Olympics - Olympic Trials | Page 2 | Golden Skate

Olympics - Olympic Trials

soogar

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2003
I kind of feel bad for Pam just b/c I don't believe she wants to detract from the athletes. Did you notice how the camera kept following Pam to various areas of the arena. It looked like Pam was trying to get away from the camera but they kept finding her. I have to give Pam props for being cooler than I thought.

I hope Mohini and Tasha make the team. They're cool.
 

Longhornliz

Final Flight
Joined
Apr 1, 2004
It is my pet peeve how the gymnasts take a big wind up with their arms before doing a pirouette on the FX... in my book it doesnt matter that you can do a quad with an advanced leg position when you reach back 2 feet with your upper body. Just a tiny criticism from the ballerina in me, not that I can tumble to save my life, so I still have lots of respect for them.


I have a random idea, and I dont want to be overstepping my bounds because I know I definately dont put in the work that the moderators do. But I am anticipating that there will be tons of threads on the athens games when they open... I know this is a figure skating site, but maybe we could get another folder to keep all the olympics posts together? Or if that is too much work, could we come up with an organized way to keep all the posts together by discipline within le cafe... like have one of the mods create a thread for each discipline and we would post accordingly? Maybe there wont be that much interest, I know that I'm an olympic nut... and I dont want to miss out on the other friendly banter in our cafe because it is flooded with olympic dialouge.
 
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soogar

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2003
I'm not really impressed with the gymnast's turns/pirouettes on the floor or beam. I was a huge fan of gymnastics in the 80's and early 90's (when the Soviet team was great) and all of those gymnasts were able to enter and exit out of their pirouettes with style and grace. However I hear that the floor has more spring to it now than at that time so that might be why the girls don't have the control that they used to. I notice that the floor exercises by this American team was especially devoid of any dance elements or choreography. Even though Americans don't have a lot of style, I remember Missy Marlowe and Phoebe Mills had quite a few dance elements in their floor exercises and it looked like more than just tumbling runs. I also think the tumbling runs were more spectacular in the old days with Oksana Omelianchik's punch front to another full tumbling run. I don't know, supposedly gymnastics is so much more difficult but I think that the programs in the late 80's and 90's had more variety and style.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
I was struck by the hodge-podge of procedures that different sposts are using for their selection processes. As far as I can tell, Navrotalova was put on the team simply because she was selected by Billie Jean King, the team captain.

In ladies gymnastics, they kept making the point that these so-called "Olympic trials" are just a dog and pony show. As the commentators explained, the only thing they decided was that the top two finishers (so far, the two Courtneys) would be guarenteed an invitation to the training camp next month where the real selection takes place, apparently by just the opinion of the American Olympic coach and her staff.

As I understand it, this change in procedures was instituted in the wake of a poor performance by the American team in 2000, and the purpose of the selection procedure is to give the coaching staff the opportunity to seed the team with specialists in particular apparatuses, rather than just go with the top all-arounds.

Commentator Tim Daggert went even farther. One of the girls received a poor mark (9.1) on her vault, and the commentators speculated that the judging panel mistakenly believed that she either vaulted short or too much to the side. Television replays showed that this wasn't the case, so Daggert praised the new selection system form taking the decission-making power out of the hands of the judges, who might make a mistake, and allowing the coaching staff to override the judges marks.

Quite a bt different from figure skating. Except under very unusual circumstances, the top three at U.S. Nationals go to the Olympics, period.

Mathman
 

StillBlueLake

Rinkside
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
It does seem like with gymnastics that it's a bit unfair to even have a Nats and a Trials if they are just going to pick who they want anyway. But what can the girls do?
 

Johar

Medalist
Joined
Dec 16, 2003
Mohini Bhardwaj took my beath away! And to think she is 25! I want her to make the team so badly and win an individual Gold.


Do gymnast not do punch fronts on the Floor anymore? Mohini was the only one who had something like a punch front.

Mo Mo Mo Mo Mo!
 

soogar

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2003
Most sports rely on the results of the Olympic trials to decide the team (track and swimming etc). However I think that in performance sports it's better to make the selection just before the games. I think Nicole Bobek would have performed better in Nagano had the USFSA kept Tonia Kwiatkowski on the backburner if Nicole's performance fell off. Even though it's unfair to the athletes (esp since they use personal funds for training) , it does keep everyone on their toes. The Karolyis are firm believers in using uncertainty in bringing out the best team performance. I personally think that the panel needs to be bigger but the Karolyis know how to win Olympic Team gold so I guess it doesn't matter whose toes they step on.

I don't get this whole specialist format. As I've said before, I haven't watched gymnastics since 1996 and it's so weird how everyone keeps talking about being a specialist. How are they scoring the team event? I thought the top 5 scores counted so if the US is allowed 6 people, why would they even entertain the thought of having multiple "specialists" on the team. I'd rather have 5 girls who are good in all the events and one spectacular specialist. Other than that girl who did the triple turn mount on the beam, no one struck me as a spectacular specialist.
 

Piel

On Edge
Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 27, 2003
I was confused by the specialist talk too. Doe each girl on the team get to compete for the individual medals on each apparatus or do they take those who scored highest on each apparatus during the team competition and allow them to compete for the indiviual medals? Also, what is the status of Bela Kyroli? Does he still coach, have any girls being considered for the Olympic team, will he be a member of the U.S. coaching staff? If not, does anyone know why?
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Piel, I think Bela Karolyi is officially retired. His wife Marta is now the Olympic team captain. (According to this article Bela now spends his time herding exotic animals on his Texas ranch, LOL.)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A7808-2004Jun1.html

About specialists, I think the new rule is going to be that only the top three scores count for the team scores. This is especially important in men's this year because the top two American men, Paul Hamm (the favorite for all-around gold) and Sean Townsend are both relatively weak on the rings. So there is an opportunity for someone who is a specialist in that discipline to help the team, even if he is not in the top three in the other aparatuses.

Mathman
 

soogar

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2003
Thank you for the article link. I really like Martha's style. She is softer than Bela and she was the "real" coach of the Romanian team. She is the coach with the technical know how while Bela was very good with the psychology. I also think Martha is more impartial than Bela. It might be a fairer selection process than the past because before Bela definitely favored his own students over other coaches's pupils. It always seemed like a pissing match between Steve Nunno, Karolyi and Al Fong as to whose girls made the team with Al always coming up short.

If Martha likes working with other coaches and doesn't have her own students, she can make better decisions for the team. I also thought it was cool how Martha showed her pleasure when a girl would have a difficult element and hit her routine.
 

A.H.Black

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 1, 2004
As I understand it the format at the Olympics this year is-

Prelims - 6-5-4 - 6 on the team, 5 perform, 4 scores count

Finals - 6-3-3 - 6 on the team, 3 perform, all 3 count.

Thus the opportunity for "specialists" The U.S. women seem to be weakest in vault right now. Mohini Bhardwaj and Annie Hatch are very strong in vault so there is a lot of talk about them

Mohini also was at trials in 1996 and finished around 8th as I remember, then went to college. I noticed that NBC gave no coverage to Annia Hatch or Tia Orlando. Hatch had higher scores on both floor and vault than Mohini.

Remember, we won't know a thing (except that the top two get automatic bids to the last Karolyi camp) until July 18th after the last camp. I understand that 3 petitions to the camp have been accepted so there could be as many as 17 hopefuls at Karolyi's in July. If last years Worlds is anything to go by the whole team could change around several times before the opening day in Athens.
 

Piel

On Edge
Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 27, 2003
What do you guys think about Tasha Schwikert? Is she the Nicole Bobek of gymnastics?
 
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soogar

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2003
How does it work in terms of girls qualifying for the AA? Is it based on prelim scores or final scores or a combination of both? It is a new life AA right? Everyone starts from a fresh slate? What about event finals? Combination of all the scores or just the first two to qualify and then new life in the event final?

I don't think Tasha is a flake like Nicole. Mainly b/c they don't coddle girls in gymnastics as they do in skating. I wish they had a selection process like this in Nagano b/c if Nicole knew that she could have been replaced by Tonia K, I think she would have made sure to pace herself so she wouldn't get injured and had good practices in Nagano.

I think Tasha is extremely talented and I actually think she has the right idea. She needs to peak for the Olympics and since everyone has been commentating on her improvement, I'm sure Martha will take this in mind in making her selection. Plus Tasha did fairly well at the trials. I also think she might be better at handling pressure than Carly. I don't want to see what Carly is gonna do on beam at the Olympics. I think she'll be like Zmeskal. While CArly will go to Athens, I predict that she will not win AA. I think that she's going to fold like a deck of cards. I think Kupets and McCool will be our girls in the AA and Kupets strikes me as fairly laidback.
 
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eliza88

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 6, 2003
I may be incorrect, but I believe the prelims seed finals for the teams, AA, and individual apparatus finals. If you have a poor team with one stellar athlete the team wouldn't make it to the finals, therefore for there would be only one opportunity for this athlete to "make their case" for the finals (AA and indiv. apparatus). I am not sure if the prelims are a one or two day event where the totals are combined for final rounds. I know for the AA and the apparatus finals the slate is clean and all scores start again. I am not sure about team finals--do scores from prelims get counted?

eliza88
 

RealtorGal

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 27, 2003
I don't see Tasha making the Olympic team except for MAYBE as an alternate. Just a feeling. She looks very nervous--yes, I know that it's a nerve-wracking situation--but she looks much more nervous than the other top ladies. If she's nervous now, what will happen in Athens?
 

soogar

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2003
I think what made Tasha nervous were the low scores for her routines which put her on the bubble. I think that the hard part for Tasha is getting on the team. Once she's on the team, I think the battle is over for her and she can just concentrate on her programs.
 

A.H.Black

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 1, 2004
This is the week for the "up the medal count" trials.

Swimming starts Tomorrow and will be broadcast Saturday and Sunday and next weekend. The main results site is here

http://www.usaswimming.org/USASWeb/...=533&ItemId=411

There are lots of article links here -

http://news.google.com/news?ie=utf8...3015544,00.html
http://news.google.com/news?ie=utf8...9000153551.html
http://news.google.com/news?ie=utf8...sp?id=29656

Track and Field starts on Friday and runs through next weekend. There are live broadcasts every day for that one. Get ready to be very tired of the "Did Marion Jones take illegal substances" story.

The main link is here -

http://www.usatf.org/events/2004/OlympicTrials-TF/

Finally - someone was asking about the NBC schedule. It isn't complete but here is a basic time grid. I found it helpful.

http://www.nbcolympics.com/tvlistin...759/detail.html
 
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