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Thread: PCS academy

  1. #16
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    Re Donald Jackson, 1962, mentioned in an above post: Has any skater since done that move of pulling out of a spin and immediately going into a jump?

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meoima View Post
    Yes, what a pity he didn't skate like that at Sochi! why why Patrick!
    Anyways, if he skated his 2012 program beautifully and cleanly, I would have scored it higher than this one.
    So you are saying you would give him 100 PCS ? Because TES is I think his total max for this layout

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Icey View Post
    Re Donald Jackson, 1962, mentioned in an above post: Has any skater since done that move of pulling out of a spin and immediately going into a jump?
    Off topic, but, something like this?

  4. #19
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    This is my favorite Patrick Chan performance. (Four Seasons, Canadian Nationals 2008) He zips along rom beginning to end, just like the music.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9d9LSJIzuQU

    This program meets all IJS criteria for interpretation. Michelle Kwan (age 15), Romanza, 1886 worlds SP.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1imuQWeIi4Q

  5. #20
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  6. #21
    Love popcorn, hate horendous costumes Meoima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HanDomi View Post
    So you are saying you would give him 100 PCS ? Because TES is I think his total max for this layout
    We all know PCS inflations so I don't take his PCS seriously. If it were me, PChan's PCS is just 90-92 at most when he is clean, and when he fell I would say 84-87.
    Other top guys:85-88 at most when they are clean, and 80-83 when they fall.

  7. #22
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    Why? Make a case

  8. #23
    Love popcorn, hate horendous costumes Meoima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly View Post
    Why? Make a case
    I would just say, with my limited knowledge that from 93-100 PCS, you need to be as refined as the top ice dancers. Like V/M or D/W. 100? You need the best ice dancers with the performance of their lives.

    I think PChan is one of the most refined skaters, I and do think his programs, when they are clean, deserve 90PCS. But I don't think he is as refined as the ice dancers in this particular field. So 92 PCS is my maximum score for PChan's PCS when he is clean.

    And I see other top guys are not at the level of PChan's skating skills. But when they are clean, they are not that far behind, especially Daisuke Takahashi, I would give Dai 90 PCS or even 92 when he is clean and lands all the jump safety without any UR.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    This program meets all IJS criteria for interpretation. Michelle Kwan (age 15), Romanza, 1886 worlds SP.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1imuQWeIi4Q
    Umm...

    @Meoima
    Actually, while it varies by program/performance, I'd give Dai higher PCS than Patrick a lot of the time. While Patrick's Skating Skills are better, Dai blows him away in P/E and Interpretation Timing, has more distinct Choreography, and at least matches him in Transitions.

    Maybe the two of us should mark their 2012 Worlds performances in PCS, and see what we come up with? I will say, for the record, I do think Patrick deserved the win, but I wouldn't give him higher PCS than Dai.

  10. #25
    Love popcorn, hate horendous costumes Meoima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandpiper View Post
    @Meoima
    Actually, while it varies by program/performance, I'd give Dai higher PCS than Patrick a lot of the time. While Patrick's Skating Skills are better, Dai blows him away in P/E and Interpretation Timing, has more distinct Choreography, and at least matches him in Transitions.

    Maybe the two of us should mark their 2012 Worlds performances in PCS, and see what we come up with? I will say, for the record, I do think Patrick deserved the win, but I wouldn't give him higher PCS than Dai.
    I think so, too. But Dai usually got UR calls on his quads (while PChan's jumps, except the axel are more reliable). So if they are both clean, without any UR and falls, I would give them the same PCS. The things is, Dai has more shaky landings than PChan, due to his knee's problem so it affects his PCS overall I think. If they were at the same age, and at their peak at the same time, I would say Dai edge out PChan in many ways.

    As for Worlds 2012, I think Dai should have won overall since he didn't skate behind the music and not a fall in his FS. I think music violation and falls should have more deduction.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly View Post
    Off topic, but, something like this?

    Yes, thanks for sharing. That is, as Dick said, a very difficult move. I wish more skaters would give it a try.

  12. #27
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    @Meoima
    Maybe my eyes are just bad, but URs don't impact a program for me. I'm all for lowering PCS for sloppy programs, but I can't see URs unless I examine every jump very closely. So unless Dai steps-out/two-foots (which he has done, but Patrick also has step-outs), I'd give him higher PCS even if he URs a jump or two. (I don't mean to say he'd deserve to win even with URs, but I'd have Patrick win on the technical score, not PCS).

    Heck, even if they're both 100% clean (no URs), doing the same jumps, and I give Dai higher PCS, that doesn't guarantee he wins. His jumps don't pull the same GOE as Patrick's, since they're somewhat on the small side for a top skater. But that probably goes into GKelly's GOE Academy.

  13. #28
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    Since we're focusing on the Interpretation component right now -- for those of you who have posted favorite programs, would you say that this performance is as good as it gets in your opinion? Your standard for 10.0 on Interpretation? If not quite 10.0, what more would you need to see (or hear, I guess) to give a perfect Interpretation score?

    How would you help someone who doesn't love this performance as much as you do to see what you love about the skater's interpretation?

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandpiper View Post
    Maybe my eyes are just bad, but URs don't impact a program for me.
    To me, a slight under-rotation represents "opportunity loss." If you don't get complete rotation you cannot smoothly extend and control the landing edge -- as shown on this double Axel from 1886

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1imuQWeIi4Q#t=1m52s

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    To me, a slight under-rotation represents "opportunity loss." If you don't get complete rotation you cannot smoothly extend and control the landing edge -- as shown on this double Axel from 1886

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1imuQWeIi4Q#t=1m52s
    Skaters already get BV and GOE reduction for URs. I really can't get behind punishing them (Dai in this case) in PCS too when URs are already overpunished compared to falls.

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