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Thread: PCS academy

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    PCS academy

    (The GOE academy thread didn't get a lot of attention. Feel free to revive it if interested, taking account of recent rule changes)

    I'm more interested in discussing program components -- lots of room for discussion because each component has multiple criteria, there's lots of room for honest disagreement, and for some of them not technical skating knowledge is less important than performing arts knowledge and even personal reactions, so nonskaters can join right in.

    See the Program Components Overview and Program Components With Explanations PDFs linked at the bottom of this page (or near the bottom of this one).

    I'd like to use some examples of pre-IJS programs so that there are no wrong or right answers. Let's discuss among ourselves and if we end up assigning scores we can make our own Golden Skate "corridor."

    Please suggest some programs that would be interesting to analyze.

    Let's start discussion with the Interpretation component.

    Interpretation
    Definition: The personal and creative translation of the music to movement on ice.
    To reward the skater who through movement creates a personal and creative translation of the music.
    As the tempo binds all notes in time, the ability to use the tempos and rhythms of the music in a variety of ways, along with the subtle use of finesse to reflect the nuances of all the fundamentals of music: melody, rhythm, harmony, color, texture, and form creates a mastery of interpretation.

    Criteria:

    Effortless Movements in Time to the Music (Timing) Note: Timing is a separate component in Compulsory Dances.
    The ability to translate music through sureness of rhythm, tempo, effective movement, and effortless flow over the ice surface by: rhythmic continuity, awareness of all tempo/rhythm changes in a variety of ways.

    Expression of the music’s style, character, and rhythm
    Maintaining the character and style of the music throughout the entire program by use of body and skating techniques to depict a mood, style, shape, or thematic idea as motivated by the structure of the music: melody, harmony, rhythm, color, texture, and form. The total involvement of the body and being should express the intent of the music.

    Use of finesse to reflect the nuances of music.
    Finesse is the skater’s refined, artful manipulation of nuances. Nuances are the personal, artistic ways of bringing subtle variations to the intensity, tempo, and dynamics of the music made by the composer and/or the musician.

    Relationship between the partners reflecting the character of the music.
    Interpretive unison is an equal partnership with the same degree of sensitivity between partners not only to the music, but also to the equal understanding of the music’s nuances. There is an intimacy between the partners that is characterized by a feeling of “surrender” to the music and possibly to each other that creates an entity greater than the two of them.

    Appropriateness of music (original dance and free dance)
    ISU program components training videos on Interpretation

    What else should be considered in evaluating this component?

  2. #2
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    I am often critical of the ISU and of various aspects of the current judging system. But this description is pretty good as it stands, in my opinion.

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    Hate fake smiles and horrendous costumes Meoima's Avatar
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    My favorite program of PChiddy, except the fall: http://youtu.be/7dBI6kQ4riM

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    Quote Originally Posted by Meoima View Post
    My favorite program of PChiddy, except the fall: http://youtu.be/7dBI6kQ4riM
    My favorite program of Patrick : Four Seasons in TEB 2013.

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    Hate fake smiles and horrendous costumes Meoima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by plushyfan View Post
    My favorite program of Patrick : Four Seasons in TEB 2013.
    Not my taste of music, though. I like his music for FS of season 2011-2012.

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    Cool!

    I'll do some analysis after I get home from work tonight.

    In case anyone else wants to join in, here are some other great Canadian champion men's performances to analyze, starting with Interpretation.

    Of course it's not fair to compare programs from different eras, with different rules, in terms of TES or who would have won if they were competing against each other. But I do think it can be meaningful to look at 6.0 programs in terms of the program components, with 2014 eyes.

    These are all great skaters in their own ways, so we would expect high scores in general. But how good do we think they were they specifically at Interpretation, as defined in the criteria listed above, in these particular performances?

    Donald Jackson 1962

    Toller Cranston 1974

    Brian Orser 1987

    Kurt Browning 1990

    Elvis Stojko 1995

    Jeff Buttle 2008

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    Quote Originally Posted by Meoima View Post
    Not my taste of music, though. I like his music for FS of season 2011-2012.
    Yes, I like this one too Meoima. For me his long this season was extremely boring

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    What did the skater do to interpret the music?

    Can we communicate our perceptions about what we want to reward to readers, maybe convince readers who hadn't appreciated this skater's interpretation so much before?

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    Quote Originally Posted by HanDomi View Post
    Yes, I like this one too Meoima. For me his long this season was extremely boring
    funny! I like his Four Seasons exclusively. The rest I find it boring.

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    Hate fake smiles and horrendous costumes Meoima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly View Post
    What did the skater do to interpret the music?

    Can we communicate our perceptions about what we want to reward to readers, maybe convince readers who hadn't appreciated this skater's interpretation so much before?
    For casual viewers who have no idea about what kind of music skaters are skating to, I think the wow factor is indeed the most important. Chose a catchy melody, but not one that too loud and distracting if you want the attention to your skating, not the music.

    So I think it's not what the skater should do to interpret the music, it's which kind of music they should chose. And which piece of music that would go with the choreography and their body's movements. If skater themselves don't really like/connect to the music piece in a certain way, I recommend them a new program.

    I think there are some pieces that are nearly impossible to skate to, example: Firebird of Stravinsky. Seriously all the known interpretations until now are so damn literal and cheesy. I hope skaters will avoid this piece in the future (cause Stravinsky is my favorite composer and it's hurts to see his music with those subpar performances).

    For a heavily classical listener like me, if skaters fail to make me feel WOW watching the program with classical music background they chose, then they are failing the program. Since my tolerance is very high, at least to the type of music that casual viewer would consider boring and out-dated, so if I find it boring, then there is a high chance casual viewer would find it dreadfully boring. more like: Yes, because I know that music, I can stay till the end, but my mum doesn't have a clue about that music, overall she will find it too boring for her taste.

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    Hate fake smiles and horrendous costumes Meoima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by plushyfan View Post
    funny! I like his Four Seasons exclusively. The rest I find it boring.
    I think his music choice and costumes for season 2011-2012 was very memorable. The red color reminds me of Spain, and the music background is from Spain, too. The melody is catchy, a little gloomy but beautiful and not too distracting. If PChan skated it cleanly and not behind the music, I would have scored him higher than TEB 2013.

    His four seasons to me, was a throw back. Four season is kinda repetitive and worn-out. You know it's Vivaldi, it's Baroque, it's like I am watching an endless movie with bass continuo in the background!

    And his costume! Elegant but Not a good choice for Olympic season at all. Why not red or blue? Why that grayish color? The least memorable color out of all. I mean, if you want to be memorable to the judges, at least choose some thing either extremely beautiful or hideous (like Kulik or Yuzuru's, lol)

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    So the Interpretation score should be based on whether audiences like the music and the costume?

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    Hate fake smiles and horrendous costumes Meoima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly View Post
    So the Interpretation score should be based on whether audiences like the music and the costume?
    No, I mean the skater should choose something memorable, but it should go well with their style. They shouldn't force it on them if they don't feel comfortable. Some skaters give me the vibe that they don't feel comfortable with the choices they made.

    If you want to impress the audience, you have to impress yourself before that.

    Anyways it's true that red is a more memorable color than gray.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Meoima View Post
    I think his music choice and costumes for season 2011-2012 was very memorable. The red color reminds me of Spain, and the music background is from Spain, too. The melody is catchy, a little gloomy but beautiful and not too distracting. If PChan skated it cleanly and not behind the music, I would have scored him higher than TEB 2013.

    His four seasons to me, was a throw back. Four season is kinda repetitive and worn-out. You know it's Vivaldi, it's Baroque, it's like I am watching an endless movie with bass continuo in the background!

    And his costume! Elegant but Not a good choice for Olympic season at all. Why not red or blue? Why that grayish color? The least memorable color out of all. I mean, if you want to be memorable to the judges, at least choose some thing either extremely beautiful or hideous (like Kulik or Yuzuru's, lol)
    probably you are right . but Patrick skated beautifully!!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmazFXN8DWI I thought I started to love the IJS???

    p.s. : I don't like Yuzuru's costumes. Kulik had one awful costume, in Nagano.

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    Quote Originally Posted by plushyfan View Post
    probably you are right . but Patrick skated beautifully!!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmazFXN8DWI
    Yes, what a pity he didn't skate like that at Sochi! why why Patrick!
    Anyways, if he skated his 2012 program beautifully and cleanly, I would have scored it higher than this one.

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