View Poll Results: Should Paul Hamm Relinquish the AA Gold Medal?

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  • YES, he should give it up even if it's not "official."

    17 12.06%
  • NO, it's his. He won it fair & square.

    111 78.72%
  • He should wait and see what transpires over the next few days as officials sort out the mess.

    9 6.38%
  • I don't know enough to render an opinion.

    4 2.84%
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Thread: Should Paul Hamm Relinquish the AA Gold Medal?

  1. #31
    Keeper of Michelle's Nose berthes ghost's Avatar
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    This is not a probelm with just the North American media. The Brittish talk about it all the time: how they build up their athletes just to tear them down later. The worst example is probably Tim Hennman. The guy is good, but not great. Why some of the papers insist on hyping him up to win Wimbolden every year is beyond most people, and why they demonize him when he doesn't is just cruel. Could you imagine if the US press hyped up Kyoko Ina to win worlds every year, and when she merely finished in the top 6 where most experts would have predicted, headlines call her sad and a loser? Now they are saying that perhaps why the Britts seem so awful is unrealistic expectations. If you're a celebrity in your own country, but only average worldwide, It's potentialy harder to motivate to improve.

  2. #32
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Well, I see by this morning's paper that the U.S. Gymnastics Federation filed a protest over the start value given to the American competitor in the hoop in rhythmic gymnastics. She finished 18th despite having decent scores in the other two judging components, artistic value and execution.

    I can't wait to see the CoP in action in Torino!

    Mathman

  3. #33
    Sal-Kowabunga!
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    I still stand by my original vote. Paul won that night and should keep the medal.

    That said, the reason sports have federations and rules is because everyone wants the impossible -- "fair." That is also why they have rules and are continually changing them. The attempt is made to be fair but there will always be some who find fault. That is their right. They have feelings, but those feelings are best put into compromise and changing the rules so they are more fair.

    After all, as the baseball fan knows, there's always next year!

  4. #34
    Custom Title heyang's Avatar
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    My sympathies are with Paul Hamm. This poor guy just wanted to compete at Oly's and represent his country in an admirable way. He was not the cause of the judging errors, but he's the one paying the price. His Olympic experience has been tarnished by FIG. I'm sure the hoopla had a lot of impact to his decision to not stay for the remainder of the Olympics.

    As Tim Dagget explained, the Korean Federation should have protested immediately. By not doing so, they opened up all the routines for re-examination. If it hadn't been for the late protest, no one would have re-watched the Korean's parallel bar routine and noticed the extra illegal hand hold. Some people are calling this nitpicking, but that's what happened. Even in football, the play must be reviewed immediately - not 2 plays later.

    FIG's asking Paul to giveaway his medal is outrageous. They are trying to cast blame upon Paul to cover their own mistakes. Paul has said all along that he would abide by FIG's DECISION and FIG has refused to take the lead to fix this mess. I'm glad that the US Gymnastics Federation has finally emphasized their support of Paul.

    I appreciated the crowd's support for Naumov and the remaining high bar participants. Paul Hamm handled the situation with such grace. The delay could have totally rattled him, but he showed his competitiveness once again by delivering another great high bar routine. Some people may question how Naumov's 5 release routine could be beaten by Paul's 3 - they need to realize that the hand work on the bar is just as important in gymnastics. You could say that hands and release moves in gymnastics are equivalent to edging and jumps in figure skating.

  5. #35
    Eville Eastern Bloc Poster
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    Now, why I'm not surprised about the result? :D

    Anke

    Alexei ... NEMOV! forever!!!

  6. #36
    On Edge Piel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Germanice
    Now, why I'm not surprised about the result? :D

    Anke

    Alexei ... NEMOV! forever!!!
    G.S. has always been a board that has been supportive of the athlete, so it isn't surprising that more posters would support the athlete in this case. BTW, supporting Hamm is in no way NOT supporting Yang, IMO.

  7. #37
    On the Ice LilyBerg's Avatar
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    I think it is really ridiculous that Paul has been asked to give away his gold medal. Why would he do something like that? It's not his job to clean up other people's mess. He won fairly and it's a shame that people are trying to put the blame on him. What did he do other than compete his best?

  8. #38
    ~ Figure Skating Is My Passion ~ Ladskater's Avatar
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    Who would want to keep a gold medal that they won through a judging error? In the figure skating "fiasco" as someone called it - that was an obvious dishonest judging manipulation. This was different.

    A few years ago a Canadian synchro swimmer - Sylvie Frechette was denied the gold medal by a judging error. The judge had incorrectly entered her mark in the electronic scoring system. After a formal inquiry, Sylvie was finally awarded the gold medal

    Here is the story:

    http://www.thememoryproject.com/hero...m?ID=Frechette

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ladskater
    Who would want to keep a gold medal that they won through a judging error? In the figure skating "fiasco" as someone called it - that was an obvious dishonest judging manipulation. This was different.
    In the Hamm case, the A judges entered the wrong start value for Yang's PBar routine. When Yang's PBar score was posted, the SV was posted as well, and the Korean coaches SAW that it was wrong, yet they did not protest it immediately, before the rotation ended, according to the rules (in the preliminary competition, the same coaches had initiated protests over wrong SVs for other gymnasts, so they certainly knew what had to be done to correct it).

    Going into the last rotation, the Hbar, Yang and Hamm were the last two gymnasts to perform. At that point, Yang was far enough ahead of Hamm (who'd fallen on his PHorse dismount) that a score equivalent to what Yang got in the preliminaries would assure Yang of gold. But Yang unexpectedly got a low 9.475 on his Hbar, and Paul Hamm got a 9.873, putting Hamm in first and Yang in 3rd. It was only then, when the competition was over, that the Korean coaches protested the Pbar SV.

    Hamm truly DID win the AA gold medal, because the Korean coaches had allowed the Pbar SV to stand instead of protesting it before that rotation ended, as required by the FIG rules. The judges made a mistake of submission, and the coaches made a mistake of omission. Hamm did his job as a gymnast and fairly won the competition.

    From recent reports, apparently the Korean coaches are taking the protest to CAS and the case will be heard in September. Although the FIG is standing firm on not changing the results, they did send an infamous letter to Paul Hamm, routed through the USOC, urging him to 'do the right thing' and surrender his gold medal. In effect, FIG had the gall to ask Hamm to make restitution for the mistakes of the FIG judges, compounded by the inaction of the Korean coaches. The USOC, the IOC and US Gymnastics have condemned FIG's letter and have now backed off their willingness to allow two gold medals (which the FIG had immediately dismissed as a solution).

    Paul Hamm should keep his gold medal. He did nothing wrong.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman
    Well, I see by this morning's paper that the U.S. Gymnastics Federation filed a protest over the start value given to the American competitor in the hoop in rhythmic gymnastics. She finished 18th despite having decent scores in the other two judging components, artistic value and execution.

    I can't wait to see the CoP in action in Torino!

    Mathman


    The US are protesting a score on a sport they have never been good at that is way more ridiculous than the hamm debacle. The guy has already been punished no wheaties box cover for him. The Gymnastics Federation supports him but because of the scandal he is not going to cash on that gold medal like carly patterson and others talk about hypocrisy.

  11. #41
    On Edge Piel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by curious
    The US are protesting a score on a sport they have never been good at that is way more ridiculous than the hamm debacle. The guy has already been punished no wheaties box cover for him. The Gymnastics Federation supports him but because of the scandal he is not going to cash on that gold medal like carly patterson and others talk about hypocrisy.
    Hmm...just because past athletes in the sport from the U.S. didin't do well is no reason to think that we will never have Americans on the podium. IIRC this girl's technical score on the hoop was quite a bit lower than her other scores for no apparent reason. IMO that is when protests should be filed. Why was this score so low? An honest judge should have no problem defending their scores.

    What if the Chinese had taken this attitude with pairs?

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ladskater
    Who would want to keep a gold medal that they won through a judging error? In the figure skating "fiasco" as someone called it - that was an obvious dishonest judging manipulation. This was different.

    A few years ago a Canadian synchro swimmer - Sylvie Frechette was denied the gold medal by a judging error. The judge had incorrectly entered her mark in the electronic scoring system. After a formal inquiry, Sylvie was finally awarded the gold medal
    What happened to the other Gold medal? Did the original winner got keep her Gold?

  13. #43
    Rinkside
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    NOundefined

  14. #44
    Go NJ Devils
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    Quote Originally Posted by mzheng
    What happened to the other Gold medal? Did the original winner got keep her Gold?
    A duplicate gold was awarded to Frechette. Babb-Sprague kept her gold medal.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by hockeyfan228
    A duplicate gold was awarded to Frechette. Babb-Sprague kept her gold medal.
    It was between US and Canada, right? I hope they will do the same with this AA Gold. The FIG should not send Paul that stupid letter. What's done is done, it was a judge mistake not Paul's. The competetion is over and by your own rule the result cann't be changed. But justise can be done by rewarding a second Gold. And there was a precedence to follow like this.

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