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Thread: Marissa Castelli and Mervin Tran pair up.

  1. #46
    Spiral Lover tulosai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by golden411 View Post
    Not saying that it will be a piece of cake, but I disagree that Tran has zero hope of U.S. citizenship. (My opinion is based on the experience of multiple members of my family who acquired green cards and subsequently U.S. citizenship.)
    Did any of them not live in the USA at the time? If so, were they granted refugee visas at which point they did immediately move here? I am not being sarcastic, but I know a lot about immigration law and I know a lot of people who got a greencard and then citizenship. In fact, working with such people is part of my job. To get citizenship, you need to have been a resident for at least 5 years, period (3 if you are married to a citizen for the whole 3 years). You can only spend so much time out of the country in those 5 years (and it isn't a lot of time, relatively speaking). From my knowledge, subject to any weird special exception he might be eligible for (which I think is very unlikely at best) he's not going to be eligible for citizenship. Do you know of a contrary law or exception? I am not meaning to be difficult or to argue with you, but I unfortunately just do not think you are correct.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by tulosai View Post
    Did any of them not live in the USA at the time? If so, were they granted refugee visas at which point they did immediately move here? I am not being sarcastic, but I know a lot about immigration law and I know a lot of people who got a greencard and then citizenship. In fact, working with such people is part of my job. To get citizenship, you need to have been a resident for at least 5 years, period (3 if you are married to a citizen for the whole 3 years). You can only spend so much time out of the country in those 5 years (and it isn't a lot of time, relatively speaking). From my knowledge, subject to any weird special exception he might be eligible for (which I think is very unlikely at best) he's not going to be eligible for citizenship. Do you know of a contrary law or exception? I am not meaning to be difficult or to argue with you, but I unfortunately just do not think you are correct.
    Not going to go into detail, but some of them did not live full time in the U.S. They met the residency requirements via careful attention to their schedules. (They were not refugees.)
    Will add that my memories are from a generation ago. Have the requirements changed?

    I do not mean to be difficult either ... and it sounds as if you are way more conversant in this area than I am, so I will leave it there.

  3. #48
    Spiral Lover tulosai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by golden411 View Post
    Not going to go into detail, but some of them did not live full time in the U.S. They met the residency requirements via careful attention to their schedules. (They were not refugees.)
    Will add that my memories are from a generation ago. Have the requirements changed?

    I do not mean to be difficult either ... and it sounds as if you are way more conversant in this area than I am, so I will leave it there.
    Honestly, it's complicated, and I guess I'll leave it there too for now, but I will say I've never seen a person get citizenship who was living in the USA less than 1/2 the time (and I've seen people denied it who lived here more than that), and Tran and Castilli were clear in their press release that they intend to spend the majority of their time in canada, and the time they spend travelling to competitions if any will count against him too. In years past, bluntly, it was also easier to fudge numbers, but now passports are scanned and the state department knows how many days you've been here or not and aren't taking your word for it. Given what Tran/Castilli currently say they are doing, I don't think he can get citizenship. If they change their plan and he spends more than 1/2 the time here (especially if they get some skating results that are good), it gets more likely, but he's still looking at a 5 year timetable so if citizenship is his goal the sooner he can change his mind the better.

    I do hope I haven't sounded contentious- you are one of my fave posters in general.

  4. #49
    Celebrating the Excellence of #VirtueMoir golden411's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tulosai View Post
    Honestly, it's complicated, and I guess I'll leave it there too for now, but I will say I've never seen a person get citizenship who was living in the USA less than 1/2 the time (and I've seen people denied it who lived here more than that), and Tran and Castilli were clear in their press release that they intend to spend the majority of their time in canada, and the time they spend travelling to competitions if any will count against him too. In years past, bluntly, it was also easier to fudge numbers, but now passports are scanned and the state department knows how many days you've been here or not and aren't taking your word for it. Given what Tran/Castilli currently say they are doing, I don't think he can get citizenship. If they change their plan and he spends more than 1/2 the time here (especially if they get some skating results that are good), it gets more likely, but he's still looking at a 5 year timetable so if citizenship is his goal the sooner he can change his mind the better.

    I do hope I haven't sounded contentious- you are one of my fave posters in general.
    Thx for sharing your knowledge (in this thread and on GS as a whole), and absolutely no worries -- you did/do not sound contentious.
    I hope that I did not either. Best to you, and to Castelli/Tran.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    I do not know why Tran and Purich broke up. She is now skating with a guy named Wolfe.
    Sebastian Wolfe? Who retired with Dubé when she was injured?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateFiguring View Post
    Sebastian Wolfe? Who retired with Dubé when she was injured?
    The person in question is Drew Wolfe who placed 7th in Jr. Men at Canadian nationals last year. Not sure if he's related to Sebastian.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    The person in question is Drew Wolfe who placed 7th in Jr. Men at Canadian nationals last year. Not sure if he's related to Sebastian.
    Interesting. Her previous partner was a Sebastian.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tulosai View Post
    Honestly, it's complicated, and I guess I'll leave it there too for now, but I will say I've never seen a person get citizenship who was living in the USA less than 1/2 the time (and I've seen people denied it who lived here more than that), and Tran and Castilli were clear in their press release that they intend to spend the majority of their time in canada, and the time they spend travelling to competitions if any will count against him too. In years past, bluntly, it was also easier to fudge numbers, but now passports are scanned and the state department knows how many days you've been here or not and aren't taking your word for it. Given what Tran/Castilli currently say they are doing, I don't think he can get citizenship. If they change their plan and he spends more than 1/2 the time here (especially if they get some skating results that are good), it gets more likely, but he's still looking at a 5 year timetable so if citizenship is his goal the sooner he can change his mind the better.

    I do hope I haven't sounded contentious- you are one of my fave posters in general.
    So they can't skate at the Olympics? That doesn't make sense. Why would Marissa team up with someone she has no chance to go to the Olympics with? Isn't that her ultimate goal?

  9. #54
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    I guess Mervin could skate for the US if they got married? Joking aside, I hope it works out for them. Mervin was great with Narumi Takahashi and I missed seeing him in the major competitions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandpiper View Post
    So they can't skate at the Olympics? That doesn't make sense. Why would Marissa team up with someone she has no chance to go to the Olympics with? Isn't that her ultimate goal?
    Interesting point that goes beyond what you write here. I don't know what Marissa's ultimate goal is, and, for many people, and the federations, the Olympics is the ultimate goal. This is a four year sport, and popularity and momentum seems to hinge on the Olympic results or showing. But for pairs, sometimes maybe we should question that. And Mervin and Marissa's situation really is the perfect example.

    Just how important SHOULD it be that a team go to the Olympics. Yes, very important, but at the expense of not skating with a decent partner, or being competitive? Perhaps those considerations should deal-break the Olympic ambition. Being a great team and being able to go to Worlds, and being fantastic on the ice has to be a close second, and (but where you are not going to be on a good team: ) maybe even better than skating in a crappy partnership going nowhere even if you get to go the Olympics.

    Consider what JSF and Narumi did to get a Narumi team to the Olympics. (I have nothing against either.) One doesn't need a crystal ball to see that the Japanese team that Narumi is now on is never going to be as good on the ice as the Narumi-Mervin team. And inbetween, now and the next Olympics, there are going to be four years of okay skating, but Narumi-Ryuichi are never going to be podium except at the Japanese National level. JSF and Narumi made the choice that the Olympics were more important than continuing the Tran partnership. I respect that position, but I also disagree with it because it destroyed what could have been a team that potentially could have been super-great, and much more inspirational nationally and internationally for the discipline (imho).

    As well, for Marissa in particular, is it worth skating four years in a partnership that causes you to be unhappy just to get to the Olympics? (Again, a personal choice, but, for me, especially after Sochi 2014, I am not so sure that the 2018 Olympics are such a fantastic event to gamble everything you have on at the added cost of spending four years in an unfulfilling partnership.)

    I know the National federation system is important for funding, and that Olympics is the be-all end-all (ie the ultimate) for most teams, but, in cases such as Tran and Marissa, because of their individual personal experiences, it might be that their particular priorities are shifted to being on the very best skating team (that can still compete internationally, just not at the Olympics). To me, it is a breath of fresh air to see two skaters I adore take the road less travelled (but to me more rational) and they can be present enough, even without the Olympics, to make it worthwhile.

    Let all of us skating fans rejoice.

  11. #56
    Spiral Lover tulosai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phaeljones View Post
    Interesting point that goes beyond what you write here. I don't know what Marissa's ultimate goal is, and, for many people, and the federations, the Olympics is the ultimate goal. This is a four year sport, and popularity and momentum seems to hinge on the Olympic results or showing. But for pairs, sometimes maybe we should question that. And Mervin and Marissa's situation really is the perfect example.

    Just how important SHOULD it be that a team go to the Olympics. Yes, very important, but at the expense of not skating with a decent partner, or being competitive? Perhaps those considerations should deal-break the Olympic ambition. Being a great team and being able to go to Worlds, and being fantastic on the ice has to be a close second, and (but where you are not going to be on a good team: ) maybe even better than skating in a crappy partnership going nowhere even if you get to go the Olympics.

    Consider what JSF and Narumi did to get a Narumi team to the Olympics. (I have nothing against either.) One doesn't need a crystal ball to see that the Japanese team that Narumi is now on is never going to be as good on the ice as the Narumi-Mervin team. And inbetween, now and the next Olympics, there are going to be four years of okay skating, but Narumi-Ryuichi are never going to be podium except at the Japanese National level. JSF and Narumi made the choice that the Olympics were more important than continuing the Tran partnership. I respect that position, but I also disagree with it because it destroyed what could have been a team that potentially could have been super-great, and much more inspirational nationally and internationally for the discipline (imho).

    As well, for Marissa in particular, is it worth skating four years in a partnership that causes you to be unhappy just to get to the Olympics? (Again, a personal choice, but, for me, especially after Sochi 2014, I am not so sure that the 2018 Olympics are such a fantastic event to gamble everything you have on at the added cost of spending four years in an unfulfilling partnership.)

    I know the National federation system is important for funding, and that Olympics is the be-all end-all (ie the ultimate) for most teams, but, in cases such as Tran and Marissa, because of their individual personal experiences, it might be that their particular priorities are shifted to being on the very best skating team (that can still compete internationally, just not at the Olympics). To me, it is a breath of fresh air to see two skaters I adore take the road less travelled (but to me more rational) and they can be present enough, even without the Olympics, to make it worthwhile.

    Let all of us skating fans rejoice.
    I agree wholeheartedly, but wanted to say I thought the JSF encouraged Narumi to stay with Tran? I thought all the articles said at the time that it was wholly her decision and that neither he nor the JSF agreed and that in fact the JSF had urged her to stay with him and see if it could be worked out? Am I mis-remembering?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tulosai View Post
    I agree wholeheartedly, but wanted to say I thought the JSF encouraged Narumi to stay with Tran? I thought all the articles said at the time that it was wholly her decision and that neither he nor the JSF agreed and that in fact the JSF had urged her to stay with him and see if it could be worked out? Am I mis-remembering?
    Narumi and Tran were not Olympic podium contenders and it was good for Japan to have at least one good Pairs skater at major events. However, with the new Team Event at the Olympics, Japan probably wanted to have at least one decent Pairs in their team.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateFiguring View Post
    Narumi and Tran were not Olympic podium contenders and it was good for Japan to have at least one good Pairs skater at major events. However, with the new Team Event at the Olympics, Japan probably wanted to have at least one decent Pairs in their team.
    Unfortunately, it wouldn't have made a difference. It would have probably put them in 4th over Italy, but the US was too far ahead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Unfortunately, it wouldn't have made a difference. It would have probably put them in 4th over Italy, but the US was too far ahead.
    So what would have been their alternate Pair? Japan needs every drop in their pitiful virtually empty Pairs pool. And Ice Dance as well. They can't put in two unqualified couples in the Team Event and it might come to that.

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    Japan has a couple of other dance teams, but the only one other than the Reeds that is halfway decent is Hirai/De La Asuncion and he is French, so not a consideration for the Olympics. The two all-Japanese teams are pitiful.

    Japan has two junior pairs that competed at Nationals, but both have non-Japanese male partners.

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