Gut Instinct vs Etiquette

Today I learned an important lesson - I should always trust my gut instincts.

So this is what happened yesterday. I had an unexpected expense and needed to come up with funds by next week. I looked around the house/garage to see what I could sell to help cover the expense. See, I'm not much of a "sales" person, never comfortable with haggling. So I figured I'd check what similar items are selling for, then lower it by 15-20% to make the listing more appealing. Priced to sell, not priced to sit in the garage for weeks.

I put a high-ticket item up for sale on Craigslist, and by that I meant the equipment cost $2000 new. I checked ebay's current and past listings, and these things usually go for $1000-1500 used. I posted mine for $800. (Yes, I can hear your collective face palms :hopelessness:, and I deserved all of it!) It's Christmas season, everyone is strapped for cash - that was my thinking. I also wasn't smart enough or have the time to put out a "feeler" ad to see what people are willing to pay. In another words, I low-balled myself.

That's not even the worst part.

I was surprised how quickly I got an email response. {red flag #1?} It took me longer to make the listing (picture taking and editing/formatting, spec-checking etc). The woman offered me $600. She didn't even ask about the condition of the item or any questions that one would expect. {red flag #2?} I discussed it with DH - do we wanted to sell it to her for $700? (see, I told you I suck at haggling!)... I wanted to say no, and wait for other offers, but he felt a bird in hand is better than two in the bush. (apparently he sucks too! ) So alright, we agreed to the $700 price and the woman said she will come at 7pm after rush hour subsided.

Gut feeling commenced. It was around noon at the time, and I hadn't had lunch yet.

An hour later, I got another email inquiry. I told the guy while technically the item hasn't sold yet, but someone else said they are coming for it tonight. The guy wrote back and said he's been looking for this model for over a year, and will offer $850 and come pick it up ASAP. My heart sank. Told DH I want to cancel the sale with the woman, and sell it to the second guy instead. DH said while it sucks we're losing out on the $150, it's wrong to back out of an agreement. Apparently I married Ned Flanders, if Ned Flanders use swear words. While I get his PoV, I don't think it's morally wrong to back out of the sale? After all, item is not sold until cash is in my hand and item leaves my property. Right?

Had to tell the second guy again, I wish he had contacted me first, but I'm trying to do the right thing even if it meant I'm losing out on extra money. Boy this guy is persistent, he wrote back and said if the woman isn't matching his offer, I shouldn't sell it to her.

Gut feeling continued to grow. It's now 3pm. Lunch and my stomach seem to be having a disagreement.

This whole time I never told the woman about the other guy's offer. Big mistake? I think a little part of me wonder if those two are working as a team. You know how it goes, going back to the 1st guy after the 2nd guy flakes, and now 1st guy offering less than before.

7pm, no show. 7:30pm, still no show. 7:45pm, she contacted me saying traffic is horrible and she's about 20 minutes away. Very annoyed.
8:10pm. Finally I saw a truck coming. And whoever is driving backed their truck into my driveway! WHO THE *bleep* DOES THAT?!!

I opened the garage, and there was a guy. I thought I was dealing with a woman? This has to be the weirdest and unfriendliest person I've ever dealt with on CL, buy or sell. I tried to say hi, but he just cut me off saying he's here to pick up the item. I said, ok here it is. He looked around my garage then grabbed his phone. Well, the woman on the other end sure sounds like the one I've been dealing with. He told her he's at X place for Y item, and to confirm the price. He gave me the cash, and I asked: "You don't want to test things out first?" He declined. {red flag red flag red flag!} I asked if he needed DH's help to load it into his truck, he didn't say anything, and started to load the equipment.

My stomach is at my throat. These guys has got to be flippers. But I had to count the cash before he leaves, and count it twice more because this fella is a serious ball of bad vibe. He haphazardly place the equipment in his truck, scratched my garage door on the way out. (it's a tall item, which is why I asked if he needed help loading!)

My gut is telling me to tell the guy the sale is off. My gut is screaming at me to give back the money and tell him to unload the equipment. My gut is pleading at me to give the guy $20 gas money and to gtfo my house.

My gut is extremely disappointed with my lack of gumption.

Today they posted the equipment on ebay for $1599.


*** MORAL OF THE STORY: Never accept the first offer no matter how desperate, and always ALWAYS trust your gut instincts. ***

Awww I'm sorry for your misfortune but I want to thank you for cheering my day up immensely! You're quite the storyteller; I swear I was laughing in tears at times

Also thank you for the life lesson!

TMC is right, you're quite the storyteller. I'm sorry about your experience but I was laughing as well. Not with you but with the way how you were telling the story.

*** MORAL OF THE STORY: Never accept the first offer no matter how desperate, and always ALWAYS trust your gut instincts. ***

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First of all, the moral of the story is that you should never put the exact price that you want to cash, like 800 USD in your case. You always go for a bigger price, then you deal.

Was it the bit about Ned Flanders? Damn do-gooders and their morals, man! Glad it cheered you up, TMC haha.

I guess it's extra upsetting because I got ripped off while being a decent and honest person. It would've been different if I was conned while being a giant douchebag. It would've been "okay" if the people buy it to use, instead of buying for the sole intention of profit.

Should have cancel the sale during any of the red-flag moments. You guys think I could tell the shady guy to leave my house, without getting harmed? Or without him taking his anger out on my stuff/car?

Alba said:

First of all, the moral of the story is that you should never put the exact price that you want to cash, like 800 USD in your case. You always go for a bigger price, then you deal.

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Yea, now I realize. I just don't sell often, and even reading some good tips online.... none of them mention "wait a few days for other offers".

When I'm a buyer, I dislike the artificially increase the price so it seems like you're getting a discount, and generally don't respond to those ads. My general rule of thumb is 50% off new price. If I had posted the ad on ebay, I would have gotten 400-500 more, even after fees. (although I've never use "Local Pickup" option - is it safe?) I've had positive experience with their fraudulent resolution department, so it's nice having an arbitration when needed.

Lesson learned! Just wish the lesson was learned on something less expensive. hwell: Now I know how to spot fake inquiries (spammer to get your email), how to make a listing (for higher price, just like Alba said), how to stand firm (and tell con-artist to F-off)... and also to listen to my belly!

I think this is the thread to share my story as well, only it's called "Gut Instinct vs Wanting to Spend Less."

You all know where this is going.

DB wants a Playstation 4, however the price we have to pay for a Brazilian product (taxes) is ridiculous, so we started searching in a private network that is supposed to be trustworth. We found a dude that was offering the PS4 for around 600 dollars, reasonably less than other offers and with a plus: He would send the FIFA14 game!

We decided to keep it, and the problems started. The seller started procrastinating to send the product, and a red flight appeared in our minds. The thing is, with retirement and a move going on, we sticked with it. The product didn't arrive. At the same time, there was an incredible offer at Walmart for 650 dollars, but sadly we had already paid. After a long time, the product arrived...

And didn't work.

We sent it back, requesting a new console. At least 2 weeks later, the product arrived. We tested it. Guess what? It didn't work again, and it was the same console, which btw had been burned because the own seller didn't know it wasn't bi-volt.

We are waiting. We told the seller we want out money back, or we will involve external people (conections ). The product has yet to arrive in the seller's city, but we are waiting.

The seller better send us the money back, or hell will break loose

I've been thinking about your story rollerblade, from a moral point of view and also what I would have done in your shoes.

I think I agree with your swearing Ned Flanders ( ) husband: once you agreed to sell, it would have been wrong to take back your word. From a safety point of view it would have been both even more wrong and very risky to cancel the sale once the buyer was already in your garage picking the thing up.

They may have been questionable people and impolite for sure for being late but in the end they didn't really do anything wrong legally, they just grabbed an opportunity when one presented itself. I would never do that, I mean buy something for clearly less than it was worth because I'd think it was either cheating an innocent or there was something wrong with the product, but for someone less scrupulous I can see the attraction. And they didn't break the law in any way. I think if you had cancelled you would have been in the wrong even more than the buyers, no matter how much it must have stung to be in your position at the time.

Also having to go through with this obviously taught you (and us by extension!) a very valuable lesson! Thank you again for sharing your story I'm much like you in this kind of stuff - I too sell stuff online all the time and I'm sure I get shafted more often than not because I'm always just trying to get it over with fast and then regretting it afterwards. In future I think I'll be putting more thought into pricing and such!

For what it's worth I've just told the story to my husband and asked him what he thinks... and he thinks the exact opposite of me! Basically he says it doesn't matter what you promise someone, in the end you have to look after yourself and make the most of it! Apparently because they're strangers it's different XD

It seems to me what bothers you so much are:

1. You sold the item for lower than you could have.

2. You don't like your buyer(s).

3. You resent that what you just sold is being flipped immediately for twice as much.

For me, one's emotions are always internally chosen rather than externally caused. IOW, you choose how you feel and how you react to the happenings. I would look at the issues this way:

1. You lowballed yourself, knowingly, willingly, and calculatingly. You and your husband had your reasons to set the price your did and you agreed to and received an amount close to what you wanted. Didn't you achieve your goal, i.e. getting the amount you wanted within the time limit you set?

2. You chose and accepted the buyers, who didn't actually do anything wrong, other than being late with a reasonable excuse, and the pickup guy being unpleasant. They buy low and sell high, which is the basic principle of the business of sales. You presented them with an excellent business opportunity and they took it, fast. (If they didn't, somebody else would, including the second prospect who would likely not have raised his offer.) I'm sure they would gladly pay your asking price but naturally they tried to bargain. A deal was made and concluded quickly without much trouble with both sides making good of their end of the deal. You will have no relationship with them from now on. You don't have to like them. Continuing to be bothered by them is your choice when they are already gone from your life.

3. The item was sold and no more yours. You received the agreed amount for it and have no more relationship/ownership/rights to it. It has left your life. You didn't sell it with the condition that the new owner would keep and cherish it. It does you no good to feel bad that someone is making money with it. Will you feel better if it brings bad luck to its current and future owners? Again, the feeling is your choice.

I say 1) Don't lowball yourself again. In this case, you could have asked for a minimum $1000 and get it quickly, more if your item is of very good condition. But once you decide on the price (+ 10% for bargaining) and get it, be glad you accomplish your goal and now you can use the money for what you have intended.

2) Along the way, there are different views on when the deal is binding and done. It depends on your comfort level. You could have renegotiated for a higher price or simply cancelled the first agreement when you didn't feel right about them. But whatever your choice of actions, you need to be comfortable and not have regrets later. Acceptance of consequences or "what is" is liberating. So can letting go - of the past, of unpleasant people, and of things no more in your life. Choose to feel good now, in this moment, because that's all there is.

I sell on ebay quite a bit and one of the features I like is "Best Offer." I did the Auction and Best Offer at the same time. I set a starting price and then put parameters on the Best Offer...such as an amount that was acceptable to me which I could accept or not. I didn't want to be bothered with real low end bids. I only use the Best Offer feature for high dollar auctions.

One way to look at it is you sold the item; you have money that you didn't have before. I think you're OK!!

I am not a Craig List person. Too many bad people ruin good deals.

On ebay you sell for a minimum amount you set while on CL and other classified your asking price is usually the best you can expect. But on ebay you are responsible for delivery though not its cost. Also on ebay you don't deal verbally with the potential buyer, a plus for someone who doesn't like or is not good at bargaining.

I recently helped a friend buy a like-new item on ebay, saving 50% from buying new while sitting at home for the ordering and the delivery. I think she is happy with the experience even though she was apprehensive.

SkateFiguring said:

On ebay you sell for a minimum amount you set while on CL and other classified your asking price is usually the best you can expect...

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You can do the same on ebay.

SkateFiguring said:

1. You lowballed yourself, knowingly, willingly, and calculatingly. You and your husband had your reasons to set the price your did and you agreed to and received an amount close to what you wanted. Didn't you achieve your goal, i.e. getting the amount you wanted within the time limit you set?

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Come to think of it, I could've just put the bill on my CC, have until February to pay in full without interest, and would have quite a bit more time to handle this.

Simply put - I settled on the B.S. offer because I did not know the market. Or you may use stronger negative words and call us dumb/ignorant. (also didn't know not to accept the 1st offer, among other things, but that's a separate subject) Didn't know the item's popularity because there aren't many reasonable used ones for me to reference. ie: I myself would not buy one used for $1500, when I can get it new for $2000 directly from manufacturer, shipped to my house. Not sure about you.

There was only 1 comparable item on our local CL, and that seller listed theirs for $399. The pictures they used are terrible, and the ad sat for a few weeks. It was lowered to $299 few days ago. Wonder why it hasn't sold. A skeptic may say it's a FAKE listing, created by... ya'know, a certain type of buyers. I fell for that trap. Will not make the same mistake in the future.

I did look on eBay for their average price (or "overpriced" like I mentioned above). But I didn't double-check those sellers ID and location. Had I done that, I might have caught on that these guys are professionals. It was my oversight. Will not make the same mistake in the future.

I made MANY mistakes in this transaction. Did you know there's such thing as CL price alert? I sure didn't! DH Flanders told me not to beat myself up about it. Consider it my tuition.

SkateFiguring said:

2. You chose and accepted the buyers, who didn't actually do anything wrong, other than being late with a reasonable excuse, and the pickup guy being unpleasant. They buy low and sell high, which is the basic principle of the business of sales. You presented them with an excellent business opportunity and they took it, fast. (If they didn't, somebody else would, including the second prospect who would likely not have raised his offer.) I'm sure they would gladly pay your asking price but naturally they tried to bargain. A deal was made and concluded quickly without much trouble with both sides making good of their end of the deal. You will have no relationship with them from now on. You don't have to like them. Continuing to be bothered by them is your choice when they are already gone from your life.

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The buyers didn't do anything wrong per se; besides scratching my garage door, which he didn't even apologize for. On the same token, there's nothing wrong if I refused to waste >1hr waiting for tardy people. Goes both ways. Afterall, the agreement was 7pm not 8:10pm; if you want to be technical about it. She didn't even contact me about "her" tardiness until 45 minutes AFTER she's supposed to show up. (What excuse will you give... I'm starting to wonder if you know or are them LOL). Would it be okay if we left home @8pm for a function, and don't tell anyone until 8:45pm?

I sold other large items [/B] to two other couples just a week before. Both couples showed up when they say they would. Nobody damaged anything on the way out. None of them parked their vehicles on my driveway. Nor did they check around other things in my garage (and I mean looking under table, behind boxes). Seriously, what are you looking for - hidden cameras? Why act shifty if you aren't shifty? Quack quack.

Not sure what you're going on about the... "Continuing to be bothered by them is your choice when they are already gone from your life."... bit. So what if I got upset about stuff that you don't? It's not like this happened 10 years ago. I'll get over it, and a whole lot quicker than getting over the low-balled PCS Mao received for her Sochi FS.

TMC said:

For what it's worth I've just told the story to my husband and asked him what he thinks... and he thinks the exact opposite of me! Basically he says it doesn't matter what you promise someone, in the end you have to look after yourself and make the most of it! Apparently because they're strangers it's different XD

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Haha. Most men do kinda veer the Godfather way of "It's not personal. It's business." Or Monty Burns' way.

Dee4707 said:

I sell on ebay quite a bit and one of the features I like is "Best Offer." I did the Auction and Best Offer at the same time. I set a starting price and then put parameters on the Best Offer...such as an amount that was acceptable to me which I could accept or not. I didn't want to be bothered with real low end bids. I only use the Best Offer feature for high dollar auctions.

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Oh thanks for the tip, Dee! I've only used the normal Bid/Buy It Now feature. Does the system automatically accept the highest offer you receive, as long as it meet your pre-set minimum? Or do you have a chance to review them? And do you wait for the last day of your auction to accept/decline those offers?

rollerblade said:

Oh thanks for the tip, Dee! I've only used the normal Bid/Buy It Now feature. Does the system automatically accept the highest offer you receive, as long as it meet your pre-set minimum? Or do you have a chance to review them? And do you wait for the last day of your auction to accept/decline those offers?

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I was able to pick and choose which bids I would accept. It runs however many days you post it to be for sale. On waiting, I normally will either accept the bid closest to what I want ... sometimes no one makes an offer. It just depends on how much you want to sell your item for. I don't have the rules before me but once you accept an offer, the auction ends. I have put things on ebay and no one bids, I relist and I have 4 or more bids. Crazy!!!