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## "8-triple" Ladies Freeskate

This might belong in the Stupid Questions thread (lol), but...

If a woman (who lacked a 3A) wanted to be the first woman to ever do 8 clean triples in a freeskate, couldn't she just replace a 2A with a triple? Her triple wouldn't count for points because of the Zayak rule, but in terms of the actual skate (assuming all triples are clean), she would have technically been the "first woman to do an 8-triple FS".

It'd likely never happen, but if a top skater like Medvedeva was slated to win a medium-tier event (Nebelhorn/Finlandia), and her normal layout is: 3F+3T, 3Z, 3F, 3L, 2A+2T+2T, 3S+3T, 2A, and she knew she would win (had a huge lead after the SP, was clean up until her final jumping pass in the FS)... she could easily change her final 2A to any triple (zero points but still a clean triple): 3F+3T, 3Z, 3F, 3L, 2A+2T+2T, 3S+3T, (any triple)*, and this would be the first ever ladies' 8-triple freeskate.

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Yes technically you can call it so.

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Asada did 8 triples in her Sochi LP.

But why settle for 8 when you can do 9!

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The question is, is an 8-triple program still an 8-triple program if it earns points for only 7 triples and earns zero points for the 8th triple? How does that 8th triple count if it has zero BV, and how is such a program "technically" the first ladies 8-triple FS any more than Mao Asada's 8-triple FS (in which every triple earned at least some BV)?

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Originally Posted by largeman
The question is, is an 8-triple program still an 8-triple program if it earns points for only 7 triples and earns zero points for the 8th triple? How does that 8th triple count if it has zero BV, and how is such a program "technically" the first ladies 8-triple FS any more than Mao Asada's 8-triple FS (in which every triple earned at least some BV)?
This ^

If Zayak'ed jumps (ie. invalid elements) counted, then there'd be no point stopping at 8 triples - May as well Zayak multiple times and go for the first "12 triples" program. Or the first "20 triples" program...

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I'm sure Elaine Zayak could pull off an 8-triple skate as early as the 1980s

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Originally Posted by qwerty
I'm sure Elaine Zayak could pull off an 8-triple skate as early as the 1980s
And well, many other skaters could hit that also...
I wonder what would be the max triple number if there was no Zayak rule =)

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Originally Posted by moriel
And well, many other skaters could hit that also...
I wonder what would be the max triple number if there was no Zayak rule =)
In which case we might as well rename the sport 'ice jumping."

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Originally Posted by moriel
And well, many other skaters could hit that also...
I wonder what would be the max triple number if there was no Zayak rule =)
During GPF practices Medvedeva was doing her normal layout with combinations changed to 3-3-3. So that would already be a 9 triple program she's perfectly capable of doing, probably even more.

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Maybe we could change the rules so Zhenia can get more points

https://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/pkd...in-block.0.gif

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I'd be happy if she can just perform her jumps consistently two years from now.

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Originally Posted by moriel
I wonder what would be the max triple number if there was no Zayak rule =)
Do we keep the current well-balanced program rules and just remove the restrictions on repeating the same triple?

The current rules allow 7 jump passes in a ladies' freeskate, which can include three jump combinations of two jumps each, or one of them can include three jumps. That would make a total of 11 jumps. One of the jumps must be an axel.

So, if you have a skater who can do triple axel, she could do 11 triple jumps within those slots. She would just have to repeat more than two jumps, or do the same jump more than twice, to fill that slot.

Or any of the combinations could be replaced by a jump sequence. In a jump sequence the number of jump is not limited, but only the two hardest jumps count for points, at 80% of the base value. So if a skater wanted to do, say, 3S, half loop, change feet, 3T, mazurka, waltz jump, 1T, 3T, that should be considered one jump sequence with three triples . . . that would be worth 80% of a 3S+3T combination.

Or are you asking, what if there were no rules at all, how many triples could a skater execute within a 4-minute time period without stopping? Should she also include 3 spins and a step sequence and choreo sequence, even if they're all as simple and brief as possible to save time and energy for more triples?

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Originally Posted by gkelly
so, if you have a skater who can do triple axel, she could do 11 triple jumps within those slots. She would just have to repeat more than two jumps, or do the same jump more than twice, to fill that slot.
3a, 3t+3t+3t, 3t+3t, 3t+3t, 3t, 3t, 3t.

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That'd do it.

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Originally Posted by gkelly
Or are you asking, what if there were no rules at all, how many triples could a skater execute within a 4-minute time period without stopping?
According to these statistics compiled by coaches Christy Krall and Trevor Laak, no jump requires as long as a full second of air time. A quad toe has about 0.63 seconds in the air and a triple toe less than half a second.

https://skatecoach.wordpress.com/201...s-trevor-laak/

A 4-minute program has 240 seconds. Assuming you didn't waste a lot of time setting up ("telegraphing") you should be able to do a couple hundred easily.

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