Lyrics in programs: Yay or Nay? Now the Season is Over

Mangomango said:

But I absolutely ADORE Miyahara's Miss Saigon Now, that is how to properly use lyrics in a programme!

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I liked "Miss Saigon" a lot, too, but disagree re: the lyrics. I was so focused on Satoko's skating and enjoying it so much that when the lyrics began it felt like a movie being stopped abruptly right in the middle. At that point, for me the "spell" was broken.

This isn't an across-the-board "nay" -- just an example of how lyrics in a program can be an enhancement to one person and an unwelcome distraction to someone else.

Has anyone heard how judges feel about lyrics in this season's programs? If music plays into their decisions (which it probably does, consciously or unconsciously) I'd really be curious to know how lyrics are affecting their observation & scoring, if at all.

Some of the programs that have lyrics don't bother me but overall I say NAY!

I have no clue why but last year watching Chock/Bates skate and hearing the lyrics during their Les Miz program was just so embarrassing that I couldn't pay attention to what they were doing because I couldn't look at them. I really can't explain why and it sounds stupid but hearing the singers just made it worse and I don't think I would have felt the same if it was just music :confused2:

And watching Gracie Miss America her away through "Wishing you were somehow here again" is a tragedy. Adding the lyrics did nothing but prove that Gracie isn't much of an artist at this moment and that she has no clue what she's doing besides the elements

I don't think lyrics should have been allowed for competitions, although I get that the ISU is trying to appeal to a larger audience. They seem to add false interpretive power to a performance, one that doesn't come from the skaters themselves. And, as others have noted, they often distract and detract away from the skater as well.

...but when you look at a well constructed program like this, it proves it can work. It just need to be done creatively, carefully, and thoughtfully. It takes combined efforts from the choreographer, editor and skater, and finally the audience who are open minded enough to view something different.

I am so in love with this program.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01dPtTWGAVE

I really enjoy the US men's this year (Abbott, Carriere, Dornish). Surprised myself. I admit I have a weakness for Coldplay, saw them live at the London Viva La Vida tour (where Simon Pegg made a surprising guest appearance from the crowd stand 5 meters from me, jamming with his harmonica with members of the band)

Just because something hasn't proven to generally work, doesn't mean there shouldn't be the freedom to use it - should one choose it. The scope of possibilities are endless if the skaters are up to the challenge.

os168 said:

...but when you look at a well constructed program like this, it proves it can work. It just need to be done creatively, carefully, and thoughtfully. It takes combined efforts from the choreographer, editor and skater, and finally the audience who are open minded enough to view something different.

I am so in love with this program.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01dPtTWGAVE

I really enjoy the US men's this year (Abbott, Carriere, Dornish). Surprised myself. I admit I have a weakness for Coldplay, saw them live at the London Viva La Vida tour (where Simon Pegg made a surprising guest appearance from the crowd stand 5 meters from me, jamming with his harmonica with members of the band)

Just because something hasn't proven to generally work, doesn't mean there shouldn't be the freedom to use it - should one choose it. The scope of possibilities are endless if the skaters are up to the challenge.

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This is exactly my thoughts! Wahoo!

I don't mind vocal if there is no voice over by the commentators.

They talk too much. Japanese commentators, Russian (thank God sometimes they only talk at the beginning and at the end of the program), the German (OMG they talk like there is no end).

In these case no vocals is better. Jus image if skaters chose loud music with screaming voice aka metal...

The Dornbush program had a really good transition - from no voice, to voice as instrument, to lyrics. Even with the lyrics, I couldn't understand them very well, so I didn't try, but stayed with the program and just let them wash over me.

But for me that video illustrated how disconcerting it can be if we hear OR see things we're not expecting. I found the camera work with the dissolves so distracting, that at first I thought they were actually leaving out parts of the program (like in the replays!). After a while I realized that the music was continuous, and only the picture was choppy. Did anyone else find the special effects on the picture transitions distracting?

Welcome to Golden Skate, NanaPat! Post long and often!
I find The Cup of China overhead camera during spins is always disruptive to the program.

For me, lyrics so far are definetely a NAY. I think that (more often than not) they seem to overwhelm the program itself, so I don't focus on the skater's way of telling his/her story and instead I tend to follow the song...it's really distracting and annoying, expecially when the song has vary strong vocal parts (for exemple Je suis malade). I don't mind the vocals parts when they're soft and maybe not even full songs, like in Dornbush's case, but I still like it more when there are no lyrics whatsoever. Plus, I don't like it when the commentators speak too much, but I like it when they just try to underline some elements of the program, and with lyrics everything is more difficult to understand and appreciate.

As of right now (re: the ladies) programs with lyrics I can't stand:

- Viktoria Helgesson's SP: whiny song, zero connection to the music, just a big fat NO.
- Gracie Gold's FS: the opera voice is just too shrill and loud, and Gracie's clueless portrayal of the story behind the lyrics hurts my feelings.
- Anna Pogorilaya's SP: the vocals are too big and overpowering; she match the power of the music and it runs over her.
- Kanako Murakami's FS: a cacophony of vocals that result in an auditory mess
- Ashley Wagner's FS: some of the vocals are okay but her music edit sounds really jumbled and loud a few times in the program too

I will hold off judgement since I really adored the use of lyrics in Denney and Frazier's free skate. That was a clever use of lyrics to assist with the build up of the finale of the program.

I don't really have any objection for this but some of the music sounds so low-quality like they just ripped it straight from the radio or something. If they can choose the right music-good choreo- not only because they feel that they like it, plus a decent quality music, then I will say yay.

I'm going to be on the fence for this one. So far, the use of lyrics isn't that great majority-wise but that the same time, it's still a new rule. I'm gonna wait after a season or two. hwell:

Maybe it's just that I'm not used to it yet but so far I must say I've found the lyrics a bit disturbing. I may change my mind in a year or two I hope.

It seems that the ISU is bound and determined to combine all the worst elements of various systems

Extreme focus on micro-issues of technique that casual fans don't especially care about? check

Dedication to secrecy about judging leading to widespread speculation on judging malfeasance? check

Pandering to lowest common denominator taste by allowing lyrics and weakening the line between competition and exhibition? check

I fully expect celebrity judges and props to be allowed next.

Is this the direction people really want to go in?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwWknPW_SMg

So far, I say nay.

In most of the programs I have seen so far, I think the lyrics actually detract from the actual skating.

Yea when I like the songs and nay when I don't. Lol

I was really exciting to see beautiful lyrics program for each skaters, but for now I don't like all of lyrics song that each skaters choose. Non of skaters does not really connects with music at all. IMO, skaters choose lyrical song in order to get attention from audience, but for me it actually make me annoying. I personality like to see someone skate to Adele's song or Aguilera's song.

I have been enjoying the "Half Term Report" style threads that Totentanz has been starting recently. And, reading them, I realised that now would be an appropriate time to revive this thread.

We are now half-way through the season, and so have seen the majority of programmes that we are going to see.

I have been very vocal about how much I hate the idea of including lyrics in competition programmes. Right from when it was approved, I said that I thought the lyrics would be too distracting, and you would not be able to concentrate on the skating itself.

Lo and behold, when we started getting programmes that included lyrics, that is exactly what happened. My concentration would drift off during those programmes that included lyrics. And, hence, I would tend to not enjoy these programmes as much as the more “traditional” programmes with instrumental music.

However, since then, I have got a surprise. There have been programmes with lyrics that I have not drifted off during, and hence have enjoyed. To be precise, a grand total of THREE programmes!!!


Javier Fernandez SP: “Black Betty” by Ram Jam

I have been crying out for more rock music in figure skating for years, so I am probably a bit biased when it comes to Javi's SP. HOWEVER, the thing that I like about it is that it is predominantly still an instrumental programme. The lyrics are not used excessively (they are only used twice in the whole programme), and are not overbearing. Yes, there is one full verse used, but it does not take over. You are still able to concentrate on Javi’s skating. And before the big guitar finale at the end of the programme, 2 further lines are included. But that is it.

In short, whoever put together the music for Javi’s SP has got the balance between lyrics and no lyrics spot on.


Jeremy Ten FS: “Hallelujah” by Jeff Buckley

Again, I am biased because I love the song “Hallelujah”. No matter who is singing it, “Hallelujah” always gets me emotional – it is one of the most beautiful songs I have ever heard. “Hallelujah” is one of those songs where the vocals are almost part of the music. You cannot separate them. An instrumental version just wouldn’t sound right.

As I can’t think of anybody else using this song as a competition programme, I did a search on YouTube for “Hallelujah skate”. And every single figure skating video on the first few pages includes the lyrics. The first I found that did not is this video, and the music just did not sound right at all.

“Hallelujah” needs the lyrics to work. And when it works, boys does it work! And Jeremy Ten’s swansong FS just proved that. Boys, but I really hope he does well in Nationals and gets to go to Worlds!


Meagan Duhamel / Eric Radford FS: Muse medley (“Neutron Star Collision”, “I Belong to You” and “Uprising”)

Megan and Eric’s Muse medley FS is like Javi’s SP in that they do not go overboard on the lyrics. In the first song (“Neutron Star Collision”), there are no lyrics. In the middle song (“I Belong to You”), you barely notice that there are lyrics, they blend into the music so well.

It is only in the final song (“Uprising”) that the lyrics become prominent. But, although this song could work as a skating programme without the lyrics (can’t find one, so here is the instrumental version. Is it just me or does it remind you of the Doctor Who theme…?), the vocals actually add an extra dimension to the song.


I have already brought this up in the competition thread, but we saw the major drawbacks of using music with lyrics during the Ladies FS at the Italian Championships.

Roberta Rodeghiero was using a really iconic song, with the lyrics, for part of her medley. HOWEVER, there was a really bad edit from chorus to the verse. And because the lyrics were there, it really showed it up.

Unfortunately, I can’t find the video anywhere. But, since Italy has 3 slots at Europeans and Roberta finished 2nd in Nationals, we’ll probably be seeing it again in a couple of weeks.


Overall, I still feel that the competitions were a lot more enjoyable to watch when there were no lyrics. But, these three programmes show that, if you get the balance right, it can work.

But, given that this is only 3 programmes out of all the programmes we have seem, I am still leaning firmly towards the “nay”.

CaroLiza_fan

At first I didn't like the idea of having lyrics in music for competitive programs, because it seems like seeing another exhibition programs before gala shows. And I saw sometimes some music with lyrics automatically lead audiences' claps and cheers, so even top skaters often lost their tempo or missed their choreography. That means I have to put up with incomplete and low quality performances more than ever. However, I felt the music for Ashley's FP, Javi's both SP and FP, and Meite's SP and FP are so matched to their choreography and exciting for me to see their own interpretation to music. So I'm not against the changed rule. After all, the choice on whether to use such music or not is up to skaters, so if they are confident in using lyrics for their performances, then I'm okay with it.

Ah, Tatsuki's FP uses Beethoven Symphony No. 9 and some chorus passages are included in the edited music. It's funny I almost forgot the symphony is often referred to simply as "the Choral".