Correct me if I'm wrong, but the long back outside-edge entrance for the lutz isn't really telegraphing, is it?
Best Ladies' 3Lutz ever?
- Thread starter LiamForeman
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but the long back outside-edge entrance for the lutz isn't really telegraphing, is it?
It's kind of hard to see and it's at practice. Her lutz was generally very good, but not her solo 3-lutz at Sochi.
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- Jan 25, 2013
I don't think it was "horrific" in the sense that it was particularly detrimental to the aesthetics of the overall program, but let's be real - if somebody mentions "leg wrap" one of the first (and one of the only) elite skaters to come to mind will be Ito.
Also, in that clip you posted, Midori does not hold the outside edge as well as other lutzers (watch it in slow motion). It's very deep on the outside edge going into the entry, but then it transfers over to an inside edge right at the takeoff. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyu8GYBRIjE&t=5m4s
The video even slows down to show that she's off the outside edge - would quite likely get a ! call under CoP. I get the jump overall is wonderful to watch, but if we're talking about a true lutz, there are much better (or at least "truer") lutzers than Ito.
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- Jan 25, 2013
I also disagree that explosive jumps aren't rewarded - but it's more for the top of the pack that they're rewarded. You see it in men's with superior quads (Chan) and explosive triple axels (Yan/Hanyu) getting higher GOE. In ladies too, the judges will reward explosive jumps with greater GOE (e.g. Kostner's telegraphed lutz will still get high GOE because of how big it is).
I do think though that lower-tier skaters who have explosive jumps aren't rewarded enough on the GOE front. e.g. Kexin Zhang in her SP at 2012 Worlds https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vqc-PmpRsgA#t=4m (this lutz didn't receive a single positive GOE, and it was one of the better lutzes in that SP, IMO - particularly the height and the delay in rotation).
I do think though that lower-tier skaters who have explosive jumps aren't rewarded enough on the GOE front. e.g. Kexin Zhang in her SP at 2012 Worlds https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vqc-PmpRsgA#t=4m (this lutz didn't receive a single positive GOE, and it was one of the better lutzes in that SP, IMO - particularly the height and the delay in rotation).
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Funny, Carolina's Lutz first jumps in to my mind. Even with the long telegraph, it has the speed, height, flow in and out. Plus her long limbs make it look very eye pleasing.
Yuna's are very good overall.
Liza's probably are the highest, especially comparing to her body height.
Tonya is a power house, she can beat most men's Lutz!
Ito's leg wrap never bothers me, it looks like she jumps so high, she doesn't even need to be technically sound.
Lu Chen is a specially case to me, she has the true outside-edge Lutz, and the delayed rotation almost looks like slow motion. However, it prone to underroation though.
Yuna's are very good overall.
Liza's probably are the highest, especially comparing to her body height.
Tonya is a power house, she can beat most men's Lutz!
Ito's leg wrap never bothers me, it looks like she jumps so high, she doesn't even need to be technically sound.
Lu Chen is a specially case to me, she has the true outside-edge Lutz, and the delayed rotation almost looks like slow motion. However, it prone to underroation though.
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- Jan 17, 2014
I am one of those who appreciate the different lutzes. I like the entrance and speed for Yuna Kim in her lutz combo, but not so much the solo. I love the flow out from Caro Kostner's lutz more than Yuna, it just is more elegant. For sheer beauty, Yebin Mok and Maria Butyrskayas true outside edge lutzes are peerless. Explosive wise, Tonya Harding wins hands town. Goodness, she launches her lutz like a kangaroo with no hesitation. Mentioned it before, my ideal lutz will have Yuna's entry and Caro's outflow on the exit. Should maybe also add Hardings explosiveness to it!
One of my favorite Lutz: https://youtu.be/GIU7Gsbkghg?t=163
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- Jan 25, 2013
I don't get this point. It wasn't her best lutz, but that's not a good example of how well and how she usually does her 3Z.
My order:
1) Harding
2) Kim
3) Sebestyen
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- Sep 14, 2008
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...what are you talking about? The rotation is the same regardless. We are talking about executing Triple jumps.
One example of that kind of huge jumping with "better" technique would be Brian Orser - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1TLmtf0CzI&t=50s
He keeps his feet tighter and you can see how far above the ice the rotation slows down so as not to over-rotate the jump. Men have different centers of gravity than women, though. I'm not sure that you can expect a woman to be able to jump that powerfully and tightly and break out of a jump exactly like that.
No, that's not how it works. There is a whole different feel involved for a quad.
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- Jun 6, 2014
I agree, Yuna's solo 3Z at Sochi was not how she usually does her 3Z. Thank you for saying that. Just look at Worlds 2013 and you can see how huge Yuna's lutz is.
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- Mar 7, 2011
Am I going to get flamed if I say, Oksana Baiul? Her 3z was so high.
Currently I vote for Gracie.
Mirai had a really good one during the Freezer Arial Challenge.
http://web.icenetwork.com/video/v216788383
Currently I vote for Gracie.
Mirai had a really good one during the Freezer Arial Challenge.
http://web.icenetwork.com/video/v216788383
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:yes:
I'd also add these 2 for Sebestyen (the one in combination isn't perfect in the air, but from that angle you can really see the height):
https://youtu.be/qA8SeKBwx5c?t=35
https://youtu.be/qA8SeKBwx5c?t=137
I don't think so.
She had a great lutz.
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- Feb 27, 2012
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I would also have to go with Harding but a big shout out to the first lady to land a lutz in international competition and she had a pretty good one after a few more years of practice...Denise Biellman!
You know who else has beautiful jump flow out and leg extension? Li Zijun.
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- Feb 24, 2012
I am not sure who had the best triple lutz when on but I do like Yuna's - smooth, Chouinard, Thomson, Manley, Sebestyn, Rochette, Kostner, Harding all had a lot of power when they landed their lutzes (what is it about those Canadian girls when they are on their jumps are amazing). Maria Butyrskaya, Liza, Viktoria V all had nice lutzes though Maria's only when she wasn't so nervous - she skated like a lady. One person who definitely would not make best lutzes surprising is Michelle Kwan - they were consistent but puny and arguably she had some edge issues too.
