55th ISU Congress: Who voted "For" and "Against" anonymous judging | Page 2 | Golden Skate

55th ISU Congress: Who voted "For" and "Against" anonymous judging

invisiblespiral

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 20, 2013
I think people continue to speak about blocks but it's not quite like that. Italy can swing their vote according to their own interest. Today they are with Russia, tomorrow they are with USA for example.
There are no monolithic blocks anymore, and small feds are those who "sell" their vote/marks. ;)

Okay then.... so most of the smaller foundations just go along with whomever will act in their favor..... and that's why a lot of them are against de-anoning judging? :think:
 

BusyMom

Medalist
Joined
Jan 10, 2014
Okay then.... so most of the smaller foundations just go along with whomever will act in their favor..... and that's why a lot of them are against de-anoning judging? :think:
I don't think it was the selling their votes or playing along for a pity favour in this case (might true for some fed though). More about they also have their own agenda regarding their own regional/local/national competitions. It's easier to control the outcome of competition with secret judging.
 

Jewels

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 20, 2013
speed skating

ksu doesn't give a dam* about figure skating.. not even when yuna was still active.. so why do you think they will start caring now??

lol Who have they got besides Sang-hwa Lee in speed skating? It's not like we've ever seen them 'working' really. I don't expect any care from them, maybe just some common sense? Either they're playing along with other feds or planning on revenge(lol if Korea ever gets to medal before the olympics that is), this is embarrassing.
What's the point of having good skaters when they are killing the sport? Makes me question the reason of their existence.
 

LRK

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 13, 2012
Sweden... Sigh... Why? :bang:

All I can think of is: Voting in a democracy is secret - ergo secret voting is democratic - we like democracy - ergo we want secret voting.

Groan.
 

Alba

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 26, 2014
Okay then.... so most of the smaller foundations just go along with whomever will act in their favor..... and that's why a lot of them are against de-anoning judging? :think:

This and what BusyMom wrote. For example I had no doubt that Italy would vote against it, and not because Cinquanta is italian.
 

Alba

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 26, 2014
I don't think countries like Finland and Sweden are necessarily against anon judging... Two interesting facts: Both of these countries have bid for the 2017 Worlds (ISU will announce the outcome on Sunday). In addition to this, both countries have campaigned strongly for Why not Synchro 2018. The ISU has made some positive comments lately about the possibility to include synchro in Olympics. Also the ISU congress made changes to improve the status of synchro. For example a reference to synchro was now included in the ISU rule 126 (Olympic Winter Games rule) which strongly suggests synchro could later be included in Pyeongchang 2018. Sooo, my point is there could be some trade-off going on...

Another theory says that Russia would in reality be in favour of anon judging but voted against it in order to not look suspicious, and bribed (with Speedy's kind assistance) the smaller countries to vote in favour of keeping the system as it is. This would also explain the number of Eastern European countries voting in favour of the present rule...

Thirdly, one explanation for South Korea's voting could be a trade-off too. Right before the ISU congress ISU added some proposals from Korea to be included in the congress agenda as "urgent matters". Korea suggested for example that at the Olympics the host country shall have the right to have a representative in each 4 disciplines. ISU congress approved this.

Well, following this logic no country is necessarily against anon. judging. They all follow their own interests so they all have their justification/reasons but in the end the result is the same.
 

Sandpiper

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 16, 2014
Lol, Korea, what the heck? "It's not about Yuna"? It totally is. (That's okay, I want to give Yuna gold too, but the hypocrisy is hilarious).

Over 50%! We're getting there! I won't lose hope.

Seems like the conventional wisdom--big Feds. want anonymous judging so they can play politics, small Feds. want it gone for a level playing field--doesn't reflect reality. I can only conclude that the big Feds. are confident they have enough talent (or politics) to do without anonymous judging, while smaller Feds... want a leg up? I dunno, it seems counter intuitive. While they can politic too, the bigger Feds. will do it better.

Conspiracy theory that Russia really wants anonymous judging and bribed ex-Soviet countries: Possible, but not plausible. Wasn't Russia one of the countries that originally brought up a proposals for eliminating anonymous judging? They're taking an active role in this. It's not like other countries backing are them into a corner.

Sweden ect. and synchro: That sounds plausible. I, for one, wouldn't mind having synchro in the Olympics. But this is quite the selfish deal, haha.

I think it's ultimately simple: Everyone looks in terms of their own interests. Russia knows anonymous judging will work against them in Pyeongchang, and they have the talent to medal on their own merits. Also, they've been a great figure-skating power for a long time and can probably survive without anonymous judging in the cycles to come. Korea, on the other hand, is planning Koreavengeance and wants to ensure their skaters have a good showing in their home country. At this point, they're understandably not confident that they can make it on talent alone.

And oh, Canada voted for the motion! I'm surprised but happy.
 

Alba

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 26, 2014
Lol, Korea, what the heck? "It's not about Yuna"? It totally is. (That's okay, I want to give Yuna gold too, but the hypocrisy is hilarious).

Over 50%! We're getting there! I won't lose hope.

Seems like the conventional wisdom--big Feds. want anonymous judging so they can play politics, small Feds. want it gone for a level playing field--doesn't reflect reality. I can only conclude that the big Feds. are confident they have enough talent (or politics) to do without anonymous judging, while smaller Feds... want a leg up? I dunno, it seems counter intuitive. While they can politic too, the bigger Feds. will do it better.

Conspiracy theory that Russia really wants anonymous judging and bribed ex-Soviet countries: Possible, but not plausible. Wasn't Russia one of the countries that originally brought up a proposals for eliminating anonymous judging? They're taking an active role in this. It's not like other countries backing are them into a corner.

Sweden ect. and synchro: That sounds plausible. I, for one, wouldn't mind having synchro in the Olympics. But this is quite the selfish deal, haha.

I think it's ultimately simple: Everyone looks in terms of their own interests. Russia knows anonymous judging will work against them in Pyeongchang, and they have the talent to medal on their own merits. Also, they've been a great figure-skating power for a long time and can probably survive without anonymous judging in the cycles to come. Korea, on the other hand, is planning Koreavengeance and wants to ensure their skaters have a good showing in their home country. At this point, they're understandably not confident that they can make it on talent alone.

And oh, Canada voted for the motion! I'm surprised but happy.

Maybe something good will come out of this. Some Fed's will shut up their mouth before complaining about anonymous judging. ;)
 

BusyMom

Medalist
Joined
Jan 10, 2014
I think it's ultimately simple: Everyone looks in terms of their own interests. Russia knows anonymous judging will work against them in Pyeongchang, and they have the talent to medal on their own merits. Also, they've been a great figure-skating power for a long time and can probably survive without anonymous judging in the cycles to come. Korea, on the other hand, is planning Koreavengeance and wants to ensure their skaters have a good showing in their home country. At this point, they're understandably not confident that they can make it on talent alone.

and at the end it was the dwarf who killed the giants. :slink:
 

Alba

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 26, 2014
I feel ashamed.....Anonymous judging is killing this sport.

I'm against it but how can you say that anonymous judging is killing this sport? We had the old system with judges and their marks well known and people still went crazy about their marks.
 

Sandpiper

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 16, 2014
^Yeah, but FS was popular back then. (I don't think it's losing popularity because of anonymous judging though. Many other factors: IJS vs. 6.0 in general, lack of female star in US, '90s popularity came from a series of circumstances unlikely to be repeated: Nancy vs. Tonya + emergence of Michelle Kwan).

Maybe something good will come out of this. Some Fed's will shut up their mouth before complaining about anonymous judging. ;)
*muffled laughter*
 

fleeting

Queen Anissina
Medalist
Joined
Feb 19, 2014
I'm just curious as to why 30 nations voting against anonymous judging is trumped by 24 voting for it. Majority vote should take precedence here.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
I'm just curious as to why 30 nations voting against anonymous judging is trumped by 24 voting for it. Majority vote should take precedence here.

I know right? It's awfully stupid.

And I'm as amazed as everyone else that Korea is for anonymous judging.

Purely speculative, but maybe they're worried if they have medal hopefuls in 2018 they can't engineer a higher placement or medal should there be transparent judging.
 

visaliakid

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 23, 2004
Country
United-States
I'm just curious as to why 30 nations voting against anonymous judging is trumped by 24 voting for it. Majority vote should take precedence here.

Logically, 2/3rds allows those smaller nations and many of them with Speed Skating votes to maintain control over decision-making.

I will continue to believe the only way this grip will be broken is for those nations who voted for eliminating secret judging to leave the ISU and create a new international skating governing body. It will be messy but the only sure way to have control over the sport with the majority of those federations committed to having their Figure Skating Branches control Figure Skating.
 

Poice

Final Flight
Joined
Mar 29, 2013
I'm against it but how can you say that anonymous judging is killing this sport? We had the old system with judges and their marks well known and people still went crazy about their marks.

It's just my opinion. Of course there are more problems but I think anonymous judging unnecessary confuse fans. I don't understand why we can't see how judges scored skaters..It should be public information like protocols.
 

cooper

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
I know right? It's awfully stupid.

And I'm as amazed as everyone else that Korea is for anonymous judging.

Purely speculative, but maybe they're worried if they have medal hopefuls in 2018 they can't engineer a higher placement or medal should there be transparent judging.

i think you give the korean fed too much credit.. they don't have the political power to do it nor the brains to even orchestrate such thing.. :laugh:

and i'm more amazed that some are surprised about the korean fed's decision to support anonymous judging.. :laugh:
 

Mafke

Medalist
Joined
Mar 22, 2004
I'm against it but how can you say that anonymous judging is killing this sport? We had the old system with judges and their marks well known and people still went crazy about their marks.

The difference is that before 2002 casual fans trusted that judges were mostly trying to do the right thing and they no longer do and _nothing_ the ISU has done since 2002 has restored fan trust.
 
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