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Thread: Kiira Korpi ready for comeback!

  1. #76
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    a 3T-3T won be competitive for 26 year old Korpii
    I see Jenni Saarin pasing Korpi, Jenni has better technical arsnal, fresh, young, promising skater for Finland

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    I do think it's kinda lame though that she received 60ish points for short programs with a 3T+2T, 3L, 2A.
    Akiko Suzuki get 66 in NHK with 3T--2T, 3F and 2A

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by thom View Post
    Let's just see where this goes, kittens. It's that classic adage of, "If she wants to skate, let her. If she's happy with her comeback, SO ARE WE."
    Agree. If every skater had to meet the high standard that at least one poster seems to be using, of always being in competition for a gold medal, there would only be around five skaters in each competition! Kiira is the number-one ladies skater in Finland and has done well on the Grand Prix circuit. If Laura Lepisto could win a World bronze, why would anyone think Kiira couldn't, too?

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuisRollerArg View Post
    Akiko Suzuki get 66 in NHK with 3T--2T, 3F and 2A
    Also lame. 66 points is enough to lead most competitions after the SP. You get junior skaters doing 3Z+3T, 3F, 2A scoring much less.

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Also lame. 66 points is enough to lead most competitions after the SP. You get junior skaters doing 3Z+3T, 3F, 2A scoring much less.
    Oh, I hadn't realised that only the jumps score points, or that how well you do those jumps counts for nothing -_-

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by sky_fly20 View Post
    a 3T-3T won be competitive for 26 year old Korpii
    I see Jenni Saarin pasing Korpi, Jenni has better technical arsnal, fresh, young, promising skater for Finland
    Saarinen came 13th at World Juniors (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pADFbao4erY).

    Her PB of 142 points was at JGP Czech skate where she fell 3 times. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3d0hloAFWY) She lacks the speed and certainly lacks the edges and skating skills Korpi has. She's still a junior though, and has a lovely 2A+3T, but other than that not much... maybe if she's lucky after Korpi retires she'll be at a level that still keeps Finland competitive in ladies, but I don't think she'll ever pass Korpi (unless Korpi lands 1 triple to Saarinen's 6 triples).

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Also lame. 66 points is enough to lead most competitions after the SP. You get junior skaters doing 3Z+3T, 3F, 2A scoring much less.
    That's because at the junior level, PCS scores are usually in the 6s at best. That jump layout for seniors could receive scores in the 7s and 8s.

    Suzuki on home ice could expect high PCS scores with a lower-value layout because she does perform her programs with great expression and grace. 66 for 3t+2t, 3f, 2a is not that outrageous.

  8. #83
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    Yeah, but as a general statement if skater A does 3Z+3T, 3F, 2A and scores high 50's, low 60's.... and a skater B does 3T+2T, 3L, 2A and scores mid-60's, there is something very wrong. Even if skater B is a superior skater in other areas. The PCS shouldn't be a safety net for when a popular skater bombs or a tool to hold back "lesser" skaters even when they do well.

    You see it on the senior level as well. Skaters like Murakami and Osmond skated cleanly at Worlds last year and scored less than a technically less ambitious Kostner who had a fall.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenaj View Post
    Agree. If every skater had to meet the high standard that at least one poster seems to be using, of always being in competition for a gold medal, there would only be around five skaters in each competition! Kiira is the number-one ladies skater in Finland and has done well on the Grand Prix circuit. If Laura Lepisto could win a World bronze, why would anyone think Kiira couldn't, too?
    Hmm.. Because Laura was actually a better skater and competitor than Kiira. One thing they share is that neither is very flexible which I believe makes them more injury prone. Good luck to Kiira. I only hope that judges won't reward her for lousy technical content. She is of course beautiful to watch.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Yeah, but as a general statement if skater A does 3Z+3T, 3F, 2A and scores high 50's, low 60's.... and a skater B does 3T+2T, 3L, 2A and scores mid-60's, there is something very wrong. Even if skater B is a superior skater in other areas. The PCS shouldn't be a safety net for when a popular skater bombs or a tool to hold back "lesser" skaters even when they do well.

    You see it on the senior level as well. Skaters like Murakami and Osmond skated cleanly at Worlds last year and scored less than a technically less ambitious Kostner who had a fall.
    Are you referring to Worlds 2013 or Worlds 2014?

    Worlds 2013:

    Kostner: 3z, 2a, 3f+3t, 1lo, 3t+2t, 3s+2t+2lo, 3s<<↓
    Murakami: 3ze, 3lo<+2t, 3f, 3lo<, 3f^1a, 3s+2lo+2lo, 3t
    Osmond: 3f+2t, 3ze, 2a+3t-so, 3s, 3f, 3t<, 2a+2t+2t

    Hmmm. Maybe Kostner doesn't have the hardest tech in the world, but she doesn't flutz or lip and she did land a fully rotated 3/3, which is something neither Murakami nor Osmond was able to do.

    Murakami didn't fall, but she flutzed, URd two triples and singled an axel, so her skate was not technically clean.
    Osmond fell twice, so I don't see how you can say she skated cleanly.

    Worlds 2014:

    Kostner: 3z, 2a+2t, 3f+3t↓, 1lo, 1f, 2a, 3s+2t+1lo
    Murakami: 3t+3t<, 3ze<, 3lo<, 3f<+2t, 3f, 2a<, 3s+2lo<+2lo
    Osmond: 3f+2t, 2a+3t-hop, 3ze, 3s, 3f-to, 2t+2t+2t, 2a-to

    Kostner had a weak FS for sure, falling on her 3/3 and singling two triples.
    But Murakami landed only three triples---all the others were UR and so was her 2a, so this was not a clean skate.
    Osmond's skate wasn't clean either, with a fall, a hop on the axel combo, singling the 3t in the 3-jump combo, and turnouts on the flip and the axel.


    And once again, you are comparing Osmond to Kostner---if Osmond has higher tech than Kostner, she should score higher. As if.

  11. #86
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    People: can we please go back to talking about Kiira here? We can move the debate on Kostner vs. Murakami vs. Osmond (although I love the analysis you got into) to another thread.

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Are you referring to Worlds 2013 or Worlds 2014?

    Worlds 2013:

    Kostner: 3z, 2a, 3f+3t, 1lo, 3t+2t, 3s+2t+2lo, 3s<<↓
    Murakami: 3ze, 3lo<+2t, 3f, 3lo<, 3f^1a, 3s+2lo+2lo, 3t
    Osmond: 3f+2t, 3ze, 2a+3t-so, 3s, 3f, 3t<, 2a+2t+2t

    Hmmm. Maybe Kostner doesn't have the hardest tech in the world, but she doesn't flutz or lip and she did land a fully rotated 3/3, which is something neither Murakami nor Osmond was able to do.

    Murakami didn't fall, but she flutzed, URd two triples and singled an axel, so her skate was not technically clean.
    Osmond fell twice, so I don't see how you can say she skated cleanly.

    Worlds 2014:

    Kostner: 3z, 2a+2t, 3f+3t↓, 1lo, 1f, 2a, 3s+2t+1lo
    Murakami: 3t+3t<, 3ze<, 3lo<, 3f<+2t, 3f, 2a<, 3s+2lo<+2lo
    Osmond: 3f+2t, 2a+3t-hop, 3ze, 3s, 3f-to, 2t+2t+2t, 2a-to

    Kostner had a weak FS for sure, falling on her 3/3 and singling two triples.
    But Murakami landed only three triples---all the others were UR and so was her 2a, so this was not a clean skate.
    Osmond's skate wasn't clean either, with a fall, a hop on the axel combo, singling the 3t in the 3-jump combo, and turnouts on the flip and the axel.


    And once again, you are comparing Osmond to Kostner---if Osmond has higher tech than Kostner, she should score higher. As if.
    Good lord... please look at the rest of my post where I'm obviously referring to the SP, the 2013 Worlds SP in particular? Here, I'll link to the pdf so it's even more apparent. http://www.isuresults.com/results/wc..._SP_Scores.pdf

    If Osmond/Murakami skates a clean SP with a 3-3, that should score higher than a SP from Kostner with a fall. I acknowledge Kostner is a superior skater in general, but she certainly didn't deserve to be sitting in 2nd after the 2013 Worlds SP (and received a personal best PCS at that). Which goes back to my earlier point that popular skaters shouldn't have the PCS cushion that allows them to make errors or do technically less-demanding programs and still be placed ahead of "lesser" skaters who go clean with strong difficulty. Unless it's the case of Korpi where she benefited from her competitors doing poorly, so even with less demanding programs and errors, it was kind of justified for her to get the results she got.

  13. #88
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    I am sure that when Kaetlyn Osmond has been skating for 12 years at the international level and has won 3 World medals and a World championship, 3 GPF medals and a GPF Championship, and 5 4CC medals and 5 4CC Championships, she will be in a position to be placed above 'lessers' even when she falls in a SP on a less-demanding program.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    I am sure that when Kaetlyn Osmond has been skating for 12 years at the international level and has won 3 World medals and a World championship, 3 GPF medals and a GPF Championship, and 5 4CC medals and 5 4CC Championships, she will be in a position to be placed above 'lessers' even when she falls in a SP on a less-demanding program.
    If that were the case, it wouldn't be right for Osmond to be placed above "lesser" skaters either.

    Accolades shouldn't absolve you of errors and place you ahead of more deserving skaters. If the sport is to progress, skaters (regardless of experience/popularity) shouldn't be rewarded when they make major errors and be given personal bests... particularly when they've executed more technically demanding, cleaner programs in the past.

    If Korpi does come back, she should win because she deserves it, and not because she's a veteran with past wins/medals.

  15. #90
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    The reality is reputation DOES count, and at 2014 Kostner had reputation and Osmond didn't. That is why it is important for Kaetlyn to skate well at every competition to build her reputation. 3- and 4- triple freeskates with multiple stepouts won't do that.

    Kiira is an elegant skater with great posture and carriage, musicality and good flowout on her jumps. Most of her mistakes are doubled jumps, rarely falls, stumbles or stepouts. So even when she doesn't have the technical content, she still gets high PCS scores. She probably won't have all her jumps when she returns and she may not be in a position to win, but she will look good on the ice.

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