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Thread: Time Change in Short Program...Hmm!

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    Time Change in Short Program...Hmm!

    Recently at the 2004 ISU Governing Council this was passed:

    The short program in singles and pairs skating will last for a maximum of 2 minutes and 50 seconds (previously the limit was 2 minutes and 40 seconds) in order to allow more time for steps and transitions between the elements.

    Hmm...I wonder why they decided to change that one!

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    Actually, I remember a few pro skaters suggested making the SP longer when they started competing in pro-ams a few years ago. They found it hard to be restricted to the length after not having to skate an SP and compete under ISU rules for so many years.

    I believe the SP was even shorter back when it was first implemented (something like 2:10 or 2:20). The length was changed to 2:40 after the 1987/88 season, IIRC.

    Even though it's probably too late for pro skaters to benefit from this rule (there don't seem to be too many pro-ams around anymore), I think it's great the eligible skaters get a little more "breathing room" during the SP, so to speak!

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    Forum translator Ptichka's Avatar
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    The Protopopovs are also very much for increasing time for both programs. They make a pretty powerful argument about jam-packed programs being too hard on skaters, forcing many to finish off in what they call a "semi-consious state".

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    Originally posted by Ptichka
    The Protopopovs are also very much for increasing time for both programs. They make a pretty powerful argument about jam-packed programs being too hard on skaters, forcing many to finish off in what they call a "semi-consious state".
    The question is: How will the skaters use that extra time? Will it simply give them more breathing room or will they feel compelled to add more tricks (jumps, lifts, etc.)? If one of them uses it to add extra elements, then the others will have to in order to compete. This would not apply to the sp since there are only 8 elements, but I can see this happening in the long if more can be added within the limits provided by the rules.

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    Originally posted by Ptichka
    The Protopopovs are also very much for increasing time for both programs. They make a pretty powerful argument about jam-packed programs being too hard on skaters, forcing many to finish off in what they call a "semi-consious state".
    Bah the Protopopovs. They also think there should be no required elements, no restrictions. They want to turn the sport into something unjudgable and completely subjective. Basically, they want skating to move backwards. I don't take much of what they say with a grain of salt.

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    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    I don't think 10 seconds is going to break anyone's back. I foresee a lot of stopping and posing with the extra time.

    JOe

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    Arm Chair Skate Fan show 42's Avatar
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    It would be nice to see more moves extended........maybe the ten extra seconds would help in that respect....42

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    Keeper of Michelle's Nose berthes ghost's Avatar
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    Lynn: there are 8 required elements in the SP. No more, no less. Seeing as Surya is pro now, I doubt that anyone would be foolish enough to throw in an extra jump or spin. Not only will it not count, but they might even be penalized for it. Again, the SP has 8 elements, no more no less. Like the anouncement said, the extra 10 seconds to do allow for more time bewteen tricks, if the skater so requires.

    Pitchka and Thvdragon: I don't remember the Protopopovs saying any such thing. What I remember is them saying that the pairs LP had just become the pairs SP times 2. Everyone was so hyper to get in extra tricks and rack up the points, that they were missing out on creating a program. ie: if you do one throw jump, we know you can do one, do you really have to do two? For example: T&M's painfully boring WSS LP ranked above I&Z's more dynamic LP because T&M had 2 sets of sbs triples. :o

    Edited to add: well that is the spirit of the law as I understood it from that lengthy missive. Perhaps they did literally say make the SP longer at some point, but I think that their overall point was that skating shouldn't be a shopping list. In some ways I'm inclined to agree with them, as I'd watch Toller and them over Plushy and T&M any day of the week, but I've also come to accept that COP emphasises the athletic aspect of the sport more and at least tries to narrow the gap on subjectivity. It should be called the Oksana rule rather than COP.
    Last edited by berthes ghost; 06-15-2004 at 04:15 AM.

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    Originally posted by berthes ghost
    Pitchka and Thvdragon: I don't remember the Protopopovs saying any such thing. What I remember is them saying that the pairs LP had just become the pairs SP times 2. Everyone was so hyper to get in extra tricks and rack up the points, that they were missing out on creating a program. ie: if you do one throw jump, we know you can do one, do you really have to do two? For example: T&M's painfully boring WSS LP ranked above I&Z's more dynamic LP because T&M had 2 sets of sbs triples. :o
    It was in their borefest of a letter that was posted on the WSF site? Bah, I don't remember. I remember reading it at like 12am. The only thing keeping me awake were all the ridiculous ideas.

    TV

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    Forum translator Ptichka's Avatar
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    Originally posted by thvudragon
    It was in their borefest of a letter that was posted on the WSF site? Bah, I don't remember. I remember reading it at like 12am. The only thing keeping me awake were all the ridiculous ideas.
    Yup, it was there.

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    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    I think the change should be retroactive and they should give Michelle the 2004 World Championship. She was ahead of her time!

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    Thumbs up

    Good one Mathman!

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    Skating Freak Barbie
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    Hopefully the time will be used to hold positions a little more...can't think of much else that can come out of 10 more seconds...

    Kasey

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    LOL, great idea, Mathman! But, as Joe said, 10 seconds really isn't that much. Hopefully, it might give the skaters just a tad more "breathing" room.

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    PML at everyone who thinks that the changes is related to Kwan. What's next, then - a rule eliminating triple triples for ladies?

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