US team envelopes for 2004-2005 season

Jaana · May 9, 2004

Here was posted the info about team-envelopes by P. Murray:

http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/SkateFans/message/132965

The full info about team envelopes:

http://www.usfigureskating.org/shell.asp?sid=24936

Excerpt (teams A & B):

> Team A
Ladies: Sasha Cohen, Amber Corwin, Michelle Kwan

Men: Evan Lysacek, Johnny Weir, Michael Weiss

Pairs: Rena Inoue & John Baldwin

Dance: Tanith Belbin & Ben Agosto

Team B
Ladies: Jennifer Kirk, Ann Patrice McDonough, Kimmie Meissner, Katy Taylor

Men: Jordan Brauninger, Timothy Goebel, Ryan Jahnke, Matt Savoie, Scott Smith, Christopher Toland

Pairs: Jennifer Don & Jonathon Hunt; Shantel Jordan & Jeremy Barrett; Katie Orscher & Garrett Lucash; Tiffany Scott & Philip Dulebohn; Brittany Vise & Nicholas Kole

Dance: Loren Galler-Rabinowitz & David Mitchell; Kendra Goodwin & Brent Bommentre; Melissa Gregory & Denis Petukhov; Morgan Matthews & Maxim Zavozi >

WOW, WOW, WOW for Lysacek!!!

bronxgirl · May 9, 2004

I don't understand how the USFA makes decisions on who gets in which envelope. Why is Jenny Kirk not in team A? Is it because of her World's disaster? I'm not asking the questions to dis any skater, I truly just don't know how the envelope system works?

Joesitz (RIP) · May 9, 2004

Thanks Jaana - I presume skaters listed in Group A have the pick of the Grand Prix sites and what's left over is for Group B to choose and then C and lastly Reserve. Am I correct?

Also some names are listed in black print while most are in red. Any reason for this?

Kirk is in B and I think Liang should be in B, if not, A.

These Gran Prix events are important for the 2nd tier skaters. They don't get the 'Presentation' experience Cohen and Kwan get in the COI. I noticed Yebin Mok is in Reserve and the Grand Prix experience would help her to get rid of the jitters.

Good question, Bronxgirl. What is the criteria for thse envelopes?

Joe

nthuz · May 9, 2004

http://www.usfigureskating.org/Shell.asp?sid=21150

The names in red have bios.

Copy/paste the above address for envelope criteria

Lotta · May 9, 2004

I'm glad Amber Corwin got a higher spot on the thing along with Michelle and Sasha.

Not surprised at all that Sarah Hughes ain't there.

lil_icesk8er915 · May 9, 2004

WHAT!?

I totally agree with bronxgirl and Joesitz! Why the heck are Beatrisa Liang and Jenny Kirk not on Team A!? I think that is an outrage Beatrisa is on team C! Kimmie Meissner and Katy Taylor are only Junior skaters and they are on team B ahead of Beatrisa, and Beatrisa is a Senior lady and placed top 10 at Nationals!

And I don't understand why Amber Corwin is on team A and she placed 4th at Nationals (Good for her though!) and Jenny placed 3rd at Nationals and she's on team B! Will someone explain? Lol!

Verbalgirl77 · May 9, 2004

The high placement of Amber & Evan is due to their medals at the 4CC which carry much more weight. Jenny & Bebe didn't compete at 4CC.

sk8m8 · May 9, 2004

Broxgirl, I wouldn't worry about Jenny getting to skater her fair share of GP events, They HAVE to include Kwan and she has only been doing one GP event, usually Skate America. If they know this in advance (and I assume that they do) then shellys spots for the remainder of the season go to other skaters.

I'm also not sure if Kirk is 100% at the moment and these decisions are made with the "knowns" of the moment up to the deadline. Just make sure you have cable with VCR+ or a timer so you can catch these GP competitions when they show them in the middle of the night

bronxgirl · May 9, 2004

I'm still confused. What if this is the year Michelle wants to test out the CoP at the Grand Prix? Jenny did place well at last year Grand Prix events (didn't she medal? -maybe not- just don't recall). And if the 4CC is so important, why did so many choose not to go to the point that Jennifer Don was sent (and she's a stronger pairs skater). And what abut Beatrisa? I just don't get it at all :\ :\

SusanBeth · May 9, 2004

Team A - This envelope consists of the highest performing athletes in ISU Championships.
Automatic for:
U.S. senior champions
Placement in top 10, 2004 World Figure Skating Championships
Medalists (top 3), 2004 Four Continents Figure Skating Championships
Medalists (top 3), senior Grand Prix Series Final
Consideration for World senior medalists in the previous two seasons who have retained their eligible status and have committed to competing in the 2004-05 competition year.

Team B - This envelope consists of high performing athletes in national or international competitions.

Automatic for:
Medalists (top 3), 2004 World Junior Figure Skating Championships
Skaters who qualify for the senior Grand Prix Final (non-medalists)
Medalists (top 3), Junior Grand Prix Final
Places 2-4 in senior-level events at the U.S. Championships
U.S. junior champions
Consideration for top 5* ladies and men and top 4* pairs and dance in the U.S. ranking system after Worlds.
*The ICMS will determine the number based on the strength of the events entered.

This is part of the criteria listed in the above link. The teams make more sense going by this.

mpal2 · May 9, 2004

From what I understand, the team envelopes have a lot more to do with funding than competition assignment. That just means that Team A gets more traning money than Team B.

bronxgirl · May 9, 2004

mpal2 said:
From what I understand, the team envelopes have a lot more to do with funding than competition assignment. That just means that Team A gets more traning money than Team B.

So up and coming skaters, who don't have endorsement deals or are from wealthy families, get less money, than skaters who are already well known (eg. Cohen and Kwan)? That's even dumber than I thought :eek:

Longhornliz · May 9, 2004

I also think they want to spread out the talent in the different envelopes so that the US has a stonger chance for making it to the podium at every event. I'm surprised about how they were assigned this year, but I think we will still get to see some of the lesser known skaters if espn covers events like 4cc and nhk.

dorispulaski · May 9, 2004

Yes, and it has always been this dumb. Elaine Zayak, when she finally qualified for funding, told the USFSA to keep the funding for skaters who needed it. Her father's bar patrons were funding her skating via a collection jar on the bar. Apparently there had been games with her getting any until she had a world medal.
Similar games seem to be being played with Jane Bugaeva. Jane was significantly better than Danielle Kahle, but Kahle finished 8th and Bugaeva 9th. This made no sense until I found out that the funding break for Team C is 8th. Same old same old. Bugaeva's coach is not one of the well known ones.

Sylvia · May 9, 2004

DORISPULASKI said:
Similar games seem to be being played with Jane Bugaeva. Jane was significantly better than Danielle Kahle, but Kahle finished 8th and Bugaeva 9th. This made no sense until I found out that the funding break for Team C is 8th. Same old same old. Bugaeva's coach is not one of the well known ones.

The USFS has traditionally favored the skaters that win medals at international events (senior and junior). Kahle was 10th in her senior debut at 2004 Nationals (9th in the FS to Bugaeva's 10th) and 11th at Junior Worlds, but she won a gold and a silver in her two Jr. Grand Prix competitions last fall and qualified for the JGP Final. Winning a junior or senior international medal guarantees Team C and usually leads to more assignments. Even though I personally preferred Bugaeva's skating to Kahle's at Nationals, Jane was 6th in her one and only JGP. I'm hoping that Jane will get a JGP or senior B international this fall.

Joesitz (RIP) · May 9, 2004

I thought it was just about who has the first pick of the events they want.

But if it also to do with FUNDING then by all means give it to the skaters who don't need it - MK and SC.

BTW - Are there still enough funds what with ABC withdrawing from figure skating?

Joe

hockeyfan228 · May 10, 2004

If one of the criteria for Envelope A is

Consideration for World senior medalists in the previous two seasons who have retained their eligible status and have committed to competing in the 2004-05 competition year.

then it seems odd that Goebel wasn't put in Envelope A. He is the 2002 World Silver Medallist, qualified for this year's Grand Prix Final (fluky, but he qualified), and is the reigning Olympic bronze medallist. The USFSA had the discretion to do it according to their own rules. What is that about?

dr.frog · May 10, 2004

Joesitz said:
I thought it was just about who has the first pick of the events they want.

But if it also to do with FUNDING then by all means give it to the skaters who don't need it - MK and SC.

BTW - Are there still enough funds what with ABC withdrawing from figure skating?

You've got it backwards: the team envelopes are *all* about funding levels, not international assignments. You're right that the skaters who don't need it get the most money, but the team envelope funding is small change compared to the amounts skaters like MK get in appearance fees for the USFSA cheesefests anyway. The USFSA's contract with ABC runs until 2007 so those events are going to stick around a while longer (it's the ISU's separate ABC contract that has expired this year).

Joesitz (RIP) · May 10, 2004

Thanks dr.Frog. That sounds much better than what I was thinking.

Now one more thing. Even if the funding is a pittance, do those in Group A get more than those in Group B?

Joe

Sylvia · May 10, 2004

Joesitz said:
Even if the funding is a pittance, do those in Group A get more than those in Group B?

Yes. In the past, I've heard that A gets about twice as much money as B, B about twice as much C, C about twice as much as Reserve team. But, now, with the inevitable USFS budget cuts, I don't know how much this will impact the funding envelopes.

US team envelopes for 2004-2005 season

Jaana

bronxgirl

Joesitz (RIP)

nthuz

Guest

Lotta

lil_icesk8er915

Verbalgirl77

sk8m8

bronxgirl

SusanBeth

mpal2

bronxgirl

Longhornliz

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

Sylvia

Joesitz (RIP)

hockeyfan228

dr.frog

Joesitz (RIP)

Sylvia

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