Results 1 to 15 of 45

Thread: MK and the 3flip

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Crazy Armchair Fan/Resident Nerd
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    San Antonio, TX
    Posts
    361

    MK and the 3flip

    OK, while my laptop is currently being repaired, I've been re-stocking my figure skating video collection on the home computer. One of the videos I managed to find from www.cruelladekwan.com (a great site, if you haven't been there yet) was MK's LP from the '98 Olys, which I remember from watching it on TV was flawless. Watching it again, I noticed she had a deep knee landing on the 3flip, which is prolly what kept her from winning gold against an otherwise flawless Tara Lipinski

    This immediately got me thinking about MK's LP from the '02 Olys, where all she basically had to do was skate cleanly to win the gold, but she ended up falling. The jump she fell on? Again, a 3flip

    So, what is it w/ the 3flip for MK? It seems like, no matter how relaxed she seems to be, the 3flip is her stumbling block in the Olys. It seems like just a psychological thing, b/c most of the time, the 3flip is one of her better jumps (look at her LP at the 2004 Nats).

    So what is one to make of this?

  2. #2
    Master Procrastinator
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Michigan, USA!
    Posts
    918
    From what I remember, Michelle had trouble with the 3flip all season leading up to SLC. There was talk on the boards that had she had a coach, this could have been fixed.

  3. #3
    Custom Title Ogre Mage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    493
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt
    OK, while my laptop is currently being repaired, I've been re-stocking my figure skating video collection on the home computer. One of the videos I managed to find from www.cruelladekwan.com (a great site, if you haven't been there yet) was MK's LP from the '98 Olys, which I remember from watching it on TV was flawless. Watching it again, I noticed she had a deep knee landing on the 3flip, which is prolly what kept her from winning gold against an otherwise flawless Tara Lipinski
    Actually what mainly kept Michelle from beating Tara in '98 was a lack of a 3/3. She had to take her 3toe/3toe out of her program because of her foot injury. With it, she would have beat Tara hands down. Actually I thought Michelle should have won in '98, even without the 3/3. Her skating was far superior to Lipinski's. She lost fair and square in '02, though.
    Last edited by Ogre Mage; 07-22-2004 at 09:55 PM.

  4. #4
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    1,926
    Although Michelle's 3flip in her 98 Oly LP was not picture perfect, it was a clean, landed jump. Iin 2002 it was another story. The lack of 3-3 certainly hurt her in 98 against Tara's 3loop-3loop combo. However, Tara's jump technique and artistry were no match for Michelle. IMO the reason MK lost was the skating order.

  5. #5
    SkateFan4Life
    Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01
    Although Michelle's 3flip in her 98 Oly LP was not picture perfect, it was a clean, landed jump. Iin 2002 it was another story. The lack of 3-3 certainly hurt her in 98 against Tara's 3loop-3loop combo. However, Tara's jump technique and artistry were no match for Michelle. IMO the reason MK lost was the skating order.
    I watched my videotapes from the 1998 and 2002 Olympics. Michelle's triple flip from Nagano was landed a bit roughly, but otherwise, she skated a clean long program. She looked a little tight and tentative, but she landed all of her triples, and her choreography was beautiful. Tara Lipinski was no match to Michelle, artistically, but she (Tara) landed a great triple loop/triple loop combination, and she finished her program with another triple combination. She won on the basis of higher technical content.

    HOWEVER, I agree with Vash01 that had Michelle skated after Tara at Nagano, the result might have been different. The judges might still have awarded Michelle 5.8s instead of those 5.7s for technical, and, perhaps she would have received a solid string of 5.9s for presentation. Lipinski had greatly improved her artistry, but she was an ingenue, compared to Kwan.

    Salt Lake was another story. Michelle fell on her triple flip, and that pretty much sealed her fate. Had she landed a triple toe/triple toe, perhaps she would have managed to finish second in the long program, ahead of Slutskaya, and that would have won Michelle the gold medal. On the other hand, Michelle skated before Slutskaya, so the judges were probably saving marks to award to Irina.
    Remember that three of the judges gave Slutskaya 5.9s for technical? How in blazes did that happen? Irina landed her triple flip way forward, she made several other mistakes, and she did not land a triple/triple. Biased judging!

  6. #6
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    uk
    Posts
    286
    If they skated as they did but Michelle skated after Tara by about 3 to 4 slots, I think Michelle would have got a slew of 6.0's for presentation. ITA about the skate order thing.

    I'm not even going there over 2002 - way too painful still

  7. #7
    Arm Chair Skate Fan show 42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    San Joaquin Valley, Ca.
    Posts
    3,206
    This is why one must look at an athlete's "body of work" and not an individual skating event, even though it is the Olympics. If placement in skating and biased juding can determine the gold medal, what does it say? Michelle and Irina are wonderful skaters with resumes to die for........that should be enough......42

  8. #8
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    20,185
    There was no problem in last season's Nats or in Dortmund. The flip went well and that could be for Arutunian.
    I prefer her lutz. When she doesn't do it correctly (once in awhile) she goes from the outside edge to the flat, which is better than going from an outside edge to an inside edge which imo, is a flip. It may be why her 'flutz' is from the flat and not from the problem flip edge like other skaters' flutzes especially the Americans.

    Joe

  9. #9
    http://p068.ezboard.com/bstrawberrycanyonfsc
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Scripps Ranch- A suburb of San Diego
    Posts
    817
    Normally, her problem jump is the loop, and not the flip. I guess you're right- it's her stumbling block in the Oly's.

    During dance auditions, I always have trouble doing double pirouettes on my left foot...but during rehearsals, they're always there.

    hmmm

  10. #10
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    1,213
    Yeah, Michelle's problem jump has always been the triple loop. She has consistently struggled with this jump for many, many years now. I'm glad she has chosen to put it as the first triple....I think that has proven to be a good strategy for her over the years. As for the flip, as Thisthingcalledlove pointed out...I think she just happened to make mistakes on the triple flip in her Olympic appearances. Generally, the triple flip is a strong jump for Michelle and I also think it is one of her best.

  11. #11
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    uk
    Posts
    286
    I do believe that a lack of a coach didn't help her with the flip in '02. She was clearly having a timing problem and placement of the toepick which she survived in the sp - barely but became her undoing in the long. However I think her jumps have improved imeasurably since joining Aruturian. The inconsistency on the lutz is a correction of her sometimes flutz I think which I'm sure will be sorted by next season. I still worry about her loop though. It always looks precarious to me :(

  12. #12
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Murrysville, PA
    Posts
    219
    In 02 her problems seem to come with the flip. In 03, she was spot on with all her jumps. In 04 she seemed concerned with the loop but it was the lutz she doubled or fell on.

    I hope in 05 and 06 she has a repeat of 03. All jumps nailed secure and steady.

    Ladybug

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •