording is that it refers to the latter. So it seems to be saying that in a double-double combination, the skater would only get credit for the higher-value double because quad-double and triple-double combinations are allowed. So if I'm interpreting the rule correctly, a quad-single and a triple-single would still get credit as a quad or a triple, just there would be no points for the single.

    This is really confusing because in the case of the Zayak rule, if a jump cannot count for whatever reason, the entire jumping pass is lost and counts as 0, even if it's in combination with jumps that otherwise would have counted. But now in the new SP rule, you can still get credit for the half of the combo that does satisfy the rules?

  13. #28
    Say no to horrendous costumes Meoima's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    North of the world
    Posts
    6,148
    I suppose this rules prevent the veteran from going for another season, huh? At this rate, Mao, Caro, Dai...will likely to retire right away.

  14. #29
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    2,705
    Argh, this is so confusing. I really hope it doesn't mean quad-single would get zero points. That's too stupid to be true... right? Combos are ill-rewarded enough as is.

    I hope it means that you get credit for the first half of the jumping pass. Even if that lowers the value of a quad-single, I think Zayaking shouldn't kill your podium chances immediately. Just repeating what I said on the Oda thread at this point, but...

    Also:
    How this shakes out is going to depend on the tech panel. How often is (e) vs (!) going to be used? My biggest fear is that the favorited skater's with either remain uncalled as they are now or just receive the (!) with minimal GOE deductions, also like now, whereas the unfavored will get absolutely destroyed by the tech panel with (e) calls.
    I'm really worried about this too. With such a big difference in points (but fuzzy difference in action, as the debate on Adelina shows) between ! and e, it'll be a very easy method to hold someone up and punish someone else.

  15. #30
    Rinkside
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by Brenda View Post
    "In Short Program jumps which do not satisfy the requirements (wrong number of revolutions) will have no value; if a combination of two double jumps is not allowed (senior men and ladies, junior men), jump with a lesser value will not be counted."

    Hmmm, because they used the example of a double-double rather than a triple-something or a quad-something, it's not completely clear whether "jump with a lesser value" refers to the double in relation to the intended triple, or the two doubles in relation to each other. My interpretation of the wording is that it refers to the latter. So it seems to be saying that in a double-double combination, the skater would only get credit for the higher-value double because quad-double and triple-double combinations are allowed. So if I'm interpreting the rule correctly, a quad-single and a triple-single would still get credit as a quad or a triple, just there would be no points for the single.

    This is really confusing because in the case of the Zayak rule, if a jump cannot count for whatever reason, the entire jumping pass is lost and counts as 0, even if it's in combination with jumps that otherwise would have counted. But now in the new SP rule, you can still get credit for the half of the combo that does satisfy the rules?

    Thank you for the input! I really hope you're right. god these rules are so confusing. is there any way we can make an enquiry directly to the ISU?

Page 2 of 6 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •